Judgement time - Are you ready?

blü 2 said:

It's a direct and specific consequence of omnipotence, omniscience and perfection, isn't it? The alternative is that God did NOT perfectly foresee the results of [his] actions, hence at the least is neither omniscient or perfect.

If you could put your finger on the error in that reasoning, I'd be obliged.

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Hi Blu, nice to see you again. God is indeed omnipotent, omniscient and he also knows the end from the beginning.
The scriptures tell us that he knew that mankind would fall by not believing and following his Word. We are also told in the scriptures that God made provision for us by making the plan of salvation for mankind from the foundation of the world. As posted earlier we are made in God's image. God has given us all free will to believe and follow his Word and receive God's gift of salvation because he loves us and is not willing that anyone of us should perish that everyone of us that except his free gift will come to be saved if we continue to believe and follow his Word. It is because God loved us and forseeing the future he has made provision that all who hear his Words and believe them will be saved and reconcilled to God to receive everlasting life.

ChristineM said:

Just as they can a make up nonsence to justify their belief. I on the other hand accept nothing without evidence and even then i will question and analyse the claim.

No, history does not verify the bible, what history does is show that some places and some people mentioned in the bible actually existed

No excused necessary, i dont believe unevidenced woo

Why will time tell? You say some prophecies have already been fulfilled.

You are happy and welcome to your beliefs, i am happy with reality. And how disappointing it will be when you realise the scriptures are just the works of individuals written to subdue and control

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Hi Christine, time will tell who is right and who is wrong. History does indeed verify many of the the biblical records. Virtually all scholars and historians agree to this fact. You are free to believe as you wish I am at peace in what I believe how about you? Have you ever throught to yourself what if your wrong? I would not want to be found on the wrong side of the fence IMO if the scriptures were true. Anyhow we will have to agree to disagree. I only wish you peace.

3rdAngel said:

Hi shmogie,

Actually your post here is not correct and misleading possibly because there is a lot of misinformation out on the web. The investigative judgement is biblical as shown in the scriptures starting on page 5 in post # 81 linked. The of the investigative judgement however did not start with the Millerite movement. This movement was made up from many different protestant churches from around the world. It was a world-wide movement and all those who believed his teachings were called "Adventist" (not to be confused with Seventh Day Adventists that did not start until 1861 sometime after the Adventist movement of Miller 1833-1844) because they believed that timeline 1844 pointed to the 2nd coming of JESUS.

This was a multi christian religious movement that spanned right across the world at that time (1833-1844). I believe they got the dates correct IMO according to the scriptures but the event wrong (2nd coming).

Some time latter after the great dissappointment of 1844 some of those who were in the Millerite movement that studied further applied the dates to the beginning of the investigative judgement instead of the 2nd coming which was Millers view after a further study of the scrpiture from the Old Testament in relation to the Sanctuary, and LEVITICUS 23 and the feast of trumpets and the great day of Atonement (Yom Kippur) which lead some to view the end of the timeline leading to 1844 was to the investigative Judgement and the cleansing of the Sanctuary in Heaven of which the earthly was a copy.

Other Churches came out of this movement. The Seventh Day Adventists hold a different belief to that of the Millerite movment. Though they accept the timlines with application to the investigative judgement and not the 2nd coming of Christ.

Hope this helps.

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I gave the information from memory, not the internet, from my days as an SDA, sabbath school teacher, Elder.

Read my post again, and you will see that it is a synopsis of what you posted above.

I note you didn't mention the cornfield vision, are you not familiar with it? This is critical, because the investigative judgement idea came directly from this.

3rdAngel said:

Hi Christine, time will tell who is right and who is wrong. History does indeed verify many of the the biblical records. Virtually all scholars and historians agree to this fact. You are free to believe as you wish I am at peace in what I believe how about you? Have you ever throught to yourself what if your wrong? I would not want to be found on the wrong side of the fence IMO if the scriptures were true. Anyhow we will have to agree to disagree. I only wish you peace.

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First off. The bible is not a history book, not a record. Of course everyone must agree that people like Pilate existed and that roman justice for offences like denying the cult of emperor and terrorism were harsh. There is indipendent evidence to support these aspects. On the other hand there is no evidence to confirm a world flood or that jesus walked on water.

I used to be christian, so when i eventually summoned the courage to leave, yes i though what if i am wrong. But people outgrow childish dreams when faced with evidence beyond doubt

Tony Bristow-Stagg said:

There is no majical unicorn.

There is an all Loving God that has given us guidance though.

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And what I am saying is that you can't know any more about the reality of your God than you can the magical unicorn I spoke of. Neither is (currently) falsifiable or demonstrable. They are equals, and you cannot, at all, prove otherwise.

3rdAngel said:

Hi Blu, nice to see you again. God is indeed omnipotent, omniscient and he also knows the end from the beginning.
The scriptures tell us that he knew that mankind would fall by not believing and following his Word. We are also told in the scriptures that God made provision for us by making the plan of salvation for mankind from the foundation of the world. As posted earlier we are made in God's image. God has given us all free will to believe and follow his Word and receive God's gift of salvation because he loves us and is not willing that anyone of us should perish that everyone of us that except his free gift will come to be saved if we continue to believe and follow his Word. It is because God loved us and forseeing the future he has made provision that all who hear his Words and believe them will be saved and reconcilled to God to receive everlasting life.

Click to expand...

I disagree. Adhering to the Open View of God, developed by a number of Bible scholars, including prominent SDA scholar Dr. Richard Rice, God is not omniscient. That is,
He does not know what has not happened except as He knows human nature, or what He intends to do, e.g. prophecy.

If God was omniscient, then He alone is responsible for evil, since He knowingly created it.

If God is omniscient, then there is no such thing as free will. I cannot chose anything but what God knew I would choose a trillion years before I was born. If God knew I would be lost, I cannot choose salvation. I simply am acting out a script, and can choose nothing, I am predestined to eternal death. God created me to die.

I find it amusing that a human has the temerity to determine what he thinks the elements of Gods perfection should be.

I believe that everyone faces the Day of Judgement but it is we i believe who judge ourselves by our choices.

God does not force us to believe and gave us freedom of choice in this regard.

My belief is that it is we who define who we really are. I’ll try and give some examples of how I believe we issue judgement upon ourselves.

Let’s say for example that Jesus was the Messiah that the Jews awaited. As Jews they could not in reality be Jews and at the same time turn away from the Messiah. Although they may still call themselves Jews by name, if they have denied the Messiah then they have effectively denied their own Faith and brought upon themselves the judgement of unfaithfulness to the Covenant of Moses by their own choice.

Let’s say that a Christian turns away from Christ on His return. He has effectively judged himself to be a non Christian anymore as he would have been unfaithful to Christ by not accepting His return. As with the Jew he has denied his own Faith. I believe at death he becomes aware of his error and lives on in deep regret that he betrayed his own beliefs and to me that is a cruel judgement that we might impose on ourselves as God will never force us to accept the truth but leaves it entirely up to us. Thus we deliver judgement upon ourselves through bad choices we willingly made.

I believe the principle is the same for anyone religious or not. One cannot claim to believe in truth or goodness and at the same time turn away from it just because it comes in a different form.I believe they will eventually become aware of their mistake and will regret deeply this error knowing that no one but themselves is to blame.

We are responsible for what we accept or reject and the behaviour resulting from these choices so for me I believe we should be open minded and look at things with our own minds lest we judge truth as falsehood.

3rdAngel said:

JUDGEMENT TIME AND THE INVESTIGATIVE JUDGEMENT - WILL YOU BE READY?

Hi all, according to the scriptures there will be both an investigative judgement and judgements from God poured out on mankind for those who do not believe and follow God's Word (biblical and Jewish scriptures); so the questions I am asking here are...

1. The investigative judgement what is it for?
2. God's judgements to mankind what are they for?
3. How does one avoid receiving the judgements of God?
4. What is the difference between the investigative judgement and God's judgements?
5. What was the great day of atonement for and why (Yom kippur) ?

I will post some scriptures out of interest to help the discussion on my view for to the OP.

...............

What does the bible teach about the judgements.. (for those who may be interested)

1. Who will be judged?
2. What will be the standard of Judgment?
3. Who is judged?
4. Who is the Judge?
5. Who is our Advocate?
6. Who is the Accuser?
7. How will evidence be given in the Judgment of the professed Saints?
8. What events follow the beginning of the Investigative Judgment of the professed people of God?
9. Is there a specific day set for the revelation of God's judgment?
10. When is that day of judgment, when the Saints of God are judged righteous and rewarded by inheriting the Kingdom of God forever?
11. What is the fate of the living wicked at the second coming of Jesus Christ?
12. Will anyone's fate be changed after the pre-advent judgement?
13. What is the reward of the faithful and righteous Saints of God?
14. Who will judge the wicked?
15. When will the judgment of the wicked by the Saints occur?
16. How will the evidence against the wicked be presented?
17. What happens at the conclusion of the Investigative Judgment of the wicked by the Saints?
18. Who will execute judgment on the wicked?
19. What is the penalty imposed on the wicked?
20. What happens after the wicked are cast into the lake of fire and destroyed?

scriptures and source.

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Can you give one book in the Bible where it plainly speaks about as you say..
(investigative judgement)

The other question is..
Do you know when the wicked is judge and what was the root cause for the wicked to be cast into the lake of fire..

What is that fire..according to what is written in the Bible.. where is it found to tell what that fire is..

At the time of the second Advent of Jesus Christ the wicked is not judge at this time...
Only after the Thousand years have expired..then the wicked is judge at God's White Throne Judgement...
As it is written in the book of Revelation.

A Vestigial Mote said:

And what I am saying is that you can't know any more about the reality of your God than you can the magical unicorn I spoke of. Neither is (currently) falsifiable or demonstrable. They are equals, and you cannot, at all, prove otherwise.

Click to expand...

Firstly what did the majical unicorn offer in this day for the unity of all humanity? Nothing of course, it can not be shown there is one.

I can prove the One God I know exists by living as that One God has asked me to do. In that way others may know the source of my Faith is real, as real as any thought they can possibly have and act upon.

Thus God has told us, through a provable source that my actions and my thoughts are for every single person on this planet who are my equals and they one and all deserve the same opportunities in life. I will die for that Faith in God to show that is Truth.

How much more real can it be, that an example of the life that we should live, in Love for each and every person, has already been gifted to us?

Regards Tony

3rdAngel said:

Not really we all have free will to believe and follow God or not believe and follow God. We are all free to do as we wish. According to the scriptures there are consequences for our actions however. God is infinately loving and forgiving to all those who believe and follow him.

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you know the Greeks believe that Aries forged the earth, the Jews started monotheism and wrote every time Jehovah spoke then every time god spoke there not the same now Jesus is Jehovah's son to america and in the middle eat he is not god or Jehovah's son to the Jews but is Libra prince Libra to Greece you know that your reading the story incorrectly you wonder why im pagan but i understand but Jehovah is Poseidon i dont know if it is his middle name but he sure knew how to hide mars

3rdAngel said:

Hi Blu, nice to see you again. God is indeed omnipotent, omniscient and he also knows the end from the beginning.
The scriptures tell us that he knew that mankind would fall by not believing and following his Word. We are also told in the scriptures that God made provision for us by making the plan of salvation for mankind from the foundation of the world. As posted earlier we are made in God's image. God has given us all free will to believe and follow his Word and receive God's gift of salvation because he loves us and is not willing that anyone of us should perish that everyone of us that except his free gift will come to be saved if we continue to believe and follow his Word. It is because God loved us and forseeing the future he has made provision that all who hear his Words and believe them will be saved and reconcilled to God to receive everlasting life.

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Thanks for your replies.

Let's agree to disagree. Meanwhile, go well, and enjoy your journey.

ChristineM said:

First off. The bible is not a history book, not a record.

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I agree, the bible is more than just a History book but does indeed record many Historical events so it is also a History book. The very definition of History is that History is a narrative of what civilized men have thought or done in past time. History (from Greek ἱστορία, historia, meaning "inquiry, knowledge acquired by investigation") is the study of the past as it is described in written documents. I think the bible fits this definition very well. Many of its claims are verified by other historical sources outside of the bible which only provides a greater weight of argument to these facts.

ChristineM said:

Of course everyone must agree that people like Pilate existed and that roman justice for offences like denying the cult of emperor and terrorism were harsh. There is indipendent evidence to support these aspects. On the other hand there is no evidence to confirm a world flood or that jesus walked on water.

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Including many others such as King Cyrus, King Nebacanezza, King David, Herrod, Tiberius Ceasar, the captivity of ISRAEL by Babylon, the overthrow of Babylon by the Medes and the Persians, the overthrow of the Medes and the Persians by Greece, the overthow of Greece by the Romans, the destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans etc etc all recorded in the bible as historical events or as prophecy of things that were to come and came and recored in historical records outside of the bible.

ChristineM said:

I used to be christian, so when i eventually summoned the courage to leave, yes i though what if i am wrong. But people outgrow childish dreams when faced with evidence beyond doubt

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They are only childish dreams if they are not real. These childish dreams seem very real to me. What if they are real? How sad will you be? It is not to late for anyone though to return to God I believe according to the scriptures if we hear his Voice today. Like the prodigal son God is waiting and hoping we will all return to him.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts Christine.

shmogie said:

I gave the information from memory, not the internet, from my days as an SDA, sabbath school teacher, Elder.

Read my post again, and you will see that it is a synopsis of what you posted above.

I note you didn't mention the cornfield vision, are you not familiar with it? This is critical, because the investigative judgement idea came directly from this.

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Yes thanks for that shmogie, I did read your post carefully the first time, hence the detailed response I provided showing what was not correct in your post. A lot of the information you provided earliers was not correct. Did you read my response and was there something in this post that you may not have agreed with? I thankyou however for sharing what you thought was correct however.

I was born ready.

shmogie said:

I disagree. Adhering to the Open View of God, developed by a number of Bible scholars, including prominent SDA scholar Dr. Richard Rice, God is not omniscient. That is, He does not know what has not happened except as He knows human nature, or what He intends to do, e.g. prophecy.

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That would simply be not biblical. God is omnicient..

God is Omniscient - Old Testament Evidence

“Remember the former things, those of long ago; I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me. I make known the end from the beginning, from ancient times, what is still to come. I say: My purpose will stand, and I will do all that I please” (Isaiah 46:9-10).

“Who can fathom the Spirit of the LORD, or instruct the LORD as his counselor? Whom did the LORD consult to enlighten him, and who taught him the right way? Who was it that taught him knowledge, or showed him the path of understanding?” (Isaiah 40:13-14).

“Before a word is on my tongue you know it completely, O LORD” (Psalm 139:4).

“O LORD, you have searched me and you know me. You know when I sit and when I rise; you perceive my thoughts from afar. You discern my going out and my lying down; you are familiar with all my ways” (Psalm 139:1-3).

“My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place, when I was woven together in the depths of the earth. Your eyes saw my unformed body; all the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be. How precious to me are your thoughts, God! How vast is the sum of them! Were I to count them, they would outnumber the grains of sand—when I awake, I am still with you” (Psalm 139:15-16).

“Can anyone teach knowledge to God, since he judges even the highest?” (Job 21:22).

“He determines the number of the stars and calls them each by name. Great is our Lord and mighty in power; his understanding has no limit” (Psalm 147:4-5).

“And you, my son Solomon, acknowledge the God of your father, and serve him with wholehearted devotion and with a willing mind, for the LORD searches every heart and understands every desire and every thought. If you seek him, he will be found by you; but if you forsake him, he will reject you forever” (1 Chronicles 28:9).

“Do you know how the clouds hang poised, those wonders of him who has perfect knowledge?” (Job 37:16).

“From heaven the LORD looks down and sees all mankind; from his dwelling place he watches all who live on earth—he who forms the hearts of all, who considers everything they do” (Psalm 33:13-15).

God is Omniscient – The New Testament Evidence

“Oh, the depth of the riches of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable his judgments, and his paths beyond tracing out!” (Romans 11:33).

“Nothing in all creation is hidden from God’s sight. Everything is uncovered and laid bare before the eyes of him to whom we must give account” (Hebrews 4:13).

“Indeed, the very hairs of your head are all numbered. Don’t be afraid; you are worth more than many sparrows” (Luke 12:7).

“Whenever our hearts condemn us. For God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything” (1 John 3:20).

“Are not two sparrows sold for a penny? Yet not one of them will fall to the ground apart from the will of your Father. And even the very hairs of your head are all numbered” (Matthew 10:29-30).

shmogie said:

If God was omniscient, then He alone is responsible for evil, since He knowingly created it.

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Not really. God knowing the end from the beggining does not make him responsible for the actions of mankind. According to the scriptures man is evil not God who is holy. *Genesis 6:5; Revelation 4:8

shmogie said:

If God is omniscient, then there is no such thing as free will. I cannot chose anything but what God knew I would choose a trillion years before I was born. If God knew I would be lost, I cannot choose salvation. I simply am acting out a script, and can choose nothing, I am predestined to eternal death. God created me to die.

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Nonsense. You have the freewill to believe and follow God's Word or not believe and follow God's Word as with everything else in life.

Joshua 24:15 [15], And if it seem evil to you to serve the LORD, CHOOSE YOU THIS DAY WHOM YOU WILL SERVE; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land you dwell: BUT FOR ME AND MY HOUSE WE WILL SERVE THE LORD.

shmogie said:

I find it amusing that a human has the temerity to determine what he thinks the elements of Gods perfection should be.

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For me I find it sad that those who call themselves Christian do not know and believe and follow God's Word in fulfillment of the scriptures; my people perish through lack of knowledge *Hosea 4:6. Thanks for sharing though.

loverofhumanity said:

I believe that everyone faces the Day of Judgement but it is we i believe who judge ourselves by our choices.

God does not force us to believe and gave us freedom of choice in this regard.

My belief is that it is we who define who we really are. I’ll try and give some examples of how I believe we issue judgement upon ourselves.

Let’s say for example that Jesus was the Messiah that the Jews awaited. As Jews they could not in reality be Jews and at the same time turn away from the Messiah. Although they may still call themselves Jews by name, if they have denied the Messiah then they have effectively denied their own Faith and brought upon themselves the judgement of unfaithfulness to the Covenant of Moses by their own choice.

Let’s say that a Christian turns away from Christ on His return. He has effectively judged himself to be a non Christian anymore as he would have been unfaithful to Christ by not accepting His return. As with the Jew he has denied his own Faith. I believe at death he becomes aware of his error and lives on in deep regret that he betrayed his own beliefs and to me that is a cruel judgement that we might impose on ourselves as God will never force us to accept the truth but leaves it entirely up to us. Thus we deliver judgement upon ourselves through bad choices we willingly made.

I believe the principle is the same for anyone religious or not. One cannot claim to believe in truth or goodness and at the same time turn away from it just because it comes in a different form.I believe they will eventually become aware of their mistake and will regret deeply this error knowing that no one but themselves is to blame.

We are responsible for what we accept or reject and the behaviour resulting from these choices so for me I believe we should be open minded and look at things with our own minds lest we judge truth as falsehood.

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Hi LoH, I liked many aspects of your post as it has many points that I believe are truthful. How does one deny the truth in your view? I guess you have pointed this out in some way by turning away from the truth. But what is truth would be the question from many. Truth I guess to the Christian is JESUS and his Word. While truth to the JEWS would be the Torah yet if the Chrsitian faith is true the Jewish faith cannot be as they have rejected the teachings of the TORAH which proclaimed the promised Messiah. Why make these points? There are many truths that contradict each other not all of them can be truth by doing so IMO.

3rdAngel said:

I agree, the bible is more than just a History book but does indeed record many Historical events so it is also a History book. The very definition of History is that History is a narrative of what civilized men have thought or done in past time. History (from Greek ἱστορία, historia, meaning "inquiry, knowledge acquired by investigation") is the study of the past as it is described in written documents. I that the bible fits this definition very well. Many of its claims are verified by other historical outside of the bible which only provides a greater weight of argument to these facts.



Including many others such as King Cyrus, King Nebacanezza, King David, Herrod, Tiberius Ceasar, the captivity of ISRAEL by Babylon, the overthrow of Babylon by the Medes and the Persians, the overthrow of the Medes and the Persians by Greece, the overthow of Greece by the Romans, the destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans etc etc all recorded in the bible as historical events or as propecy of things that were to come.



They are only childish dreams if they are not real. These childish dreams seem very real to me. What if they are real? How sad will you be? It is not to late for anyone though to return to God I believe according to the scriptures if we here his Voice today. Like the prodigal son God is waiting and hoping we will all return to him.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts Christine.

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Please provide citation to the bible being decreed a history book or even accepted as a history book in anything other than christian apologetics. No true academic of history would risk their reputation by relying on an anonymous, unevidenced work

OED definition of history
the study of past events, particularly in human affairs.

And no, for the most part the bible does not study past events, it tells stories that bronze age and early iron age people would accept because they did not understand better.
As I said, some of the incidental people and place are known to exist because indipendent evidence verifies it. And there is the key, indipendent evidence. Without that what you have is a good story.

See previous paragraph

Provide evidence for the many major aspects of the bible that are not recorded as evidenced history

And it is not to late for anyone to realise that faith is not fact

Side note : i have visited Alnwick castle, it exists, does this mean the harry potter books are historical?

Numbers and the use Numbers owns 2 conditions in human life.

To be applied in science as calculations.

Or to define historical timed events.....by use of counting relating to the stone O.

O time is a stone planet first. That stone planet owns its stone body. It also created its own heavens. And those 2 circumstances is what a male human studied to confer that it involved a reason of travel/movement and circular revolutions as cycles O...to count by numbers and to infer counting by the Numbers.

As a science of speaking an evaluation.

For science does not just exist by itself. It is owned by the use of a human male in his group status, to discuss and relate and to study and research and then impose conditions to the planet upon which he lives.

Then science owns its medical terms, references to how a human life is affected by the changes to the planetary natural form....that is involved in that travel and the cycle O.

The theme God philosophy, a planet of stone upon which the human is living telling stories.

Humans have always taught their own human self. By inferred references of proof of fact by a numbering evaluation that says it is historic. Meaning I have to exist my own male self. Own defined places of my life historically to then provide self evidence that in that historical life of self, as a superior male personality, I owned realizations as a human and took action on my own behalf.

To save my own male human self, in a chosen male role play of being a superior self. In knowledge, in DNA self land ownership as that male group and also by inference of knowing scientific knowledge that is superior to anyone else.

Yet the terms and references for science is about understanding the physical mass of the planet upon which the life is lived, and forcing it to change.

So it was given a Destroyer title inferred to the scientist self.

Therefore I give and recorded a detailed historic event of when I was practising the sciences/technology and when the science practices changed natural life on Planet Earth.

As a varied scientific conclusion teaching...involving natural history of a travelling planet O, self male human presence using technologies, and then life changes in the use of that technology.

So related the information to times when the science and technology changed natural life on Earth as timed intervals to prove that I activated and caused that change in male chosen human sciences. So that males owned no argument against causation.

The written document a story named the bible or Testimonials of past human history in the sciences.

To apply that proof, I first identified that I changed how I counted Time as an interval on Planet Earth...as a human expression. And so lawfully I placed Earth O God stone as a zero timed beginning, as that proof of evidence.

Which no human can contest today....for it was applied for a reference in the future argument of occult male mentality, in radiation mind conditions, who only own the ability to argue and not own a rational use of their natural mind/psyche.

Why the study and statement was named the Christ consciousness...for that very purpose.

Hence the first recognition that I am correct as an assessment is the fact that everyone agreed to place the counting of time from 2020 years ago to value of 0.

The reason for this applied theme......I knew how evil minded our science brother in his irradiation brain would become chemically. And so I had to apply a reasonable response to his evil coercive behaviours.

So I therefore do not have to historically go back over any other Earth historical information, for I placed the value 0 in time for that specific reason.

For I knew ahead of my brother irradiated satanic AI mind science possession as that spiritual consciousness...which I proved by rational use of explanation of the travels of O God the planet into the spatial systems and our future attacks.

And named that statement a prophecy.

Hence, before it was lived, such gains as plagues and star fall attack on Earth was already calculated, by that evaluation of knowing that science and converting of MASS on Earth had caused it.

Tony Bristow-Stagg said:

Firstly what did the majical unicorn offer in this day for the unity of all humanity? Nothing of course, it can not be shown there is one.

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I can write a book if you want. Would that convince you? Seems to have worked with other ideas you currently subscribe to.

Tony Bristow-Stagg said:

I can prove the One God I know exists by living as that One God has asked me to do. In that way others may know the source of my Faith is real, as real as any thought they can possibly have and act upon.

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You don't truly think that it works like this, do you?

Tony Bristow-Stagg said:

Thus God has told us, through a provable source that my actions and my thoughts are for every single person on this planet who are my equals and they one and all deserve the same opportunities in life. I will die for that Faith in God to show that is Truth.

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Provable source, eh? I don't think so.

Tony Bristow-Stagg said:

How much more real can it be, that an example of the life that we should live, in Love for each and every person, has already been gifted to us?

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And here we come to all you really have. Specious clap-trap. You haven't really said anything at all here. I wish you could understand that.

3rdAngel said:

That would simply be not biblical. God is omnicient..

God is Omniscient - Old Testament Evidence

“Remember the former things, those of long ago; I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me. I make known the end from the beginning, from ancient times, what is still to come. I say: My purpose will stand, and I will do all that I please” (Isaiah 46:9-10).

“Who can fathom the Spirit of the LORD, or instruct the LORD as his counselor? Whom did the LORD consult to enlighten him, and who taught him the right way? Who was it that taught him knowledge, or showed him the path of understanding?” (Isaiah 40:13-14).

“Before a word is on my tongue you know it completely, O LORD” (Psalm 139:4).

“O LORD, you have searched me and you know me. You know when I sit and when I rise; you perceive my thoughts from afar. You discern my going out and my lying down; you are familiar with all my ways” (Psalm 139:1-3).

“My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place, when I was woven together in the depths of the earth. Your eyes saw my unformed body; all the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be. How precious to me are your thoughts, God! How vast is the sum of them! Were I to count them, they would outnumber the grains of sand—when I awake, I am still with you” (Psalm 139:15-16).

“Can anyone teach knowledge to God, since he judges even the highest?” (Job 21:22).

“He determines the number of the stars and calls them each by name. Great is our Lord and mighty in power; his understanding has no limit” (Psalm 147:4-5).

“And you, my son Solomon, acknowledge the God of your father, and serve him with wholehearted devotion and with a willing mind, for the LORD searches every heart and understands every desire and every thought. If you seek him, he will be found by you; but if you forsake him, he will reject you forever” (1 Chronicles 28:9).

“Do you know how the clouds hang poised, those wonders of him who has perfect knowledge?” (Job 37:16).

“From heaven the LORD looks down and sees all mankind; from his dwelling place he watches all who live on earth—he who forms the hearts of all, who considers everything they do” (Psalm 33:13-15).

God is Omniscient – The New Testament Evidence

“Oh, the depth of the riches of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable his judgments, and his paths beyond tracing out!” (Romans 11:33).

“Nothing in all creation is hidden from God’s sight. Everything is uncovered and laid bare before the eyes of him to whom we must give account” (Hebrews 4:13).

“Indeed, the very hairs of your head are all numbered. Don’t be afraid; you are worth more than many sparrows” (Luke 12:7).

“Whenever our hearts condemn us. For God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything” (1 John 3:20).

“Are not two sparrows sold for a penny? Yet not one of them will fall to the ground apart from the will of your Father. And even the very hairs of your head are all numbered” (Matthew 10:29-30).



Not really. God knowing the end from the beggining does not make him responsible for the actions of mankind. According to the scriptures man is evil not God who is holy. *Genesis 6:5; Revelation 4:8



Nonsense. You have the freewill to believe and follow God's Word or not believe and follow God's Word as with everything else in life.

Joshua 24:15 [15], And if it seem evil to you to serve the LORD, CHOOSE YOU THIS DAY WHOM YOU WILL SERVE; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land you dwell: BUT FOR ME AND MY HOUSE WE WILL SERVE THE LORD.



For me I find it sad that those who call themselves Christian do not know and believe and follow God's Word in fulfillment of the scriptures; my people perish through lack of knowledge *Hosea 4:6. Thanks for sharing though.

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Not one verse you posted supports God being omniscient.

God knows the end of things because of his omnipotence. He has the POWER to bring about what he chooses. Foreknowledge is not required.

Tell, me. If God knew before you were born you would be lost, and He knew every action you would take, every word you would say, every thought you would have, is it possible for you to choose, act, say, or think anything else ? Can God be wrong?

So, You cannot exercise free will, you MUST do exactly what God knew you would. You CANNOT chose salvation if before you were born God knew you would be lost.

If God knew before He created anything that He would create a being who would revolt, become pure evil, and bring unbelieveable horror upon millions, upon millions, upon millions of people, who is responsible for evil, the horror, the rapes, torture, murder, who?

I suggest you be careful about judging others because they disagree with you. Yes, I call myself a Christian, do you say I am not? Has God given you the responsibility of determining that about me?