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Problems vs. Solutions and criticizing (e.g.), BLM

9-10ths_Penguin

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
icehorse said:
It's not surprising that there are also good conversations happening. That doesn't mean that the situation I'm describing isn't a problem. No one ever said that this was a 100% of the time situation ;)
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Your focus on this particular "problem" rather than, oh... systemic racism suggests to me that the real issue here isn't that BLM isn't interested in your good ideas as much as it is that you maybe aren't actually an ally to the movement and your ideas wouldn't actually help it.

Just a gut feeling.
 
C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
icehorse said:
This isn't personal, it's societal. So yes, I think the best ideas should be the ones we use.
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You're beating your head against a concrete wall dude. You're up against the USA culture of victimhood, violence, and entitlement. Nothing you say will matter, unless you affirm that culture, because you're Wipepo.

Trust me, this is the voice of experience. It wasn't much different when gay men insisted on their right to dysfunctional behavior and blamed the problems they had on the government or their parents or "society" or something. Back in the 80s gay men would complain bitterly about how the government doesn't fix the HIV problem, while they're on their way to get drunk at a hookup bar and screw around with total strangers.

You aren't going to win this one. If you're lucky and polite you'll be dismissed. If not, you'll be attacked. You will not change anything.
Tom
 
icehorse

icehorse

......unaffiliated...... anti-dogmatist
Premium Member
columbus said:
You're beating your head against a concrete wall dude. You're up against the USA culture of victimhood, violence, and entitlement. Nothing you say will matter, unless you affirm that culture, because you're Wipepo.
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I sincerely appreciate this post! The OP is just my latest whack at trying to expose a few of the bad ideas in this culture.
 
C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
icehorse said:
I sincerely appreciate this post! The OP is just my latest whack at trying to expose a few of the bad ideas in this culture.
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It's not just BLM.
Christians now consider themselves victims because they can't persecute like they could in the good old days.

White men now have to compete for jobs with Hispanics, so they're victims.

Really, the list of victims in this country is endless. Even billionaire Presidents like Trump claim to be victims of the media!

The USA is no longer the land of the free and the home of the brave. It's the land of the entitled and the home of the victims.
Tom
 
Tambourine

Tambourine

Well-Known Member
icehorse said:
Let me know when you start actually reading posts :)
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As soon as you start reading the posts you enthusiastically agree with.
columbus said:
You're beating your head against a concrete wall dude. You're up against the USA culture of victimhood, violence, and entitlement. Nothing you say will matter, unless you affirm that culture, because you're Wipepo.

Trust me, this is the voice of experience. It wasn't much different when gay men insisted on their right to dysfunctional behavior and blamed the problems they had on the government or their parents or "society" or something. Back in the 80s gay men would complain bitterly about how the government doesn't fix the HIV problem, while they're on their way to get drunk at a hookup bar and screw around with total strangers.

You aren't going to win this one. If you're lucky and polite you'll be dismissed. If not, you'll be attacked. You will not change anything.
Tom
Click to expand...

icehorse said:
I sincerely appreciate this post! The OP is just my latest whack at trying to expose a few of the bad ideas in this culture.
Click to expand...
 
icehorse

icehorse

......unaffiliated...... anti-dogmatist
Premium Member
Tambourine said:
How would I notice that? Do you only quote my posts when you agree with everything I wrote?
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I try to focus on ideas. I often highlight parts of a post that I agree with or disagree with. I think that's pretty standard practice.
 
icehorse

icehorse

......unaffiliated...... anti-dogmatist
Premium Member
9-10ths_Penguin said:
Your focus on this particular "problem" rather than, oh... systemic racism suggests to me that the real issue here isn't that BLM isn't interested in your good ideas as much as it is that you maybe aren't actually an ally to the movement and your ideas wouldn't actually help it.

Just a gut feeling.
Click to expand...

What I'm focusing on is the bigger issue of denying expertise. This issue cuts across all other issues, and weakens our ability to solve problems across the board.
 
Tambourine

Tambourine

Well-Known Member
icehorse said:
I try to focus on ideas. I often highlight parts of a post that I agree with or disagree with. I think that's pretty standard practice.
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That does not tell me whether you agree or disagree with the unquoted parts.

icehorse said:
What I'm focusing on is the bigger issue of denying expertise. This issue cuts across all other issues, and weakens our ability to solve problems across the board.
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Whose expertise is being denied, and by whom?
 
icehorse

icehorse

......unaffiliated...... anti-dogmatist
Premium Member
Tambourine said:
How would I notice that? Do you only quote my posts when you agree with everything I wrote?
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In general I reply to parts of posts. Yours and everyone else's. You can tell this because the post itself shows what part I'm responding to. Again, I think my approach is pretty standard.
 
icehorse

icehorse

......unaffiliated...... anti-dogmatist
Premium Member
Tambourine said:
That does not tell me whether you agree or disagree with the unquoted parts.
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It can go either way, like in all discussions.

Tambourine said:
Whose expertise is being denied, and by whom?
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There are many related sources, but one common originating influence is the idea of "intersectionality theory" (IT). IT can raise its head across many domains, and one of ITs ideas is that IT should supersede expertise in all of those domains.
 
Gandalf

Gandalf

Horn Tooter
I despised BLM and all such movements without cause or objectivity and lead to mob rule. I also do not support the ethics or the base cause of BLM either which is shallow, vague and misleading and to some degree a flat out lie.

Not all Africans want to see whites succumb to the tyranny we create. BLM is at its core a racist movement by African Americans, I have so many family who support it and the only thing it did is make them slightly less racists against whites. Blacks in the US succumb to this irrational retaliatory racism and it is extremely negative in its consequences.
I have known so many blacks who claim racism for dubious reasons only to find out it was another minority who wrong them or they perceived to be wronged. The infamous victimhood mentality has been apart of our culture for much longer than we thought. We are an imperialist nation after all and act like China is evil.
 
C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
9-10ths_Penguin said:
So you think that POC lack expertise to deal with the issue of racial injustice?
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This is a remarkably racist post, IMHO.

You're strongly implying that if a white person has an idea to improve society they are dismissing everything from POC. Apparently you believe that white people are inherently immoral racists unless they agree with you.
Tom
 
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