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Are Bible Prophecies Vague and Contemporary? -Babylon

Alitheia

New Member
History records how Babylon took the Jews into captivity. Yet, about 40 years before this happened Jeremiah foretold it. Isaiah predicted it some 150 years before it happened. He also foretold that the Jews would return from captivity. So did Jeremiah, saying that they would be restored to their land after 70 years. — Isaiah 39:6, 7; 44:26; Jeremiah 25:8–12; 29:10.

This return was made possible by the overthrow of Babylon by the Medes and Persians in 539 B.C.E. It was foretold by Isaiah nearly 200 years before it happened, and by Jeremiah about 50 years before it occurred. Jeremiah said that the Babylonian soldiers would put up no fight. Both Isaiah and Jeremiah foretold that Babylon’s protecting waters, the river Euphrates, “must be dried up.” Isaiah even gave the name of the conquering Persian general, Cyrus, and said that before him “the gates [of Babylon] will not be shut.” — Jeremiah 50:38; 51:11, 30; Isaiah 13:17–19; 44:27; 45:1.

The Greek historian Herodotus explained that Cyrus actually diverted the flow of the Euphrates and “the river sank to such an extent that the natural bed of the stream became fordable.” Thus, during the night, enemy soldiers marched along the riverbed and entered the city through gates that had been carelessly left open.

“Had the Babylonians been apprised of what Cyrus was about,” Herodotus continued, “they would have made fast all the street-gates which [were] upon the river . . . But, as it was, the Persians came upon them by surprise and so took the city.”

Actually, the Babylonians were involved in drunken revelry, as the Bible explains, and as Herodotus confirms. (Daniel 5:1–4, 30) Both Isaiah and Jeremiah foretold that Babylon would eventually become uninhabited ruins. And that is what happened. Today Babylon is a desolate heap of mounds. — Isaiah 13:20–22; Jeremiah 51:37, 41–43.

Cyrus also restored the Jews to their homeland. Why would he do such a thing? The Jamieson-Fausset-Brown Bible Commentary explains,

“Cyrus, according to Josephus, heard of this prophecy of Isaiah delivered so long before; hence he was induced to do that which was so contrary to Oriental policy, to aid in restoring the captive Jews and rebuilding their temple and city.”

Indeed, over two centuries before, Jehovah had foretold of Cyrus: “All that I delight in he will completely carry out.” (Isaiah 44:28) True to prophecy, after 70 years Cyrus returned the captives to their homeland, in 537 B.C.E. (Ezra 1:1–4) An ancient Persian inscription, called the Cyrus Cylinder, has been found that clearly states the policy of Cyrus to return captives to their homelands.

“As to the inhabitants of Babylon,” Cyrus is recorded as having said, “I (also) gathered all their (former) inhabitants and returned (to them) their habitations.”

Isaiah made a further startling prediction regarding Babylon: “She will never be inhabited.” (Isaiah 13:19, 20) To predict permanent desolation for a sprawling city occupying a strategic location was bold indeed. You would normally expect that such a city would be rebuilt if ruined. Although Babylon lingered on for a while after its conquest, Isaiah’s words eventually came true. Today the site of ancient Babylon “is flat, hot, deserted and dusty,” reports Smithsonian magazine.

It is awesome to contemplate the magnitude of Isaiah’s prophecy! What he foretold would be the equivalent of predicting the exact manner in which a modern city, such as New York or London, would be destroyed 200 years from now and then emphatically stating that it would never again be inhabited.

In fact, Babylon continues to be uninhabited despite the efforts, mind you, of Alexander the Great and Saddam Hussein to rebuild it.
 

Brickjectivity

wind and rain touch not this brain
Staff member
Premium Member
You don't know when these were written. You can't assure me that they were written ahead of time. It seems to be wishful thinking.
 

epronovost

Well-Known Member
In fact, Babylon continues to be uninhabited despite the efforts, mind you, of Alexander the Great and Saddam Hussein to rebuild it.

Babylone was inhabitted during the days of Alexandre the Great. It was even one of the most important city of the Persian Empire and became the new capital of Alexandre after his conquest. He ordered the city not to be pillaged specifically for that reason. Despite this, the city was largely abandonned about 50 years later, when Seleucia was built a few miles away, displacing the population. The temples and sanctuaries of old-Babylon would remain in usage and a small population would still live on the site until it was destroyed and abandonned by the Islamic Empire. Get your history straight.

PS: As it was mentionned above by another poster, the Bible as you know it was largely composed after the return of the Hebrew to their land. It's also important to note that the term "prophecy" doesn't specifically refer to the future, but to the ability to interpret the vision of the God. It can be about the past, the present and indeed about the future, but the goal of a prophet is to interpret the will of his deity not predict the future; that's what soothsayer are for.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
Both Isaiah and Jeremiah foretold that Babylon would eventually become uninhabited ruins. And that is what happened. Today Babylon is a desolate heap of mounds
Every city from then is. Eventually every city that is will be. This has been known to many for a very long time in some way or another, that everything ends. So it's not really impressive as a prophecy.
 

epronovost

Well-Known Member
Every city from then is. Eventually every city that is will be. This has been known to many for a very long time in some way or another, that everything ends. So it's not really impressive as a prophecy.

Note that the Ezekiel, another prophet, did predict the fall and utter destruction of the city of Tyre. It didn't fall to this particular enemy, the city was never completely destroyed and the site remains occupied and prosperous to this day. It's easier to get the details of your prophecy right when they are past event and not predictions.
 

It Aint Necessarily So

Veteran Member
Premium Member
History records how Babylon took the Jews into captivity. Yet, about 40 years before this happened Jeremiah foretold it. Isaiah predicted it some 150 years before it happened. He also foretold that the Jews would return from captivity. So did Jeremiah, saying that they would be restored to their land after 70 years. — Isaiah 39:6, 7; 44:26; Jeremiah 25:8–12; 29:10.

This return was made possible by the overthrow of Babylon by the Medes and Persians in 539 B.C.E. It was foretold by Isaiah nearly 200 years before it happened, and by Jeremiah about 50 years before it occurred. Jeremiah said that the Babylonian soldiers would put up no fight. Both Isaiah and Jeremiah foretold that Babylon’s protecting waters, the river Euphrates, “must be dried up.” Isaiah even gave the name of the conquering Persian general, Cyrus, and said that before him “the gates [of Babylon] will not be shut.” — Jeremiah 50:38; 51:11, 30; Isaiah 13:17–19; 44:27; 45:1.

The Greek historian Herodotus explained that Cyrus actually diverted the flow of the Euphrates and “the river sank to such an extent that the natural bed of the stream became fordable.” Thus, during the night, enemy soldiers marched along the riverbed and entered the city through gates that had been carelessly left open.

“Had the Babylonians been apprised of what Cyrus was about,” Herodotus continued, “they would have made fast all the street-gates which [were] upon the river . . . But, as it was, the Persians came upon them by surprise and so took the city.”

Actually, the Babylonians were involved in drunken revelry, as the Bible explains, and as Herodotus confirms. (Daniel 5:1–4, 30) Both Isaiah and Jeremiah foretold that Babylon would eventually become uninhabited ruins. And that is what happened. Today Babylon is a desolate heap of mounds. — Isaiah 13:20–22; Jeremiah 51:37, 41–43.

Cyrus also restored the Jews to their homeland. Why would he do such a thing? The Jamieson-Fausset-Brown Bible Commentary explains,

“Cyrus, according to Josephus, heard of this prophecy of Isaiah delivered so long before; hence he was induced to do that which was so contrary to Oriental policy, to aid in restoring the captive Jews and rebuilding their temple and city.”

Indeed, over two centuries before, Jehovah had foretold of Cyrus: “All that I delight in he will completely carry out.” (Isaiah 44:28) True to prophecy, after 70 years Cyrus returned the captives to their homeland, in 537 B.C.E. (Ezra 1:1–4) An ancient Persian inscription, called the Cyrus Cylinder, has been found that clearly states the policy of Cyrus to return captives to their homelands.

“As to the inhabitants of Babylon,” Cyrus is recorded as having said, “I (also) gathered all their (former) inhabitants and returned (to them) their habitations.”

Isaiah made a further startling prediction regarding Babylon: “She will never be inhabited.” (Isaiah 13:19, 20) To predict permanent desolation for a sprawling city occupying a strategic location was bold indeed. You would normally expect that such a city would be rebuilt if ruined. Although Babylon lingered on for a while after its conquest, Isaiah’s words eventually came true. Today the site of ancient Babylon “is flat, hot, deserted and dusty,” reports Smithsonian magazine.

It is awesome to contemplate the magnitude of Isaiah’s prophecy! What he foretold would be the equivalent of predicting the exact manner in which a modern city, such as New York or London, would be destroyed 200 years from now and then emphatically stating that it would never again be inhabited.

In fact, Babylon continues to be uninhabited despite the efforts, mind you, of Alexander the Great and Saddam Hussein to rebuild it.

Okay, but why should this matter to me or anybody else? Bookies make predictions every day, some correct. So what? Was your point that this prophecy should be considered supernatural - that human beings couldn't have made it? If so, I'll be happy to discuss the difference between biblical prophecy and high quality prophecy as we find in science (specific, detailed and unambiguous, optimally, the time and place are specified (if relevant) or other quantifiable parameters such as the Higgs boson's mass/spin/charge/parity or the cosmic microwave backgroun's temperature/frequency and homogeneity, couldn't come after the fact, not self-fulfilling, predicts something not common or expected like wars or religions being scorned or rejected, etc.). Biblical prophecy is none of those things.

If that wasn't your point, what was?

"Think of how many religions attempt to validate themselves with prophecy. Think of how many people rely on these prophecies, however vague, however unfulfilled, to support or prop up their beliefs. Yet has there ever been a religion with the prophetic accuracy and reliability of science?" - Carl Sagan
 
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Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Every city from then is. Eventually every city that is will be. This has been known to many for a very long time in some way or another, that everything ends. So it's not really impressive as a prophecy.
It does put some perspective if the people from Ancient Rome in its heyday, as a major world superpower, were alive today.

Would they ever imagined their country will be relegated to a minor to medium power on the world stage?

It's true countries essentially come and go all the time throughout history, save maybe perhaps their names.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
It does put some perspective if the people from Ancient Rome in its heyday, as a major world superpower, were alive today.

Would they ever imagined their country will be relegated to a minor to medium power on the world stage?

It's true countries essentially come and go all the time throughout history, save maybe perhaps their names.
I was thinking of Rome as I posted that, as the name Rome is still in use today, but it's but a shadow of the former status of what was when one thinks of Rome, thoughts reinforced by the ancient skeletons still standing of long dead Rome.
 
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