If God is our Father

Redemptionsong · Feb 15, 2020

Iymus said:
Some say a son of Isaiah in OT is also Immanuel.

In any case:

God with us; through those subject unto his authority, doing his will, speaking his words, and doing his works.

The Son could be said to be Immanuel or even the Greatest Immanuel but the Son is not the only true God. The Son came from the only true God and came in his name.

Joh 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.
Joh 5:44 How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only?

Joh 7:16 Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me.
Joh 7:17 If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself.
Joh 7:18 He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him.

Joh 8:42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
Joh 8:43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.

Joh 12:49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.
Joh 12:50 And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.

Joh 16:25 These things have I spoken unto you in proverbs: but the time cometh, when I shall no more speak unto you in proverbs, but I shall shew you plainly of the Father.
Joh 16:26 At that day ye shall ask in my name: and I say not unto you, that I will pray the Father for you:
Joh 16:27 For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God.
Joh 16:28 I came forth from the Father, and am come into the world: again, I leave the world, and go to the Father.
Joh 16:29 His disciples said unto him, Lo, now speakest thou plainly, and speakest no proverb.
Joh 16:30 Now are we sure that thou knowest all things, and needest not that any man should ask thee: by this we believe that thou camest forth from God.
Joh 16:31 Jesus answered them, Do ye now believe?

Joh 17:1 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:
Joh 17:2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
Joh 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

John 3:35,36. 'The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.
He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.'

Since all things have been handed to Jesus Christ with regards to our salvation, we should look to him as our head. We should learn to serve him, and to glorify His name.

Would it not be blasphemy to serve him, and to glorify his name, if he were not God?

Colossians 3:24'...: for ye serve the Lord Christ.'

Iymus · Feb 15, 2020

Redemptionsong said:
Would it not be blasphemy to serve him, and to glorify his name, if he were not God?

1. Hold up. Once again or First and Foremost:

Joh 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.
Joh 5:44 How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only?

Joh 13:3 Jesus knowing that the Father had given all things into his hands, and that he was come from God, and went to God;

2. Second of all.

Joh 4:34 Jesus saith unto them, My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to finish his work.

Joh 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.

Joh 15:1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.

Pro 22:6 Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not depart from it.

Luk 6:40 The disciple is not above his master: but every one that is perfect shall be as his master.

Redemptionsong said:
Would it not be blasphemy to serve him, and to glorify his name, if he were not God?

There seemed to be no issue or blasphemy in serving David or Lord God's anointed in the OT so there should not be any in the NT.

It seems to be blasphemy to use the appointed King to deny the only True God; or use the Prince to deny the King.
By using the lesser to deny the greater, you are also denying the lesser which declared him and his will.

Redemptionsong · Feb 16, 2020

Iymus said:
1. Hold up. Once again or First and Foremost:

Joh 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.
Joh 5:44 How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only?

Joh 13:3 Jesus knowing that the Father had given all things into his hands, and that he was come from God, and went to God;

2. Second of all.

Joh 4:34 Jesus saith unto them, My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to finish his work.

Joh 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.

Joh 15:1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.

Pro 22:6 Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not depart from it.

Luk 6:40 The disciple is not above his master: but every one that is perfect shall be as his master.

There seemed to be no issue or blasphemy in serving David or Lord God's anointed in the OT so there should not be any in the NT.

It seems to be blasphemy to use the appointed King to deny the only True God; or use the Prince to deny the King.
By using the lesser to deny the greater, you are also denying the lesser which declared him and his will.

No one is denying the Father by honouring the Son!

David was a man who died and was buried. David called Jesus Christ 'my Lord'.

Matthew 22:45. 'If David then call him [Jesus Christ] Lord, how is he [Jesus] his [David's] son?'

Iymus · Feb 16, 2020

Redemptionsong said:
No one is denying the Father by honouring the Son!

David was a man who died and was buried. David called Jesus Christ 'my Lord'.

Matthew 22:45. 'If David then call him [Jesus Christ] Lord, how is he [Jesus] his [David's] son?'

1. One is denying The Father by calling Jesus Lord, Lord but not knowing and doing the will of The Lord of Heaven and Earth whom gave him power and he declared.

Mat 7:21 KJV Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Joh 12:49 KJV For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.
Joh 12:50 KJV And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.

Joh 7:16 KJV Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me.
Joh 7:17 KJV If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself.
Joh 7:18 KJV He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him.

Joh 10:29 KJV My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

Joh 13:3 KJV Jesus knowing that the Father had given all things into his hands, and that he was come from God, and went to God;

Joh 14:28 KJV Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.

Mat 11:25 KJV At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes.

Redemptionsong · Feb 16, 2020

Iymus said:
1. One is denying The Father by calling Jesus Lord, Lord but not knowing and doing the will of The Lord of Heaven and Earth whom gave him power and he declared.

We know the will of the Father through the Son, Jesus Christ.

If you don't know the Father through the Son, how do you know Him?

John 1:10. 'He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.'

moorea944 · Feb 16, 2020

Redemptionsong said:
We know the will of the Father through the Son, Jesus Christ.

If you don't know the Father through the Son, how do you know Him?

John 1:10. 'He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.'

Is that really talking about Jesus or God?... Verse 14 begins talking about Jesus. God comes first in John 1.

Muffled · Feb 17, 2020

Iymus said:
God never had Kingdom of God until he gave it to Jesus?

Joh 13:3 Jesus knowing that the Father had given all things into his hands, and that he was come from God, and went to God;

Joh 14:28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.

Joh 16:26 At that day ye shall ask in my name: and I say not unto you, that I will pray the Father for you:
Joh 16:27 For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God.
Joh 16:28 I came forth from the Father, and am come into the world: again, I leave the world, and go to the Father.
Joh 16:29 His disciples said unto him, Lo, now speakest thou plainly, and speakest no proverb.
Joh 16:30 Now are we sure that thou knowest all things, and needest not that any man should ask thee: by this we believe that thou camest forth from God.
Joh 16:31 Jesus answered them, Do ye now believe?

1Co 8:5 For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,)

Joh 10:29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

Joh 8:40 But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham.

1Co 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.

Mat 11:25 At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes.

Rev 3:5 He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

Rev 3:12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.

Rev 3:21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

I believe that is because He was never in a body as King before Jesus.

I believe my statement remains unchallenged.

Muffled · Feb 17, 2020

moorea944 said:
An angel did. Your not saying that it was Jesus, are you?........ I hope not. He wasnt born yet.

I believe an angel does not speak with the voice of God. Since Jesus is God then anytime God appears Jesus is there also.

Redemptionsong · Feb 17, 2020

moorea944 said:
Is that really talking about Jesus or God?... Verse 14 begins talking about Jesus. God comes first in John 1.

The Gospel of John tells us about Jesus Christ, as the Son of God.

In John 1:6 we are introduced to John the Baptist. John bears witness 'of the Light'. So of whom was John the Baptist bearing witness, if not Jesus Christ?

John 1:23. 'He said, I am the voice of one crying in the wilderness, Make straight the way of the Lord, as said the prophet Esaias.'
John the Baptist, in the Spirit of Elijah, prepares the way for the coming of the Messiah. The Messiah is the life and light of men. God with us.

Iymus · Feb 17, 2020

Muffled said:
I believe that is because He was never in a body as King before Jesus.

I believe my statement remains unchallenged.

So The Possessor of Heaven and Earth needs to be in the body of a man to possess or have ownership of the Kingdom?

Is this why your statement remains unchallenged?
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Gen 14:19 And he blessed him, and said, Blessed be Abram of the most high God, possessor of heaven and earth:

Mat 11:25 At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes.

Joh 13:3 Jesus knowing that the Father had given all things into his hands, and that he was come from God, and went to God;

1Co 15:24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

Iymus · Feb 17, 2020

Redemptionsong said:
We know the will of the Father through the Son, Jesus Christ.

According to the New Testament yes.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Joh 7:17 If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself.

Joh 6:45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.

Joh 12:49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.
Joh 12:50 And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.

Joh 13:3 Jesus knowing that the Father had given all things into his hands, and that he was come from God, and went to God;

Redemptionsong said:
If you don't know the Father through the Son, how do you know Him?

Perhaps Celestial Messenger Servants such as Gabriel or Terrestrial Messenger Servants such a Moses.

Heb 1:1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,

1Co 15:40 There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.

Dan 8:16 And I heard a man's voice between the banks of Ulai, which called, and said, Gabriel, make this man to understand the vision.

Num 12:7 My servant Moses is not so, who is faithful in all mine house.
Num 12:8 With him will I speak mouth to mouth, even apparently, and not in dark speeches; and the similitude of the LORD shall he behold: wherefore then were ye not afraid to speak against my servant Moses?

Redemptionsong said:
John 1:10. 'He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.'

you should not use micro level speech to deny the macro level speech of who the only true God is.

Heb 5:12 For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.

Joh 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.

Joh 1:34 And I saw, and bare record that this is the Son of God.

Joh 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God.

Redemptionsong · Feb 17, 2020

Iymus said:
According to the New Testament yes.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Joh 7:17 If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself.

Joh 6:45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.

Joh 12:49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.
Joh 12:50 And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.

Joh 13:3 Jesus knowing that the Father had given all things into his hands, and that he was come from God, and went to God;

Perhaps Celestial Messenger Servants such as Gabriel or Terrestrial Messenger Servants such a Moses.

Heb 1:1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,

1Co 15:40 There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.

Dan 8:16 And I heard a man's voice between the banks of Ulai, which called, and said, Gabriel, make this man to understand the vision.

Num 12:7 My servant Moses is not so, who is faithful in all mine house.
Num 12:8 With him will I speak mouth to mouth, even apparently, and not in dark speeches; and the similitude of the LORD shall he behold: wherefore then were ye not afraid to speak against my servant Moses?

you should not use micro level speech to deny the macro level speech of who the only true God is.

Heb 5:12 For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.

Joh 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.

Joh 1:34 And I saw, and bare record that this is the Son of God.

Joh 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God.

According to your belief, was Jesus Christ celestial or terrestrial?

Iymus · Feb 17, 2020

Redemptionsong said:
According to your belief, was Jesus Christ celestial or terrestrial?

1. Being made of the seed of David and being man he had the glory of the terrestrial.

Joh 8:40 But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham.

Rom 1:3 Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh;

1Co 15:39 All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds.

2. However after death and resurrection he was raised a spiritual body and declared to be the Son of God seemingly having glory of the celestial.

1Co 15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

Rom 1:4 And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:

3. However at the end of the day it is our God that giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.

1Co 15:38 But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.

Heb 2:7 Thou madest him a little lower than the angels; thou crownedst him with glory and honour, and didst set him over the works of thy hands:

Heb 2:9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

Heb 2:17 Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.
Heb 2:18 For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.

moorea944 · Feb 17, 2020

Muffled said:
I believe an angel does not speak with the voice of God. Since Jesus is God then anytime God appears Jesus is there also.

Ok, a few things here... Angels speak for God. They represent their Creator.

Secondly, Jesus is not God. God does not appear on earth at anytime. Angels speak for God and can also speak in a first person or third person point.

moorea944 · Feb 17, 2020

Redemptionsong said:
The Gospel of John tells us about Jesus Christ, as the Son of God.

In John 1:6 we are introduced to John the Baptist. John bears witness 'of the Light'. So of whom was John the Baptist bearing witness, if not Jesus Christ?

John 1:23. 'He said, I am the voice of one crying in the wilderness, Make straight the way of the Lord, as said the prophet Esaias.'
John the Baptist, in the Spirit of Elijah, prepares the way for the coming of the Messiah. The Messiah is the life and light of men. God with us.

Yes, but, scripture also talks about God's light.....

Redemptionsong · Feb 17, 2020

Iymus said:
1. Being made of the seed of David and being man he had the glory of the terrestrial.

Joh 8:40 But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham.

Rom 1:3 Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh;

1Co 15:39 All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds.

2. However after death and resurrection he was raised a spiritual body and declared to be the Son of God seemingly having glory of the celestial.

1Co 15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

Rom 1:4 And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:

3. However at the end of the day it is our God that giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.

1Co 15:38 But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.

Heb 2:7 Thou madest him a little lower than the angels; thou crownedst him with glory and honour, and didst set him over the works of thy hands:

Heb 2:9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

Heb 2:17 Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.
Heb 2:18 For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.

You believe that the Father is the one true God.

Did the Father baptise his Son, Jesus?

Does Jesus Christ baptise us?

Have you received that baptism?

Redemptionsong · Feb 17, 2020

moorea944 said:
Yes, but, scripture also talks about God's light.....

Yes, because God is one. The light of the Father is in the Son.

1 John 1:8. 'Again, a new commandment I write unto you, which thing is true in him and in you: because the darkness is past, and the true light now shineth.'

Iymus · Feb 17, 2020

Redemptionsong said:
You believe that the Father is the one true God.

one and only true God yes.

Heb 12:9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?

Redemptionsong said:
Did the Father baptise his Son, Jesus?

God did yes; being his will and work.

Act 10:37 That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judaea, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached;
Act 10:38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.

Redemptionsong said:
Does Jesus Christ baptise us?

At the Macro Level No; because it is not his will, work, or name/authority in which we are baptized.

Joh 4:34 Jesus saith unto them, My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to finish his work.

Joh 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

Joh 10:37 If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not.

Act 5:30 The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree.
Act 5:31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.
Act 5:32 And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him.

Redemptionsong · Feb 18, 2020

Iymus said:
At the Macro Level No; because it is not his will, work, or name/authority in which we are baptized.

Yes, it is! We are baptised in the name of Jesus Christ.

Acts 2:38. 'Then said Peter unto them, Repent, and be baptised every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.'

Iymus · Feb 18, 2020

Redemptionsong said:
Yes, it is! We are baptised in the name of Jesus Christ.

Acts 2:38. 'Then said Peter unto them, Repent, and be baptised every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.'

Joh 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

Joh 5:44 How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only?

If God is our Father

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