Book on Gender

PoetPhilosopher · Nov 19, 2019

Estro Felino said:
Seeing how many American feminists criticize Trump for being too "manly"...

I don't think that's why they criticize him. They criticize him for:

1. Calling Hilary Clinton, whom for some reason they seem to think of as the symbol of feminism, a "nasty woman" on TV during the debates, and threatening to lock her up.

2. Also, Trump didn't want Transgender people serving in the military.

Koldo · Nov 19, 2019

@Shadow Wolf @Estro Felino @AT-AT

Since you are all on this topic, I hope you don't mind me asking: How did you figure you are a woman ?

I have always had a hard time understanding how that works. Let me explain where I am coming: If you were to ask me how I have determined that I am a man I would answer that ever since birth whenever I have looked at my body I saw a male body, and that's how I have determined that I am a man. Certainly if I were to wake up in a female body I assume that I would still consider myself a male because of how long I have identified myself with my male body, but I legitimately doubt that I would have had a hard time if I had been born in a female body in the sense that I believe I would identify myself as a woman without any problem whatsoever.

Generally I hear trans women saying that they feel they are women but I don't really feel like I am a man nor a woman. It is not related to feelings per se.

PoetPhilosopher · Nov 19, 2019

Koldo said:
@Shadow Wolf @Estro Felino @AT-AT

Since you are all on this topic, I hope you don't mind me asking: How did you figure you are a woman ?

I have always had a hard time understanding how that works. Let me explain where I am coming: If you were to ask me how I have determined that I am a man I would answer that ever since birth whenever I have looked at my body I saw a male body, and that's how I have determined that I am a man. Certainly if I were to wake up in a female body I assume that I would still consider myself a male because of how long I have identified myself with my male body, but I legitimately doubt that I would have had a hard time if I had been born in a female body in the sense that I believe I would identify myself as a woman without any problem whatsoever.

Generally I hear trans women saying that they feel they are women but I don't really feel like I am a man nor a woman. It is not related to feelings per se.

Okay. Try to visualize yourself from third person? Can you? Can you see yourself, how you actually look, in your mind?

You see, I generally can't. In third person, I am this female about my age with the same hair color.

Estro Felino · Nov 19, 2019

Koldo said:
@Shadow Wolf @Estro Felino @AT-AT

Since you are all on this topic, I hope you don't mind me asking: How did you figure you are a woman ?

What is a woman to you, to begin with?

Shadow Wolf · Nov 19, 2019

Koldo said:
@Shadow Wolf @Estro Felino @AT-AT

Since you are all on this topic, I hope you don't mind me asking: How did you figure you are a woman ?

I have always had a hard time understanding how that works. Let me explain where I am coming: If you were to ask me how I have determined that I am a man I would answer that ever since birth whenever I have looked at my body I saw a male body, and that's how I have determined that I am a man. Certainly if I were to wake up in a female body I assume that I would still consider myself a male because of how long I have identified myself with my male body, but I legitimately doubt that I would have had a hard time if I had been born in a female body in the sense that I believe I would identify myself as a woman without any problem whatsoever.

Generally I hear trans women saying that they feel they are women but I don't really feel like I am a man nor a woman. It is not related to feelings per se.

I've recognized it, from what I remember, around 3 or 4, as I started school, socialized with other kids, and learned more of the differences between boys and girls. That was around the time I began to realize I'm different,and began to learn to live in denial as i was constantly bombarded with "that's for girls, you're a boy." But it stayed with me, i had a very depressed childhood, evangelicism made it worse, and I became more depressed and suicidal. Then eventually i was able to accept myself, because the denial was toxic (and I or chosy the harder part, especially for MtF).

Saint Frankenstein · Nov 19, 2019

AT-AT said:
I'm reading a book on transgender that I would rate maybe 3.75/5 stars.

Book: "Transgender: Fact or Fetish: Reality or Delusion?"

I'll try to describe the book in my own words using my own terms.

The book is written by a philosopher who investigates. I might dismiss some of the stuff said, in such a case, if I didn't agree with it from my own personal experience.

It seeks to tackle the question of whether a person being transgender could be a fetish had by self, but later asserts that transgender people simply see themselves as the opposite gender in their mind. So say a man with gender dysphoria tries to have sex with a woman. Well in their mind, there are two women having sex.

The book later on tackles the subject of gender dysphoria, stating that once the body "decides" it's a different gender, it's like the whole body throws up a "Error" message like a computer and regardless of conventional wisdom, sometimes nothing helps. Except, perhaps, transitioning.

Anyways, ~discussion

Apparently that is written by someone named Felix Conrad. I can't find anything about him online so he is probably not an actual philosopher but just some random guy self-publishing. The "fetish" crap annoys me because it tends to totally ignore trans men. Female transvestites are very rare, but trans men are about as common as trans women so the answer should be obvious that transsexualism isn't some stupid fetish or perversion. There's plenty of scientific evidence that it has a biological basis.

PoetPhilosopher · Nov 19, 2019

Saint Frankenstein said:
Apparently that is written by someone named Felix Conrad. I can't find anything about him online so he is probably not an actual philosopher but just some random guy self-publishing. The "fetish" crap annoys me because it tends to totally ignore trans men. Female transvestites are very rare, but trans men are about as common as trans women so the answer should be obvious that transsexuality isn't some stupid fetish or perversion. There's plenty of scientific evidence that it has a biological basis.

I mean like I said, I didn't agree with the book 100%, the cover alone is clickbaity and a place of disagreement.

I guess though I tried to read the book, it's marketed at people with almost no knowledge of Trans but wanting to kind of get a better idea about it as the author explores the subject. I wouldn't actually disapprove of the book in that regard, but I need to save my money for a better book too, to get into deeper subjects.

Anyway, I just wanted to provide a fair review of what I'm reading. 3.75/5 stars in terms of usefulness for me. But keep in mind who it's meant for.

Saint Frankenstein · Nov 19, 2019

Shadow Wolf said:
transgender is a broad umbrella term that does include those with a fetish,

Which is why I dislike that term and its use as an umbrella term. The fetishists need to be kicked out from under the umbrella. I do not want to be associated with them. I already have next to nothing in common with non-binary people (who often don't even transition).

PoetPhilosopher · Nov 19, 2019

So while we're on the subject, @Saint Frankenstein - I did want to apologize for using a couple of terms, in previous threads, that the Trans community quite frankly, doesn't use. I've been feeling bad about it lately.

I should probably know better and know how to discern appropriate from inappropriate terms, but my education has lacked in the past for some years before signing up here, due to health problems I'm recovering from, quite well from mostly. I still see the world as a fresh, exciting, and dangerous place, and it might make me a bit naiive.

Saint Frankenstein · Nov 19, 2019

AT-AT said:
So while we're on the subject, @Saint Frankenstein - I did want to apologize for using a couple of terms, in previous threads, that the Trans community quite frankly, doesn't use. I've been feeling bad about it lately.

I should probably know better and know how to discern appropriate from inappropriate terms, but my education has lacked in the past for some years before signing up here, due to health problems I'm recovering from, quite well from mostly. I still see the world as a fresh, exciting, and dangerous place, and it might make me a bit naiive.

No worries. I know you didn't mean anything bad by it.

Galateasdream · Jan 20, 2020

Autogynephillia is a hot button issue for the trans community. I almost got booted from a trans forum for simply using the term!

Here's another hot take on the idea:

Book on Gender

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member

Koldo

Outstanding Member

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member

Estro Felino

Believer in free will

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber

Saint Frankenstein

Wanderer From Afar

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member

Saint Frankenstein

Wanderer From Afar

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member

Saint Frankenstein

Wanderer From Afar

Galateasdream

Active Member