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Finally one of these crooks held accountable.

Windwalker

Windwalker

Veteran Member
Premium Member
As I said before, it's in times like these that humanity's stupidities shine forth even more brightly. And he is friends with Donald Trump on top it. What does that say about the wattage of Trump's mind lamp?
 
T

Terry Sampson

Well-Known Member
David1967 said:
So finally one of these profits (misspelled on purpose) may just go to jail for endangering the people he leeches off of. This clown is one of the nuttier ones. Thoughts?
Click to expand...
I have mixed feelings and opinions over the story.
  • On the one hand, "The sheriff says the pastor's actions were in direct violation of the "safer-at-home" order in place in Hillsborough County and an executive order that limits gatherings of more than 10 people. That order includes faith-based gatherings."
  • On the other hand, Pastor Knucklehead was NOT the only person there. The way I see it, the Sheriff appears to have had the authority to arrest the Pastor; but he also appears to have had the authority to arrest every other person in attendance. So, why didn't he?
  • The "risk of contamination/infection danger" to each of the people who attended the service was voluntarily assumed by each of the attending church members. However, the risk was involuntarily "forced on" the community at large.
  • I'm waiting for lawsuits, in our litigious American society, to be forthcoming in future days. Someone somewhere is going to figure out a way to take Public Polluters to court, if, when, and as CV-19 spreads.
  • As for the Pastor's claim: "Howard-Browne—an ally of President Donald Trump—has been an outspoken opponent of social distancing requirements, claiming his church has machines that can stop the coronavirus and vowing to personally cure the state of Florida himself. I suspect an ambitious lawyer could make a case for Pastoral fraud in there somewhere.
 
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leov

leov

Well-Known Member
Terry Sampson said:
I have mixed feelings and opinions over the story.
  • On the one hand, "The sheriff says the pastor's actions were in direct violation of the "safer-at-home" order in place in Hillsborough County and an executive order that limits gatherings of more than 10 people. That order includes faith-based gatherings."
  • On the other hand, Pastor Knucklehead was NOT the only person there. The way I see it, the Sheriff appears to have had the authority to arrest the Pastor; but he also appears to have had the authority to arrest every other person in attendance. So, why didn't he?
  • The "risk of contamination/infection danger" to each of the people who attended the service was voluntarily assumed by each of the attending church members. However, the risk was involuntarily "forced on" the community at large.
  • I'm waiting for lawsuits, in our litigious American society, to be forthcoming in future days. Someone somewhere is going to figure out a way to take Public Polluters to court, if, when, and as CV-19 spreads.
  • As for the Pastor's claim: "Howard-Browne—an ally of President Donald Trump—has been an outspoken opponent of social distancing requirements, claiming his church has machines that can stop the coronavirus and vowing to personally cure the state of Florida himself. I suspect an ambitious lawyer could make a case for Pastoral fraud in there somewhere.
Click to expand...
Same here.
 
C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
Terry Sampson said:
On the other hand, Pastor Knucklehead was NOT the only person there. The way I see it, the Sheriff appears to have had the authority to arrest the Pastor; but he also appears to have had the authority to arrest every other person in attendance. So, why didn't he?
Click to expand...
I don't claim to know the situation in Florida. But lots of states are releasing inmates from jail, due to the C19 threat among the incarcerated.

I could totally understand the sheriff arresting the leader of a dangerous group and not all the followers. Perhaps finding out that he is not above the law will give them motivation to be more careful.
Tom
 
Deeje

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
David1967 said:
So finally one of these profits (misspelled on purpose) may just go to jail for endangering the people he leeches off of. This clown is one of the nuttier ones. Thoughts?

Florida Sheriff to Arrest Rodney Howard Browne, Megachurch Pastor Who Flouted Virus Rules
Click to expand...

Since Christians are admonished to obey the Law when it does not contravene God’s law, there was nothing to stop this man from doing what others are doing...live streaming his services to them at home.

If we are to live by faith in ‘miracles’ or some kind of supposed immunity in church, then why did God have his people practice quarantining and physical cleanliness and hygiene to avoid disease in the days of ancient Israel?

The old adage is true....”God helps those who help themselves”.....this virus is real and it is extremely contagious. If you flaunt the law and believe that God will protect you, then you have no knowledge of scripture and no regard for its counsel. God will not endorse or support stupidity.

Follow the health directives even if you disagree with them for some reason. These do not contravene God’s laws because there are other, safer ways to meet for worship. JW’s are enjoying this avenue.

Stay safe...stay home!
 
Twilight Hue

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Terry Sampson said:
I have mixed feelings and opinions over the story.
  • On the one hand, "The sheriff says the pastor's actions were in direct violation of the "safer-at-home" order in place in Hillsborough County and an executive order that limits gatherings of more than 10 people. That order includes faith-based gatherings."
  • On the other hand, Pastor Knucklehead was NOT the only person there. The way I see it, the Sheriff appears to have had the authority to arrest the Pastor; but he also appears to have had the authority to arrest every other person in attendance. So, why didn't he?
  • The "risk of contamination/infection danger" to each of the people who attended the service was voluntarily assumed by each of the attending church members. However, the risk was involuntarily "forced on" the community at large.
  • I'm waiting for lawsuits, in our litigious American society, to be forthcoming in future days. Someone somewhere is going to figure out a way to take Public Polluters to court, if, when, and as CV-19 spreads.
  • As for the Pastor's claim: "Howard-Browne—an ally of President Donald Trump—has been an outspoken opponent of social distancing requirements, claiming his church has machines that can stop the coronavirus and vowing to personally cure the state of Florida himself. I suspect an ambitious lawyer could make a case for Pastoral fraud in there somewhere.
Click to expand...
I think the arrest of the 'pastor' was sort of akin with cutting the head off the snake.

The rest of the body goes limp and writhes away.
 
C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
leov said:
Church goers have their own will... Should Christians obeyed Romans?
Click to expand...
Well, they obeyed the Nazis.

Christianity teaches obedience. It opposes self determination. The question is only which humans to obey and why.

It appears that modern Christian preachers are often upset by the government trying to keep people safe from a virus. It demonstrates that the preachers don't really have the power of Jesus. They can't heal a viral illness.
Tom
 
Stevicus

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
David1967 said:
So finally one of these profits (misspelled on purpose) may just go to jail for endangering the people he leeches off of. This clown is one of the nuttier ones. Thoughts?

Florida Sheriff to Arrest Rodney Howard Browne, Megachurch Pastor Who Flouted Virus Rules
Click to expand...

The article said that he was "claiming his church has machines that can stop the coronavirus and vowing to personally cure the state of Florida himself." Someone should take a look at those machines. It sounds like a major breakthrough.

Why can't they just have online church services?
 
Twilight Hue

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Christians just need to wake up and smell the coffee and realize that they are nothing special in terms of religious faith, their God isn't going to do anything whatsoever, and they are not the worlds light and protectors.
 
Windwalker

Windwalker

Veteran Member
Premium Member
leov said:
Church goers have their own will... Should Christians obeyed Romans?
Click to expand...
If it came to them in their stupidity putting the general public health at risk through failing to quarneteen, then YES they should have obeyed them. And yet, the Romans would have been right to have arrested them, under those circumstances. The practice of your religion is fine, so long as you don't burn the rest of the world down in the process of practicing stupidity.
 
leov

leov

Well-Known Member
Windwalker said:
If it came to them in their stupidity putting the general public health at risk through failing to quarneteen, then YES they should have obeyed them. And yet, the Romans would have been right to have arrested them, under those circumstances. The practice of your religion is fine, so long as you don't burn the rest of the world down in the process of practicing stupidity.
Click to expand...
That is why I have mixed feeling about this issue...
 
L

lostwanderingsoul

Well-Known Member
While I do not agree with this pastor holding church during the pandemic, I do rhink sometimes your religion may put God above local laws. If yu do not have the faith to do what God tells you to do, then what good is your faith. Maybe he believes God wanted him to hold services. I also blame the congregation for not taking the pandemic seriously but again maybe their faith made them believe they were doing the right thing. Maybe that is better than having no faith at all.
 
Stevicus

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
lostwanderingsoul said:
While I do not agree with this pastor holding church during the pandemic, I do rhink sometimes your religion may put God above local laws. If yu do not have the faith to do what God tells you to do, then what good is your faith. Maybe he believes God wanted him to hold services. I also blame the congregation for not taking the pandemic seriously but again maybe their faith made them believe they were doing the right thing. Maybe that is better than having no faith at all.
Click to expand...

I would look at it another way. First, did the pastor claim that God actually told him to have a church service even despite the pandemic?

But even setting that aside, I also wonder about his claim that he has machines that can stop the coronavirus. Either that's a lie (which God would not look kindly upon), or he really does have such a machine and he's apparently withholding this miraculous technology and refusing to help out his fellow man (which is another thing God would not look kindly upon).
 
It Aint Necessarily So

It Aint Necessarily So

Veteran Member
Premium Member
lostwanderingsoul said:
I also blame the congregation for not taking the pandemic seriously but again maybe their faith made them believe they were doing the right thing. Maybe that is better than having no faith at all.
Click to expand...

Agree. Everybody present was being irresponsible.

And thinking by faith is never a better idea than going with reason applied to evidence. Reason tells us that there would come a day when the virus has established itself in the community and begin incubating in the asymptomatically infected and being spread to previously unaffected people, but that there were not enough sick people yet for the community to realize that it was in this stage. People needed to be in lockdown before that began for lockdown to be effective.

This happened May 10th to a community already in that state, but unaware:

"With the coronavirus quickly spreading in Washington state in early March, leaders of the Skagit Valley Chorale debated whether to go ahead with weekly rehearsal. The virus was already killing people in the Seattle area, about an hour’s drive to the south. But Skagit County hadn’t reported any cases, schools and businesses remained open, and prohibitions on large gatherings had yet to be announced."

So, they had their choir practice, about sixty strong. They used hand sanitizer and avoided hugs, but it didn't help them:

"After 2½ hours, the singers parted ways at 9 p.m. Nearly three weeks later, 45 have been diagnosed with COVID-19 or ill with the symptoms, at least three have been hospitalized, and two are dead." A choir decided to go ahead with rehearsal. Now dozens of members have COVID-19 and two are dead

They were thinking by faith instead of reason. They believed they were safe when they should have known that a day like that one would come to their community.

This was also a failure of leadership and good judgment based on hunch rather than reason.
 
Deeje

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
lostwanderingsoul said:
While I do not agree with this pastor holding church during the pandemic, I do rhink sometimes your religion may put God above local laws. If yu do not have the faith to do what God tells you to do, then what good is your faith. Maybe he believes God wanted him to hold services. I also blame the congregation for not taking the pandemic seriously but again maybe their faith made them believe they were doing the right thing. Maybe that is better than having no faith at all.
Click to expand...

Wasn’t it Solomon who said that “a live dog is better off than a dead lion”? (Ecclesiastes 9:4) While there is life there is hope.....what good are the dead to anyone?
Life is precious...to be preserved by following protocol when events like this take place.

What if you get the virus in a mild form but pass it on to elderly parents who will not fare well with this? It’s an awful way to die...alone and struggling to breathe. Think of others, which is what Christians are admonished to do.
There are other, safer ways to hold Christian meetings. It benefits everyone to use them....and to stay in touch with friends and family.

We need to use our God-given common sense and stay home. o_O
 
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