Evolution My ToE

dad · Jan 8, 2020

Subduction Zone said:
The agreement is very broad, and at times refuted. Such as the Exodus. Using the timing of the Bible the Hebrews escaped Egypt and went back to . . . Egypt. At that time what is now Israel was part of Egypt's empire.

Try using the right timing.

So what if David was from Bethlehem? That does not matter in any way. And no real evidence of Mary's descent has ever been presented.

The records are said to have existed at the temple, which got destroyed. Jesus gave us the record though, by including it in the NT.

A census would not have one go back to where one came from.

"
Classic Commentary

The census or enrollment, which, according to Luke 2:1, was the occasion of the journey of Joseph and Mary to Bethlehem where Jesus was born, is connected with a decree of Augustus embracing the Greek-Roman world. This decree must have been carried out in Palestine by Herod and probably in accordance with the Jewish method--each going to his own city--rather than the Roman.

While Josephus does not mention the Herodian census, Luke carefully distinguishes the census at the time of Jesus' birth as "first," (i.e. first in a series of enrollments connected either with Quirinius or with the imperial policy inaugurated by the decree of Augustus).

The geographical work of [Herod] Agrippa, together with the interest of the emperor in the organization and finances of the empire and the attention which he gave to the provinces are indirectly corroborative of Luke's statement. Augustus himself conducted a census in Italy in and in Gaul in 727/27* [see roman dating system, ‘auc'] and had a census taken in other provinces. For Egypt there is evidence of a regular periodic census every 14 years extending back to 773/20 and it is not improbable that this procedure was introduced by Augustus.

The time of the decree is stated only in general terms by Luke, and it may have been as early as 727/27 or later in 746-8, its execution in different provinces and subject kingdoms being carried out at different times. Luke dates the census in the kingdom of Herod specifically by connecting it with the administrative functions of Quirinius in Syria. But as P. Quintilius Varus was the legate of Syria just before and after the death of Herod from 748/6-750/4 and his predecessor was C. Sentius Saturninus from 745/9-748/6 there seems to be no place for Quirinius during the closing years of Herod's reign.

Tertullian indeed speaks of Saturninus as legate at the time of Jesus' birth. It is possible that the connection of the census with Quirinius may be due to his having brought to completion what was begun by one of his predecessors; or Quirinius may have been commissioned especially by the emperor to conduct a census in Syria."
Did a Census Really Bring Joseph and Mary to Bethlehem? - Topical Studies
As I pointed out, you chose to view and intepret things in a way that is insulting to God and Scripture.

dad · Jan 8, 2020

Mestemia said:
What does that have to do with investigating the Pregnancy of Mary?

Is it your claim she was spiritually pregnant?

You can't investigate that either. Add it to the list.

What can you do?

McBell · Jan 8, 2020

dad said:
You can't investigate that either. Add it to the list.

What can you do?

Oh crap.
You win.
The ONLY thing left is blind faith...

Subduction Zone · Jan 8, 2020

dad said:
History abounds with spirits actually. That refutes those who claim there are none, not me.

Really? Please find some examples. Links to a valid source is a must.

Look up the meaning of 'foretold' or prophesy.

i clearly understand this better than you do. Please do not deflect from your errors. A literary tool is not a con job. Why do you keep claiming that your Bible is a con job?

In your head doesn't count.

Now dad, you know that I gave you a link that refuted your fish bowl Earth just yesterday. You have never supported your claims because there is no support for them. So you make false claims about others not supporting their claims.

Don't try to offer family differences in opinion as some excuse for unbelief and blasphemy.

Whoa. Wait a second. I am not the one claiming that his God is a liar. If anyone blasphemes here that would be you. And my point was that you and countless other Christians make up their own nonsense. If your claims were valid you could support them. You are no different from a Mormon in how you can support your claims.

In His word.

You would need to prove that. The Bible does not even make that claim about itself. And you are blaspheming right here. You are saying that God's word is terribly incompetent. Not a wise move on your part.

More blasphemy based on ignorance and denial.

No, we know that Mary had a child. We just don't know the father. That is hardly blasphemy.

We do know no man was involved, only God.

No, that is just your myth. One that you cannot support.

dad, please do me a favor. Try to find one argument that you can support rationally.

Subduction Zone · Jan 8, 2020

dad said:
You can't investigate that either. Add it to the list.

What can you do?

Not jump to unsupported and insane assumptions maybe?

dad · Jan 8, 2020

Mestemia said:
Oh crap.
You win.
The ONLY thing left is blind faith...

For TOE, yes.

McBell · Jan 8, 2020

dad said:
For TOE, yes.

Oh, my.
I see what you did there.
How will The ToE ever survive now?

Oh wait, the evidence...
Never mind.

dad · Jan 8, 2020

Subduction Zone said:
Really? Please find some examples. Links to a valid source is a must.

"The land of ancient Egypt was alive with the spirit of the gods. The sun god Ra broke from the darkness every morning in his great boat, bringing the light, and many of the gods watched over the people by night as the stars. Osiris caused the Nile River to flood its banks and fertilize the land while Khnum directed its flow. Isis and her sister Nephthys walked with the people of the land in life and protected them after death, as did many of the other gods, and Bastet guarded the lives of women and watched over the home. Tenenet was the goddess of beer and brewing and also present at childbirth, while Hathor, who had many roles, was one's close companion at any party or festival as the Lady of Drunkenness."
Gods & Goddesses of Ancient Egypt - A Brief History

A literary tool is not a con job.

Pretending a prophecy existed when actually being written after the fact is not a tool of people who tell the truth.

Now dad, you know that I gave you a link that refuted your fish bowl Earth just yesterday.

You posted a link dealing with how light is seen here in our time and space. Nothing whatsoever to do with what time is like in far space.

You would need to prove that. The Bible does not even make that claim about itself.

For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.
Hebrews 4:12 | NIV |
All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.
2 Timothy 3:16-17 | NIV |
Your word is a lamp for my feet,
a light on my path.
Psalm 119:105 | NIV |
Do not merely listen to the word, and so deceive yourselves. Do what it says.
James 1:22 | NIV |
How can a young person stay on the path of purity?
By living according to your word.
Psalm 119:9 | NIV |
He replied, “Blessed rather are those who hear the word of God and obey it.”
Luke 11:28 | NIV |
The grass withers and the flowers fall,
but the word of our God endures forever.
Isaiah 40:8 | NIV |
As for God, his way is perfect:
The Lord’s word is flawless;
he shields all who take refuge in him.
Psalm 18:30 | NIV |
Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice is like a wise man who built his house on the rock.
Matthew 7:24 | NIV |
Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.
Matthew 24:35 | NIV |
Do everything without grumbling or arguing, so that you may become blameless and pure, children of God without fault in a warped and crooked generation. Then you will shine among them like stars in the sky as you hold firmly to the word of life.
Philippians 2:14-16a | NIV |
The unfolding of your words gives light;
it gives understanding to the simple.
Psalm 119:130 | NIV |
Jesus answered, “It is written: ‘Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.’”
Matthew 4:4 | NIV |
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
John 1:1 | NIV |
For the word of the Lord is right and true;
he is faithful in all he does.
Psalm 33:4 | NIV |
Whoever believes in me, as Scripture has said, rivers of living water will flow from within them.
John 7:38 | NIV |
In God, whose word I praise—
in God I trust and am not afraid.
What can mere mortals do to me?
Psalm 56:4 | NIV |
For the Lord gives wisdom;
from his mouth come knowledge and understanding.
Proverbs 2:6 | NIV |
Like newborn babies, crave pure spiritual milk, so that by it you may grow up in your salvation.
1 Peter 2:2 | NIV |
To the Jews who had believed him, Jesus said, “If you hold to my teaching, you are really my disciples. Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”
John 8:31-32 | NIV |
Therefore, get rid of all moral filth and the evil that is so prevalent and humbly accept the word planted in you, which can save you.
James 1:21 | NIV |
He humbled you, causing you to hunger and then feeding you with manna, which neither you nor your ancestors had known, to teach you that man does not live on bread alone but on every word that comes from the mouth of the Lord.
Deuteronomy 8:3 | NIV |
You make your saving help my shield,
and your right hand sustains me;
your help has made me great.
You provide a broad path for my feet,
so that my ankles do not give way.
Psalm 18:35-36 | NIV |
The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.
John 1:14 | NIV |
The Son is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven.Heb 1:3"

52 Bible Verses about the Word of God

No, we know that Mary had a child. We just don't know the father.

Joh 7:29 - But I know him: for I am from him, and he hath sent me.

Joh 8:55 - Yet ye have not known him; but I know him: and if I should say, I know him not, I shall be a liar like unto you

dad · Jan 8, 2020

Mestemia said:
Oh, my.
I see what you did there.
How will The ToE ever survive now?

Oh wait, the evidence...
Never mind.

There is no evidence for TOE. Post some if you disagree.

Subduction Zone · Jan 8, 2020

dad said:
"The land of ancient Egypt was alive with the spirit of the gods. The sun god Ra broke from the darkness every morning in his great boat, bringing the light, and many of the gods watched over the people by night as the stars. Osiris caused the Nile River to flood its banks and fertilize the land while Khnum directed its flow. Isis and her sister Nephthys walked with the people of the land in life and protected them after death, as did many of the other gods, and Bastet guarded the lives of women and watched over the home. Tenenet was the goddess of beer and brewing and also present at childbirth, while Hathor, who had many roles, was one's close companion at any party or festival as the Lady of Drunkenness."
Gods & Goddesses of Ancient Egypt - A Brief History

You do realize that was not meant to be taken literally, don't you? It is a history of the religious beliefs of Egypt, Not a history of spirits. dad defeats himself again

Pretending a prophecy existed when actually being written after the fact is not a tool of people who tell the truth.

Do you seriously think that the Bible tries to tell he truth? Oh my . . .

You posted a link dealing with how light is seen here in our time and space. Nothing whatsoever to do with what time is like in far space.

Correct, and it is evidence that rates of decay are the same elsewhere, meaning that no physical constants have changed. You have yet to provide any evidence for your claims. If you can't support your claims with evidence you lose no matter how poor you think the opposing evidence is.

For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.
Hebrews 4:12 | NIV |
All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.
2 Timothy 3:16-17 | NIV |
Your word is a lamp for my feet,
a light on my path.
Psalm 119:105 | NIV |
Do not merely listen to the word, and so deceive yourselves. Do what it says.
James 1:22 | NIV |
How can a young person stay on the path of purity?
By living according to your word.
Psalm 119:9 | NIV |
He replied, “Blessed rather are those who hear the word of God and obey it.”
Luke 11:28 | NIV |
The grass withers and the flowers fall,
but the word of our God endures forever.
Isaiah 40:8 | NIV |
As for God, his way is perfect:
The Lord’s word is flawless;
he shields all who take refuge in him.
Psalm 18:30 | NIV |
Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice is like a wise man who built his house on the rock.
Matthew 7:24 | NIV |
Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.
Matthew 24:35 | NIV |
Do everything without grumbling or arguing, so that you may become blameless and pure, children of God without fault in a warped and crooked generation. Then you will shine among them like stars in the sky as you hold firmly to the word of life.
Philippians 2:14-16a | NIV |
The unfolding of your words gives light;
it gives understanding to the simple.
Psalm 119:130 | NIV |
Jesus answered, “It is written: ‘Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.’”
Matthew 4:4 | NIV |
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
John 1:1 | NIV |
For the word of the Lord is right and true;
he is faithful in all he does.
Psalm 33:4 | NIV |
Whoever believes in me, as Scripture has said, rivers of living water will flow from within them.
John 7:38 | NIV |
In God, whose word I praise—
in God I trust and am not afraid.
What can mere mortals do to me?
Psalm 56:4 | NIV |
For the Lord gives wisdom;
from his mouth come knowledge and understanding.
Proverbs 2:6 | NIV |
Like newborn babies, crave pure spiritual milk, so that by it you may grow up in your salvation.
1 Peter 2:2 | NIV |
To the Jews who had believed him, Jesus said, “If you hold to my teaching, you are really my disciples. Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”
John 8:31-32 | NIV |
Therefore, get rid of all moral filth and the evil that is so prevalent and humbly accept the word planted in you, which can save you.
James 1:21 | NIV |
He humbled you, causing you to hunger and then feeding you with manna, which neither you nor your ancestors had known, to teach you that man does not live on bread alone but on every word that comes from the mouth of the Lord.
Deuteronomy 8:3 | NIV |
You make your saving help my shield,
and your right hand sustains me;
your help has made me great.
You provide a broad path for my feet,
so that my ankles do not give way.
Psalm 18:35-36 | NIV |
The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.
John 1:14 | NIV |
The Son is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven.Heb 1:3"

52 Bible Verses about the Word of God

Joh 7:29 - But I know him: for I am from him, and he hath sent me.

Joh 8:55 - Yet ye have not known him; but I know him: and if I should say, I know him not, I shall be a liar like unto you

Thank you for supporting my claim. You are once again your own worst enemy. None of those say anything about the Bible being without error. None of those say anything about the Bible being "God's word". You really should try to learn what is and what is not evidence.

Subduction Zone · Jan 8, 2020

dad said:
There is no evidence for TOE. Post some if you disagree.

So you do not understand the nature of evidence. Only two sorts of people can make the sort of claim that you just did. One either has to lie or have no understanding at all of the nature of evidence to make that claim.

Once again I invite you to learn what is and what is not evidence. Since you do not understand the nature of evidence your demand is unreasonable. As soon as you learn what is and what is not evidence you can legitimately demand it.

McBell · Jan 8, 2020

dad said:
There is no evidence for TOE. Post some if you disagree.

For your pants

YoursTrue · Jan 8, 2020

Mestemia said:
View attachment 36141

For your pants

There really isn't any evidence except that which is imagined as evidence to fit in a theory.

Subduction Zone · Jan 8, 2020

YoursTrue said:
There really isn't any evidence except that which is imagined as evidence to fit in a theory.

No, but then we can all tell that you have not had a scientific education. In the sciences there is a very clear definition of evidence. No imagination needed. Her is the TLDR version:

"Scientific evidence is evidence that serves to either support or counter a scientific theory or hypothesis."

When purported evidence is provided for you you only need to ask yourself two questions. Is the idea being supported a scientific theory or hypothesis, and that boils down to one question, is it testable. In the case of the theory of evolution the answer is "Yes". The theory can be falsified by quite a few tests if it is wrong. The second question that you need to ask is "does this observation as presented support the theory". If you find yourself trying to say "Yes but . . . " you have already lost. It is evidence. Now you may claim that that is not that high of a standard. And you may be correct. Which makes creationism look even worse since it fails these qualifications. There is no version of creationism that I know of that is supported by scientific evidence.

Subduction Zone · Jan 8, 2020

And I want to make something clear. I do not think that either of our two latest posters are lying. They simply do not understand what is and what is not evidence. @dad by this time seems to realize that he would have to lie if he understood what is and what is not evidence so he uses the ostrich defense when it comes to learning this. @YoursTrue appears to have never had any exposure to the topic.

McBell · Jan 9, 2020

YoursTrue said:
There really isn't any evidence except that which is imagined as evidence to fit in a theory.

For your pants

Subduction Zone · Jan 9, 2020

Mestemia said:
View attachment 36143
For your pants

Not lying. Since that would be purposefully making a false claim with the intention to mislead. I think that he is merely uneducated.

McBell · Jan 9, 2020

Subduction Zone said:
And I want to make something clear. I do not think that either of our two latest posters are lying. They simply do not understand what is and what is not evidence. @dad by this time seems to realize that he would have to lie if he understood what is and what is not evidence so he uses the ostrich defense when it comes to learning this. @YoursTrue appears to have never had any exposure to the topic.

I disagree completely.
They are lying to themselves at the bare minimum.
That they have each been shown numerous times by numerous members in numerous threads and they still post the same blatantly false comments further indicates their "ignorance" is completely intentional.

McBell · Jan 9, 2020

Subduction Zone said:
Not lying. Since that would be purposefully making a false claim with the intention to mislead. I think that he is merely uneducated.

He is flat out making a false claim in order to deceive.
At the very least his willful ignorance is a blatant attempt to deceive himself.
And then to claim there has not been any evidence presented when what has in fact been presented far supersedes the standards for evidence they themselves hold to in order to protect their beliefs is a blatant bold face lie.

There is a difference between not accepting the evidence presented and claiming no evidence was presented.
That difference being the second one is a flat out lie.

YoursTrue · Jan 9, 2020

dad said:
There is no evidence for TOE. Post some if you disagree.

Has the evidence been posted yet?

Evolution My ToE

Undefeated

Undefeated

Resident Sourpuss

Veteran Member

Veteran Member

Undefeated

Resident Sourpuss

Undefeated

Undefeated

Veteran Member

Veteran Member

Resident Sourpuss

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)

Veteran Member

Veteran Member

Resident Sourpuss

Veteran Member

Resident Sourpuss

Resident Sourpuss

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)