stvdv
Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Can you go to heaven after you die a nonbeliever?
NO
You only go to Heaven when you "live", not when you die or when you are dead
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Can you go to heaven after you die a nonbeliever?
- Thread starter Frank Goad
- Start date
NO
You only go to Heaven when you "live", not when you die or when you are dead
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
You know, Stvdv, I am Brahman, I own the universe and all heavens and hells in it. I am 'anasakta', not attached to anything, I neither love nor hate. 
"na me dveşarāgau na me lobhamohau, mado naiva me naiva mātsaryabhāvaḥ;
na dharmo na cārtho na kāmo na mokşaḥ, cidānandarūpaḥ śivo'ham śivo'ham."
Atma Shatkam - Wikipedia, Verse 3
I have no hatred or dislike, nor affiliation or liking, nor greed, nor delusion, nor pride or haughtiness, nor feelings of envy or jealousy. I have no duty (dharma), nor any money (artha), nor any desire (kāma), nor even liberation (mokṣa). I am the form of that eternal knowledge and auspiciousness.
"na me dveşarāgau na me lobhamohau, mado naiva me naiva mātsaryabhāvaḥ;
na dharmo na cārtho na kāmo na mokşaḥ, cidānandarūpaḥ śivo'ham śivo'ham."
Atma Shatkam - Wikipedia, Verse 3
I have no hatred or dislike, nor affiliation or liking, nor greed, nor delusion, nor pride or haughtiness, nor feelings of envy or jealousy. I have no duty (dharma), nor any money (artha), nor any desire (kāma), nor even liberation (mokṣa). I am the form of that eternal knowledge and auspiciousness.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
Simple, hold the tail of the Mother Cow when you are crossing the river to heaven and you are through. Sage Gautama did that. Alakshmi did not do that.Can you go to heaven after you die a nonbeliever?
God knows whether or not Heaven is real, and who/how get there.
stvdv
Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Is "Alakshmi" the Goddess for Atheists and "Lakshmi" the Goddess for Theists?Simple, hold the tail of the Mother Cow when you are crossing the river to heaven and you are through. Sage Gautama did that. Alakshmi did not do that.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
Obviously, the answer is going to differ based on who you ask. My answer is "yes," you can and almost certainly will go to Heaven. Hebrews 9:27 speaks of a judgment after death, but it is not the "last judgment." Things can change between the initial judgment and the final one.
lostwanderingsoul
Well-Known Member
I am sure if I told you anything, you would say the words mean something different.
BilliardsBall
Veteran Member
Biblically speaking, in both testaments:
Saint: Trusts God, not themselves, for salvation
Ain't: Trusts themselves, not God, for salvation
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
You either will or you won't, and you have no control over that.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
And I am sure if I told you anything, you would say the words mean something different.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
Alakshmi is the elder sister of Mother Lakshmi in Hindu mythology but she is exact opposite of Mother Lakshmi, inauspicious, prone to be angry, etc. She brings unhappiness to family and therefore people worship her so that she does not become angry. Since she is elder, she is known as 'Jyeshtha'. Atheistsw have no Goddesses.Simple, hold the tail of the Mother Cow when you are crossing the river to heaven and you are through. Sage Gautama did that. Alakshmi did not do that.
Alakshmi - Wikipedia
That is only your opinion.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
So you think you have control over whether you will or you won't?
If there is an afterlife how do you think you will be able to opt out?
You won't be able to kill yourself because the soul is eternal.
That is my belief, but if I am wrong, may you rest in peace.
Happy to meet another fellow human being that reached that "place".
My friend, you're right, now I know but I can't "get back" to it at all, now I feel 1000 times more distant from my own Self than I ever felt in my entire live... do you have a Master? I have no one, I did everything on my own.. I did many experiments to see what works and what does not work. This NDE like experience came out of nowhere, I was not expecting it at all, maybe I really died in my sleep and this is how I got to that "place", I say "place", the thing is that it is here, I know it, I just know.. but I can't live it...
I don't think you are lazy, I think you do not really want to move that fast, you already know what's there.. at the end.
DKH
Member
The idea about going to heaven or hell hinge on the belief in the immortal soul. Where, the immoral soul would need to go somewhere when the body dies. This doctrine was popularized by the ancient Greek philosopher, Plato. However, it is not a biblical concept…Also, (IMO) there was one human being who did go into the heavens (after his resurrection): the Christ/Son of God.
If you study the biblical account, He went in the helish places and beyond all heavens, not just in heavens, beyond all of them. Many say Christ was just the Son of God but can the Son of God go beyond the heavens where God has His resting place? It makes no sense, clearly, there is something more. To me, the Christ was the very manifestation of our Maker in the material world, in a visible way. The fact that He went there to fill all things is another interesting topic.
Ephesians 4:10
He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
As a Baha'i, that is exactly what I believe, that Christ was a Manifestation of God, God appearing in a visible way.
What a Manifestation of God actually is is a whole different topic.
I think it depends on is person righteous or not, because:
These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Mat. 25:46
For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 6:23
And person can be counted righteous for example by this:
For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without the law. As many as have sinned under the law will be judged by the law. For it isn't the hearers of the law who are righteous before God, but the doers of the law will be justified (for when Gentiles who don't have the law do by nature the things of the law, these, not having the law, are a law to themselves, in that they show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience testifying with them, and their thoughts among themselves accusing or else excusing them) in the day when God will judge the secrets of men, according to my gospel, by Jesus Christ.
Romans 2:12-16
But, I don’t think righteous person would say “God does not exist”.
And also, believing that God exists does not necessarily mean person is also righteous, for example because:
You believe that God is one. You do well. The demons also believe, and shudder.
James 2:19
Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter into the Kingdom of Heaven; but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.
Matt. 7:21
As a Baha'i, that is exactly what I believe, that Christ was a Manifestation of God, God appearing in a visible way.
What a Manifestation of God actually is is a whole different topic.
We agree on many things my friend. Yes, it is. I am only 25, spent the last 9 years trying to make sense of the true nature of things, I've always been a seeker but in these last years I kinda became obsessed with the truth, because to me, as I said, the truth means absolute freedom...
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
I agree that the truth is the most important thing to pursue in this life. I believe I found it when I was 17, but after that and for most of my life I took it for-granted and lost my way, but I do not blame myself because there were many reasons I had to do what I did. But I will never take it for-granted anymore.
You are so young. When I was your age I was just getting out of my first graduate program and going for my first real job. So much has happened since then and I am at a completely different place in my life, so I take God and my religion much more seriously.