• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Moses said, Unto him ye shall hearken

Ehav4Ever

Ehav4Ever

Well-Known Member
Redemptionsong said:
I can read the English translations, concordances and dictionaries as well as any other. In my opinion, this is not a matter of having the original language but having the original meaning.
Click to expand...

Thus, as I have mentioned before the standard that you have is different then the one we Jews were given from Hashem at Mount Sinai. I am not criticizing you for having a different standard I am pointing it out. That is why, as I stated about the Acts 2:1-11 question I presented, the answer that I was given does not meet the Torah requirement. Which is fine for you, but not for me as a Jew.

So, to be honest a discussion about English translations is outside of the realm of I am required to do as a Jew. I did not enter this thread to change your views or opinions, but to answer the question of "what do the Jews hold by." As was stated earlier you have a received Jewish answer to your original questions, and then sum. So I will leave this thread now. Cheers.
 
Last edited:
YoursTrue

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Ehav4Ever said:
That would probably not be wise. That list, based on the standards from Hashem to the people of Israel/Jews, has already been posted earlier in this thread at least two to three times.

There is a easier resolution.
  1. Christians claim that Jesus meets their standards for what the beleive in.
  2. We Jews have a different of standards, from Hashem, and also ways of checking if someone meets them, also from Hashem. To date no one has met them in full, as
Click to expand...
OK, in reference to that, I was just reading Exodus chapter 19, and thought of you and those perhaps versed in the Law. How do you feel about the following in Exodus:
"Now if you will indeed obey My voice and keep My covenant, you will be My treasured possession out of all the nations--for the whole earth is Mine. 6And unto Me you shall be a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.’ These are the words that you are to speak to the Israelites.” (Exodus 19:5,6)
 
Rival

Rival

se Dex me saut.
Staff member
Premium Member
Redemptionsong said:
The One that rode humbly into Jerusalem on a colt to shouts of 'Blessed be the King that cometh in the name of the Lord: peace in heaven and glory in the highest'.
Click to expand...
And then later the same Jerusalem crowd is apparently shouting 'CRUCIFY HIM! CRUCIFY HIM!'

What happened?
 
Redemptionsong

Redemptionsong

Well-Known Member
Rival said:
And then later on the same Jerusalem crowd is apparently shouting 'CRUCIFY HIM! CRUCIFY HIM!'

What happened?
Click to expand...

I don't think it was the same crowd. There were those who followed, mainly from Galilee, and those who opposed. The scripture states, 'Awake , O sword, against my shepherd, and against the man that is my fellow, saith the LORD of hosts: smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered: and I will turn my hand upon the little ones' [Zechariah 13:7]
 
Redemptionsong

Redemptionsong

Well-Known Member
Ehav4Ever said:
Thus, as I have mentioned before the standard that you have is different then the one we Jews were given from Hashem at Mount Sinai. I am not criticizing you for having a different I am pointing it. That is why, as I stated about the Acts 2:1-11 question I presented, the answer that I was given does not meet the Torah requirement. Which is fine for you, but not for me as a Jew.

So, to be honest a discussion about English translations is outside of the realm of I am required to do as a Jew. I did not enter this thread to change your views or opinions, but to answer the question of "what do the Jews hold by." As was stated earlier you have a received Jewish answer to your original questions, and then sum. So I will leave this thread now. Cheers.
Click to expand...

Ok. All the best.
 
Rival

Rival

se Dex me saut.
Staff member
Premium Member
Redemptionsong said:
I don't think it was the same crowd. There were those who followed, mainly from Galilee, and those who opposed. The scripture states, 'Awake , O sword, against my shepherd, and against the man that is my fellow, saith the LORD of hosts: smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered: and I will turn my hand upon the little ones' [Zechariah 13:7]
Click to expand...
So where are those ones who support him at this time?
 
YoursTrue

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
IndigoChild5559 said:
For example, the messiah is to usher in an era of worldwide peace.
He is to bring all the Jews back to the Land.
He is to be David, aka rule from Jerusalem.
Click to expand...
Allow me to say that many Jews do not want to go back to Israel. An era of worldwide peace will not happen as long as there are crooked politicians and business leaders, liars and cheat of any background. Furthermore, encroaching on others' property without consent leads to war, hostility and rather bad feelings.
 
YoursTrue

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Ehav4Ever said:
Actually, we Jews don't have any problems doing okay. ;)

There is no requirement, from the Hebrew Tanakh, for any future king who descends from David to be born in or come from Beith Lehhem. Someone misinformed you. Again, the standards you bringing up are specific to Christians and the Greek texts and translations you guys use and not from the Hebrew text of the Tanakh.
Click to expand...
So sickness, sorrow and death is not a problem for Jews?
 
YoursTrue

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Redemptionsong said:
If we're referring to the prophecies of the second coming, the coming of the King of Kings, then l'm in full agreement that there are still outstanding prophecies. But there's a distinction between the suffering servant, Messiah son of Joseph, and the Messiah son of David.

To a Christian the two Messiahs are one and the same Jesus, come twice.

How do you equate Zechariah 9:9 with the coming of the Messiah, son of David?

And what credentials will the Jewish son of David possess, given that the genealogies have now been destroyed?
Click to expand...
That's a question. I have someone in the family who claimed to be a Kohen (of the priestly class), ascertained by his family. No papers. No nothing.
 
YoursTrue

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Ehav4Ever said:
If you are asking what Jews say will happen in the future, here goes.
  1. There was a time where Jews were not allowed to live in or go to Israel. That sitaution has changed.
  2. There was a time where a large number of Jewish communities were held hostage in some unfriend host countries, in some cases not allowed to leave even in the face of an oncoming progroms. That situation has dramatically changed.
  3. There was a time when a large number of Spainish/Portuguese Jews were forced to covert to Christianity or were tortured or killing by the inquisitions. That situation has changed and there are a number of descendants of coverted Jews who are returning to the Torah and the Jewish community.
  4. Going forward - there has been a big push by various Torah based Jewish leaders to convince secular or converted Jews to return to Torath Mosheh. Rabbis and organization such Rabbi Amnon Ytzhaq of Shofar, Rabbi Zamir of Hitdabroot, Aish HaTorah, Mechon Meir, OutReach Judaism, Jews for Judaism, etc. have been very successful in this regard.
  5. There are positions held by the Sages of Israel, from before the last 800 years or more, that when there are a enough Jews actually living in Israel and when Israeli Jews start to return to the Torah more and more Hashem will strengthen an Israeli Jew of Davidic descent, that can be proven by a Mosaic Court, who is strong/wise/an expert in the Torah and halakha (Jewish Law) and he will become a strong leader able to unite Jews in Israel under the Torah and halakha.
  6. There will be a Mosaic court of 71 in Israel that will be reformed and lead the halakhic process of the Torah.
  7. This same Israeli Jewish leader will cause Jews to return to the land of Israel. He will cause the rebuilding of the Temple in Jerusalem.
  8. Israel, from top to bottom, will be seen as keeping the mitzvoth of the Torah as it was given at Mount Sinai and then a conflict called (גוג ומגוג).
  9. When the conflict is settled and the Torah based kingdom is still standing the world knows that Hashem is Hashem, and the reality of what the Torah says about Hashem, world peace. Nations able to deal with each other in a more truthful manner and so on.
The rest is just commentary.
Click to expand...
Have you ever considered that what is fleshly Israel (i.e. that of religious custom of the circumcision of the flesh) may not be the real Israel, but that it could be rather the circumcision of the heart. Now what that is, is something each one must know by being drawn to the true God.
 
YoursTrue

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Ehav4Ever said:
Thus, as I have mentioned before the standard that you have is different then the one we Jews were given from Hashem at Mount Sinai. I am not criticizing you for having a different standard I am pointing it out. That is why, as I stated about the Acts 2:1-11 question I presented, the answer that I was given does not meet the Torah requirement. Which is fine for you, but not for me as a Jew.

So, to be honest a discussion about English translations is outside of the realm of I am required to do as a Jew. I did not enter this thread to change your views or opinions, but to answer the question of "what do the Jews hold by." As was stated earlier you have a received Jewish answer to your original questions, and then sum. So I will leave this thread now. Cheers.
Click to expand...
I realize you have a different viewpoint of following the law of Moses, but in any and all cases, every year is the Atonement Day now, is it not?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top