Behaviors that I denounce as morally wrong, inexcusable, harmful, and part of serious social issues

Gerry said:

Agree.
ANY conscious, intentional cruelty is wrong and evil, including the idiotic rewarding of bad behaviors you mentioned.

Click to expand...

Not to appear argumentative, but, again, this is another example of selective and subjective morality. Granted, most of us would consider such behavior as unacceptable, but the person who may commit these social breaches may not have the same moral filters as you; his brain may not define morality as yours would.

Update:

What I’ve said about behavior that I denounce is not about people disagreeing with each other. It is not about “the rough and tumble of a forum.” It is not about people feeling hurt or offended or having their views and beliefs challenged. It is not about people having different ways of thinking and communicating. It is not making any claims about an objective, absolute or universal morality.

What I’ve been saying in this thread is about what I personally, subjectively think about conscious and intentional cruelty and personal attacks; disparaging and vilifying people across faction lines; and approving those behaviors or making excuses for them. I’m denouncing those behaviors as morally wrong, inexcusable, harmful, and part of some serious social issues that urgently need a lot more attention from a lot more people.

I’m tempted to add: trying to divert attention from those issues when they’re being discussed.

BSM1 said:

Granted, most of us would consider such behavior as unacceptable ...

Click to expand...

Does “most of us” include you?

BSM1 said:

Not to appear argumentative, but, again, this is another example of selective and subjective morality. Granted, most of us would consider such behavior as unacceptable, but the person who may commit these social breaches may not have the same moral filters as you; his brain may not define morality as yours would.

Click to expand...

You are not being argumentative, imo.
I find your comment to be quite valid, and useful.

But, evil IS evil.
And, goodness IS goodness.
There is no grey area.
Only the appearance of grey in individual thinking.
So, our goal should not be to look for evil in others, but to ONLY look for it within ourselves. And to do so, requires us to first find out what is evil and what is goodness.

Jim said:

Does “most of us” include you?

Click to expand...

Of course, or we would be having this conversation. However, I try not to judge, just reflect and react.

Gerry said:

You are not being argumentative, imo.
I find your comment to be quite valid, and useful.

But, evil IS evil.
And, goodness IS goodness.
There is no grey area.
Only the appearance of grey in individual thinking.
So, our goal should not be to look for evil in others, but to ONLY look for it within ourselves. And to do so, requires us to first find out what is evil and what is goodness.

Click to expand...

Unfortunately, they are both 'grey' areas. The only thing that defines either is when say "this is good" or "that is evil". Actions, in and of themselves, are neutral.

Jim said:

@Amanaki @Invisibilis When I called what you were doing “gaslighting,” I wasn’t thinking that you were doing it intentionally, and I was wrong to use a loaded word like that. ...

Click to expand...

I never took your OP personally. I was just helping you to let it go, by seeing yourself as already okay and not needing anything to change to be okay.

Gerry said:

You are not being argumentative, imo.
I find your comment to be quite valid, and useful.

But, evil IS evil.
And, goodness IS goodness.
There is no grey area.
Only the appearance of grey in individual thinking.
So, our goal should not be to look for evil in others, but to ONLY look for it within ourselves. And to do so, requires us to first find out what is evil and what is goodness.

Click to expand...

I posted my response to that question here: Ideas for helping to reduce and counteract the ravages of human nature

Another kind of behavior that I denounce as morally wrong, inexcusable, harmful, and part of some serious social issues that urgently need a lot more attention from a lot more people:

- Using anger and hurt feelings, and being offended, as excuses for trying to hurt people, or agreeing for them to be hurt.

- More generally, using any kind of feelings or impulses as excuses or compelling reasons for doing anything, or agreeing for people to do whatever they want to do with those feelings or impulses.

I want to repeat that I’m denouncing people encouraging personal attacks in Internet discussions with ratings, or by responding to them in any way, even If it’s to denounce them, as much as I’m denouncing personal attacks. I’m talking about when people know that it’s a personal attack, but they reward it with a rating or approving comment anyway, for example maybe because it’s entertaining or against someone they see as an adversary. I’m talking about when people know that a counterattack will give the person more of a platform and more reasons to continue, but they do it anyway, maybe for example for their own gratification or for other people’s entertainment. I denounce that behavior as morally wrong, inexcusable, harmful, and part of what’s helping to perpetuate all kinds of cruelty, violence and oppression, online and offline, as much as any of the other behavior that I’m denouncing. I think that no matter what excuses people use for personal attacks, most or all of the personal attacks will stop when they stop getting attention, friendly or hostile, from others.

i see no excuse for anyone to continue encouraging those behaviors in those ways. If a person has any doubt about whether a post they like or don’t like is a personal attack or not, they can just leave it alone, and look for some other post to like or to disagree with.

Another kind of behavior that I denounce as morally wrong, inexcusable, harmful, and part of some serious social issues that urgently need a lot more attention from a lot more people:

- Using hurt feelings and being offended as excuses for cruelty and violence; as ways of intimidating and subjugating people; and for political leverage.

I’m thinking now that what I want to denounce most of all is people making excuses for cruelty and personal attacks, and persistently clouding the issue or diverting attention from it. In my personal, subjective and possibly wrong judgment, what helps perpetuate all the cruelty, violence and oppression in the world; more than fear and anger, more than God beliefs, more than movies glorifying vengeful killing sprees, more than drugs; more than global monopoly games, more than video games, more than access to guns, more even than people doing the actual violence; is people’s willingness to deny or excuse any kind or amount of evil depending on who is doing it, which is what they are doing when they continually denounce the behavior of people across religious and political lines without ever denouncing any of the same behavior on their own side of the line.

One example of excuses that I’ve seen in Internet discussions for admittedly conscious, intentional cruelty and personal attacks is to stop the spread of misinformation. Another is “They started it! They made us do it!” If I see people making any other excuses for conscious, intentional cruelty and personal attacks, I will post them here.

Revoltingest said:

All threads meander, especially if they're interesting.
For the record....
I agree with opposing cruelty.

Click to expand...

Me too.
( in theory)

A lot of harm has been done by people trying to fix the world.

Not so much by people trying to fix themselves.

Update:

I’m thinking now that what I want to denounce most of all is people making excuses for conscious, intentional cruelty and personal attacks, and persistently clouding the issue of conscious, intentional cruelty and personal attacks or diverting attention from it. In my personal, subjective and possibly wrong judgment, what helps perpetuate all the cruelty, violence and oppression in the world; more than fear and anger, more than God beliefs, more than any political or economic ideology, more than movies glorifying vengeful killing sprees, more than drugs; more than global monopoly games, more than video games, more than access to guns, more than people trying to fix the world, more even than people doing the actual violence; is people’s willingness to deny or excuse any kind or amount of evil depending on who is doing it, which is what they are doing when they continually denounce the behavior of people across religious and political lines without ever denouncing any of the same behavior on their own side of the line.

One example of excuses that I’ve seen in Internet discussions for admittedly conscious, intentional cruelty and personal attacks is to stop the spread of misinformation. Another is “They started it! They made us do it!” If I see people making any other excuses for conscious, intentional cruelty and personal attacks, I will post them here.

I’m thinking that there might be people who agree with what I’m saying, but who still have doubts about where I might be going with this. That’s okay.

I’ve actually gotten more encouragement and confirmation for this, and less criticism of what I’m actually saying, than I expected.

Jim said:

Update:

I’m thinking now that what I want to denounce most of all is people making excuses for conscious, intentional cruelty and personal attacks, and persistently clouding the issue of conscious, intentional cruelty and personal attacks or diverting attention from it. In my personal, subjective and possibly wrong judgment, what helps perpetuate all the cruelty, violence and oppression in the world; more than fear and anger, more than God beliefs, more than any political or economic ideology, more than movies glorifying vengeful killing sprees, more than drugs; more than global monopoly games, more than video games, more than access to guns, more than people trying to fix the world, more even than people doing the actual violence; is people’s willingness to deny or excuse any kind or amount of evil depending on who is doing it, which is what they are doing when they continually denounce the behavior of people across religious and political lines without ever denouncing any of the same behavior on their own side of the line.

One example of excuses that I’ve seen in Internet discussions for admittedly conscious, intentional cruelty and personal attacks is to stop the spread of misinformation. Another is “They started it! They made us do it!” If I see people making any other excuses for conscious, intentional cruelty and personal attacks, I will post them here.

Click to expand...

R U a denunciationalist?

Jim said:

@Amanaki @Invisibilis When I called what you were doing “gaslighting,” I wasn’t thinking that you were doing it intentionally, and I was wrong to use a loaded word like that. Those was my oars catchin’ crabs again. Sorry.

(edited to add the following)
Using that word like that was inexcusable for me, and an example of another kind of behavior that I think is harmful, and part of some serious social issues that I think urgently need a lot more attention from a lot more people.
(end edit)

Click to expand...

Ya need to invite everyone over for a crab feed! .

I find it good to check dictionary, some of my 50 cent
words dont mean what I thought!

First meaning for "gaslighting", a term I did not know
was "lie".

I am not a amaki fan but I sure didnt see any lying.

( do you know what "catching crabs" means?)

Quagmire said:

Me too.
( in theory)

Click to expand...

Although I have occasionally have thoughts of cruelty.

Audie said:

( do you know what "catching crabs" means?)

Click to expand...

I didn’t, but I think I do now. I think it means having an oar or two in the water when they should be out, or out when they should be in. It can slow you down or maybe even tip you over. Sometimes when you see my oars doing it, it’s when I’m using some words recklessly and irresponsibly.