What Are You Going to Do About All Those "Surplus" Males?

Sunstone said:

So you think just as many men will be willing to share one wife with other men as there are women willing to share one man with other woman. Interesting assumption. On what rational basis do you make it?

Or, perhaps you would actually force surplus men into sharing one woman in order to solve the problem?

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I highly doubt that. Most males seem to experience some degree of sexual jealousy towards their mates (how many women have been murdered or assaulted by their male partners over cheating? A lot).

The polyamrous crowd seem to forget that we're apes first and foremost and we seem to have more in common with the violent chimps than the peaceful bonobos. Way too idealistic. Also, women having multiple husbands has been very rare in human cultures. Let alone all the other combos that people fantasize about. 99% (give or take) of the time, "plural marriage" means one man and multiple women. Anyway, I doubt plural marriage will ever be legalized. They'd have to rewrite so many laws for it, to start with. Polygamy has never been an accepted practice in Western culture. Gay marriage has more historical precedent.

Quintessence said:

Or we just get rid of marriage benefits and the main need for multiple marriages would pretty much evaporate anyway.

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No thanks. The financial cost to merging wealth and decision making power without a legal marriage document in the US is staggering. Those rights and benefits are important, especially when it comes to managing property, investments and childcare. That's why there is need.

The problem is there's no simple way for expanding those benefits to plural parties without creating major vulnerabilities for abuse. (And no, subbing in domestic partner or civil union contract won't cut it. Those already exist and fill different niches.)

There is no easy solution here. Either way you're going to screw over someone. But as is you're screwing over less.

Sunstone said:

For those of you who are fans of legalized polygamy, what are you going to do about all those "surplus" males?

As a practical matter, if one man has four wives, that means (approximately) three men will not be able to have wives. So what are you going to do about them? Anything?


By the way, here's how the fundie Mormon sects handle the problem. They run off the surplus young men. Run them out of their communities during their teen years. Of course, they have given those kids such a poor education that they can't get good paying jobs, so they usually end up working as male prostitutes in Las Vegas. At least, the kids from the Southern Utah communities. What do you make of that solution to the problem of young men not being able to find wives? Is it a good solution? One you would endorse? Do you have better?

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Thunderdome

Mindmaster said:

Not going to happen... Anywhere except Utah.

...

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You may be surprised to learn that Utah is fiercely anti-polygamy.

Watchmen said:

You may be surprised to learn that Utah is fiercely anti-polygamy.

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Perhaps less than we think.
https://nypost.com/2020/02/19/utahs-state-senate-votes-unanimously-to-decriminalize-polygamy/

Watchmen said:

You may be surprised to learn that Utah is fiercely anti-polygamy.

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I still think it's not my or the governments business, lol.

If you can support more than one wife and they're all happy it doesn't affect me in the least. I'm a one woman guy, but some people aren't and I wouldn't want people telling me I had to have more than one wife if we were putting on the shoe on the other foot.

Sunstone said:

So you think just as many men will be willing to share one wife with other men as there are women willing to share one man with other woman. Interesting assumption. On what rational basis do you make it?

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Yes. In fact I think it would be more common for men to be willing to share one wife with other men than for women willing to share one husband with other women. I think most average guys are desperate for sex, and if the woman is at least somehwat attractive, many of the average-to-below average looking guys would be willing to share her with other guys as long as they got to have sex with her too. Most guys are driven by their sex drives and will make sacrifices for sex (which is why more men pay women for sex than women paying men for sex).

On the other hand, I think very few women are actually willing to share one husband with other women. Charlie Sheen tried it and it didn't work out for long, as the women started despising each other.

Sunstone said:

For those of you who are fans of legalized polygamy, what are you going to do about all those "surplus" males?

As a practical matter, if one man has four wives, that means (approximately) three men will not be able to have wives. So what are you going to do about them? Anything?


By the way, here's how the fundie Mormon sects handle the problem. They run off the surplus young men. Run them out of their communities during their teen years. Of course, they have given those kids such a poor education that they can't get good paying jobs, so they usually end up working as male prostitutes in Las Vegas. At least, the kids from the Southern Utah communities. What do you make of that solution to the problem of young men not being able to find wives? Is it a good solution? One you would endorse? Do you have better?

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I would assume that with legalized Polygymy, that both Polygyny and Polyandry would both be legalized, so surplus males may not actually occur. There is also still a legal framework within the US that makes monogamy more preferable to other forms of unions, purely from a tax bracket/economic stand point.

This honestly smells of a slippery slope if you ask me.

The Hammer said:

I would assume that with legalized Polygymy, that both Polygyny and Polyandry would both be legalized, so surplus males may not actually occur. There is also still a legal framework within the US that makes monogamy more preferable to other forms of unions, purely from a tax bracket/economic stand point.

This honestly smells of a slippery slope if you ask me.

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Come now, as I keep saying, your assumption that there will be no surplus males rests on the implausible notion that there are just as many men willing to share a wife as there are women willing to share a husband, but that just ain't the case. Outside of Nepal, such arrangements are few and far between, and even inside Nepal, they are not the dominant form of marriage. Men just do NOT tolerate sharing wives to the same degree that woman tolerate sharing husbands.

Also, you should read up on the 2017 British Colombia Supreme Court case regarding the legality of polygamy. Specifically, read the science that was submitted in the case. In the eyes of the Court, the science demonstrated that polygamy is harmful to society. I bet I'm the only person in this thread who has even heard of the scientific studies of the social consequences of polygamy, let alone the only one who has read up on them. I strongly suspect everyone else in this thread is shooting blanks when it comes to being informed on this subject.

I could find uses for surplus males.

Send them off to war. Put them to work in the mines or farms as slaves.

Other, more personal uses....

Biologically speaking, most men are dispensable. One healthy male can easily keep 10 females pregnant and producing more dispensable people. Societies don't need an equal ratio of fathers and mothers. They're better off recognizing the dispensablility of most males and protecting the women.
Tom

Sunstone said:

For those of you who are fans of legalized polygamy, what are you going to do about all those "surplus" males?

As a practical matter, if one man has four wives, that means (approximately) three men will not be able to have wives. So what are you going to do about them? Anything?


By the way, here's how the fundie Mormon sects handle the problem. They run off the surplus young men. Run them out of their communities during their teen years. Of course, they have given those kids such a poor education that they can't get good paying jobs, so they usually end up working as male prostitutes in Las Vegas. At least, the kids from the Southern Utah communities. What do you make of that solution to the problem of young men not being able to find wives? Is it a good solution? One you would endorse? Do you have better?

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Legalized polyandry too. Done. Next!

I am not a fan. I just reject the religion dictated structure of marriage that is the basis of most laws in the West. Supply issues are not anyone's problem as marriage rates are not at 100% nor is everyone interested in polygamy

Sunstone said:

What do you make of that solution to the problem of young men not being able to find wives?

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Kill or enslave enough other guys to free up da wimmins.

Easy Peasy.
Tom

columbus said:

Kill or enslave enough other guys to free up da wimmins.

Easy Peasy.
Tom

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Men don't need wimin.
I have proof!

Revoltingest said:

Men don't need wimin.

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No kidding.
I don't understand what you straight boys see in boobs.

Get a guy. You won't have the problems.

Been there done that.
Tom

columbus said:

No kidding.
I don't understand what you straight boys see in boobs.

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It's the wonderful honking sound they make.