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Do you agree with AOC that cutting a billion dollars form NYC police is just not enough?

Notanumber

A Free Man
You think I should offer up some so you can pooh-pooh them?
Then you could offer up some conservatives and I can pooh-pooh them?

Not a very productive game. My meaning was merely that if you were earnestly seeking 'reasonable democrats' and your list didn't even include a democrat, there might be some problems with how you're searching.
A more productive game would be for me to try and find a reasonable Republican, and you to find a reasonable Dem. If neither of us are able to, there's really not much point in conversing...we're too entrenched in partisan politics.

Reasonable Democrats are like hen’s teeth.
 

Notanumber

A Free Man
The leader of the UK’s opposition party jumped on the BLM bandwagon when he was photographed taking the knee.

Sir Keir Starmer takes a knee in support of Black Lives Matter movement

He has now backtracked having seen reason calling it a moment.

Starmer criticised by BLM for dismissing calls to defund the police



2 Comments

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JoeSommerlad8 hours ago

If you read the small print you will find a lot more nonsense, as you call it Sir Keir, and that is why so many of the celebs are backpedaling on their support for BLM now.

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City Guy1 day ago

Welcome to the real world Keir appeasing them will offer you no political advantage They are just interested in bringing down the whole country That includes all political parties

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HuffPost is now a part of Verizon Media
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.

lewisnotmiller

Grand Hat
Staff member
Premium Member

Notanumber

A Free Man
A chance, yes, but I wouldn't put my money on her. Still...the question wasn't 'reasonable democrat with a good chance of becoming VP'.

The point is, is it possible for a reasonable Democrat to succeed in modern America?

This is a reasonable politician and so far, he has failed to succeed in the modern UK.

We can only hope that things are about to change for the better.

 

lewisnotmiller

Grand Hat
Staff member
Premium Member
The point is, is it possible for a reasonable Democrat to succeed in modern America?

This is a reasonable politician and so far, he has failed to succeed in the modern UK.

We can only hope that things are about to change for the better.


I wouldn't offer an opinion on British politicians, I'm not knowledgeable enough about them.

I will say this, though...I prefer pragmatic politicians over ideologues. Farage has long been sceptical of Europe, and I suspect how reasonable you see him depends on your take on UK alignment with Europe (both Brexit and before).

I personally think someone like Demings makes sense, because she has practical knowledge of whats involved in deconstructing and/or constructing a police force. That means her hands are not 'clean' enough for some. Bit that's kinda the point.

I also think she could appeal to the centrists on both sides of the spectrum. Giving disillusioned Republicans a credible alternative is better than offering up a left wing darling, in terms of strategy in my opinion.

Now, I'll admit, I'm Australian. We have mandatory voting here, so I never really factor in whether there reaches a point where Democrats will just decide not to vote. But if they do, they cede their right to complain about the election results in my book.
 

lewisnotmiller

Grand Hat
Staff member
Premium Member
I'm starting to like Biden. Just make sure she isn't a trained Marxist.

.... and from Orlando Florida as well as Police Chief.

No wonder the Marxist lead black lives matter hates her.

You can see the attraction for someone like me though...

(I'm probably left in US terms, but I'd think of myself as centre-left)
 
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Notanumber

A Free Man
I wouldn't offer an opinion on British politicians, I'm not knowledgeable enough about them.

I will say this, though...I prefer pragmatic politicians over ideologues. Farage has long been sceptical of Europe, and I suspect how reasonable you see him depends on your take on UK alignment with Europe (both Brexit and before).

I personally think someone like Demings makes sense, because she has practical knowledge of whats involved in deconstructing and/or constructing a police force. That means her hands are not 'clean' enough for some. Bit that's kinda the point.

I also think she could appeal to the centrists on both sides of the spectrum. Giving disillusioned Republicans a credible alternative is better than offering up a left wing darling, in terms of strategy in my opinion.

Now, I'll admit, I'm Australian. We have mandatory voting here, so I never really factor in whether there reaches a point where Democrats will just decide not to vote. But if they do, they cede their right to complain about the election results in my book.

Nigel would never encourage street violence to gain power.

It took him a quarter of a century to achieve a Brexit Referendum.

Votes do not seem to count in modern politics. Violence has a louder voice.

The Democrats have realised that democracy is not going to do it for them.

They are now in the last chance saloon.

“What the media also do not tell you is that America is the best place on the planet to be black, female, gay, trans or what have you. We have our problems and we need to address those. But our society and our systems are far from racist.”

 

lewisnotmiller

Grand Hat
Staff member
Premium Member
“What the media also do not tell you is that America is the best place on the planet to be black, female, gay, trans or what have you. We have our problems and we need to address those. But our society and our systems are far from racist.”

I'm not really home for American Exceptionalism.
Why do you see the US as a better place to be female than (say) Sweden?
 

Jayhawker Soule

-- untitled --
Premium Member
Crime rising. Police discouraged. Shut it down?
and who will protect the city? Batman?
It's really hard to know whether harangues such as this stem from raw dishonesty, rank stupidity, or intellectual laziness, but clearly someone has been spending far too much time in the Fox News reading room of the basket of deplorables. The Hill has a more sober report. AOC is right.
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
Now, I'll admit, I'm Australian. We have mandatory voting here, so I never really factor in whether there reaches a point where Democrats will just decide not to vote. But if they do, they cede their right to complain about the election results in my book.
Considering how difficult many parts of the US make it to vote, especially in predominantly non-white neighborhoods, and considering how heavily gerrymandered their system is, I think it's probably not a fair conclusion to assume that an American not voting is necessarily someone who's apathetic about politics or someone who wouldn't vote if given a real opportunity.

I certainly don't think that someone's failure to vote should mean that they should be silenced between elections.
 

lewisnotmiller

Grand Hat
Staff member
Premium Member
Considering how difficult many parts of the US make it to vote, especially in predominantly non-white neighborhoods, and considering how heavily gerrymandered their system is, I think it's probably not a fair conclusion to assume that an American not voting is necessarily someone who's apathetic about politics or someone who wouldn't vote if given a real opportunity.

I certainly don't think that someone's failure to vote should mean that they should be silenced between elections.

Neither do I.
I'm specifically stating that people who don't vote shouldn't complain about the election result.

More power to them in terms of speaking on issues between elections. The more voices the healthier the democratic process, imho.
 

Notanumber

A Free Man
Neither do I.
I'm specifically stating that people who don't vote shouldn't complain about the election result.

More power to them in terms of speaking on issues between elections. The more voices the healthier the democratic process, imho.

This former member of the UK parliament has a similar stance on free speech as you.


Free speech is for all, not the privileged few.
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
Neither do I.
I'm specifically stating that people who don't vote shouldn't complain about the election result.
And that's what I'm disagreeing with.

In the US, it's quite common for people not to vote because:

  • they don't have "acceptable" ID for voting, but they don't drive and the only government office in their area where they could get the required ID is only accessible by car.
  • they don't drive and their polling place is only accessible by car.
  • they can't get enough time off to vote because:
    • They live in a state that doesn't require employers to give staff any time off to vote at all.
    • Their state only requires employers to give employees 2 hours off to vote, but the line at their polling station is much longer than 2 hours.
    • They work 2 jobs to make ends meet (so both employers are providing "off duty" time while polls are open, but the employee is never actually off-duty
  • They're scared of voting in-person during a pandemic, but their state has clamped down on mail-in voting.
  • They're legally prohibited from voting because they're in prison or have a felony conviction (which is a major issue in the US, which has the highest incarceration rate in the world).
... etc., etc.

The US system puts up a lot of obstacles to stop marginalized people from voting. Often, these obstacles are successful and the person doesn't vote. I think that these people have every right to complain about the outcome of an election that they've been excluded from.
 
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