Democrate part is communist

Jollybear · Nov 9, 2019

metis said:
Ramping-up the deficit by roughly $1 TRILLION per year under Trump's tax cuts is not conservative nor libertarian since it places undo burden on the next generations.

The way you deal with that is by cutting spending. Cutting taxes means the budget is lower. Lower budget means you got to spend less. Trump is trying to spend less and he has taken funds away from certain things. But the dems are fighting him on some things. Remember, hes not a king. Cant put all the blame on him.

Also, how is it Christian to help the rich but screw the poor, as these tax cuts have done and will do over the long haul?

Its not christian to get government to take from the ritch to give to the poor. Its christian to take and direct your own money to the poor. The otherway is theft and theft is UN-CHRISTIAN. Youve tikpped it upside down. Ever see those horrer movies where the demon tips the cross upside down? Well, ya, satan does that with everything.

And as Trump continues to act as an autocrat, how is that supposedly "libertarian"? Is putting brown-skinned children into cages in order to "send a message" libertarian? Etc.?

Its not about brown skin, its about immigration inforcement.

Also, if its about brown skin, then i gauss obama is against brown skin people then since he has deported more illegals then trump has.

Get real.

Valjean · Nov 9, 2019

Jollybear said:
I agree governments role is police, military, prisons. I disagree its education or healthcare.

And we've seen the results of that: decreasing educational attainment, unaffordable colleges, and the world's most expensive and convoluted healthcare system.

Right, cronyism is bad. Government should not give into bribes from businesses.

Agreed -- but what choice do they have? Without donations from corporate interests, politicians won't get elected or re-elected. The Republican's rollback of election regulations allow pretty much unlimited donations from anyone -- and the corporastists have all the money.
Elections are now bought, and politicians are become the legislative puppets of the rich; wholly owned subsidiaries of economic royalists and bankers.

bad businesses get exposed, as that happens they will go out of business. Let the market decide, not government.

Check your history. Without government regulation, corporations will run roughshod over the interests of common people; monopolies will form and we'll get a repeat of the gilded age. There's a reason both Roosevelts sought to rein in bankers and robber barons.

No, thats not true. As the ritch get richer and companies do better, EVERYONE benefits. As the tide rises, everyones boat goes up.

How's that been working out over the past few decades? The rising tide's raising only the yachts, the middle class is stagnating and the poor increasing.

Friedman's Chicago school economics doesn't work. The wealth doesn't trickle down, the rich aren't creating jobs -- except, perhaps, in China and Vietnam.
Deregulation and free trade are turning the US into a third world country.

When business suffers, everyone suffers. Communism makes business suffer.

Business thrived in the high tax, high regulation, unionized '50s and '60s -- and so did the middle class. This was the period of our greatest growth.
High taxes used to incentivize business to plow profits back into the business. Now they can make more money moving their business overseas.

Thats not true. If a country has left wing programs, thats not the same as everything in that country is left wing. So, it gives the illusion that the left is creating the prosperity and ITS NOT.

All countries are mixed economies, but unregulated, free-market capitalism is a zero sum game that creates income inequality, widespread poverty and inadequate social services.

Capatalism creates wealth. Communism SPENDS wealth, it dont create it.

Capitalism creates wealth for the capitalists; for the rest of the people -- not so much.

If schools are private, then they must compete more. Public schools dont need to compete because they will get funded by tax money irregardless.

So, private schools have an INCENTIVE to make sure there education system is the BEST. Because if it dont, it wont do well in business.

Sounds reasonable on paper, but that hasn't been the experience. Most magnate schools don't have better outcomes than the public schools. Moreover, they're attracting a wealthier clientele and draining public funds from public schools. I expect once they've collapsed the public education system they'll raise prices and become an expensive, unregulated tax burden.
Unregulated competition creates monopolies, not "healthy competition."

Augustus · Nov 9, 2019

Jollybear said:
Trump cut taxes on businesses. Thats not a very communist thing to do.

So the difference between capitalism and communism is 14% corporate tax?

Jollybear said:
So, communists speaking out against trump. Let that sink in for a moment. Ok, incase it didnt sink in, that means trump is not a communist if the communist website itself talks against him.

Stalin spoke out against Trotsky. Can't have been a commie then if the leader of the Communist world talked against him.

So Dems = commies
Trotsky = not a commie

Can't beat the logical consistency of your arguments

Jollybear said:
The whole point of terrifs is to create FAIR trade with other countries. Good business deals. Theres free trade, then theres fair trade.

Shouldn't the market sort out what is fair and what is not? Why tax the American people to punish China?

More government regulation and taxes = communism by your definition.

Jollybear said:
Reagan is a commie for big tax cuts? What is wrong with you lefties! Thats the OPPOSITE of communism.

As the article explained, he then started to significantly increase taxes, thus making him a commie in your book: Red Ronnie Reagan.

Jollybear said:
JFK was strongly against communism. He has a quote even talking about how they infiltrate. He also cut taxes on business and income.

There was a 70% top tax rate, yet JFK was an anti-communist. That's far, far more than any modern Dem would propose, yet they are commies.

Why do I get the feeling you don't really understand what you are talking about?

metis · Nov 11, 2019

Jollybear said:
The way you deal with that is by cutting spending.

But the Pubs not only didn't do that, they didn't even propose it!

Also, contrary to what you post without doing the research is that recent Pub presidents thiose in Congress have ramped-up the deficit more than recent Dems.

Jollybear said:
Its not christian to get government to take from the ritch to give to the poor.

It helps if you actually studied scripture, as Jesus did not negate the Law whereas all Jews had to tithe, and that tithing went to the Temple that was run by the priests and the governmental leaders. Charity went beyond that.

And Jesus doubled-down on this in his Parable of the Widow's Mite.

Jollybear said:
Its not about brown skin, its about immigration inforcement.

Trump has long been well known as being racist, such as when he asked why were are not having more people who "look like Norwegians" coming in? There was also the "Mexican judge" who was born and raised in Indiana that he thought should recuse himself. He also has been strongly supported by right-wing militia groups and the KKK, and they love him! Guess why?

Jollybear said:
Get real.

You should actually try it, and while you're at it maybe do some studying.

Woberts · Nov 11, 2019

Jollybear said:
So, something that repeatedly in history produced the fruits of death, thats the moral way to go?

Am i hearing that correctly?

You are interpreting it that way, yes.

SkepticThinker · Nov 11, 2019

Jollybear said:
I think thered be alot less victims under small government.

I'd say less regulation = more victims.

See: The Triangle Shirtwaist Factory Fire, Radium Girls, Child Miners

metis · Nov 11, 2019

SkepticThinker said:
I'd say less regulation = more victims.

See: The Triangle Shirtwaist Factory Fire, Radium Girls, Child Miners

Exactly, as regulations are passed for a reason, although continuous review of them is needed. Some people simply take our protections of safe food, clean water & air, anti-corruption, etc. for granted, thus forgetting what it took to try and make this a better country and planet to live in.

To put it another way, "Those who don't learn from their history are doomed to repeat it".

SkepticThinker · Nov 11, 2019

Jollybear said:
Read my OP. You have the right to believe in communidm if you want, but you dont get to change what it is.

Here, ill do the work for you

"a political theory derived from Karl Marx, advocating class war and leading to a society in which all property is publicly owned and each person works and is paid according to their abilities and needs."

Here, another

"The definition of communism is a system where all property is public and people work and are given things by the government according to their needs. An example of communism is the governing system in Cuba where the government controls everything and doles out benefits such as money, health care and food."

Those definitions are from google and a dictionary site.

So, NO, PRIVATELY owned business and property is NOT communism. Its the OPOSITE of COMMUNISM.

Um, you're the one trying to turn communism into something it isn't. And demonizing a whole group, in the process.

Jollybear · Nov 11, 2019

ADigitalArtist said:
Why? Where is the line? Having healthcare not be a matter of market choices and money put before human lives is one of the most important changes the US could make right now, imo.

Lives before money? "Free healthcare" is not free. It takes money, tax money to pay for it. If its taxed, then the medic field will charge elaborate prices. The same principle applies to insurence companies that provide healthcare. If none of that existed then the medic field would charge significantly less.

It is literally what every other civilized nation has done.

Just because they jump over the cliff dont mean anyone else should.

Nowhere else in the G20 do people die because they can't afford treatment, or because they're too nervous of how much treatment is going to cost, or go bankrupt paying for their treatment. The needless death due to free market capitalism in the US is staggering.

Solution, no government healthcare and no insurence healthcare. Problem solved.

You should not be a big fan of Trump then, as he is capital C crony, using the political world to personally enrich him and his business interests.

Actually no, cutting taxes on business is cronyism. Yes, i see why you would think hes just doing that for himself because hes a business man himself. But, your missing the bigger picture here, this benefits not only him. It benefits his business too, which in turn benefits his employees. It benefits other peoples business, which in turn benefits there employees. In other words it benefits the economy. Thats a good thing, not a bad thing.

Cronyism on the other hand is walmart going to the government and asking them to federally raise the minimum wage to 15$ an hour. They dont do that because they give a **** about there employees getting higher pay, they do it because they want to outcompete the smaller businesses. If the Government does what they want or god forbid takes a bribe from them, thats cronyism. Good government would respond like this '**** off walmart, go compete fairly. You wanna beat the small business, provide better service and prices and goods. Im not helping you, its not my role.'

The notion that 'the market corrects itself' is one of the biggest myths of our time. Currently the market favors whoever has the most money to throw at it regardless of what popular interest or popular capitol among individuals is. The wealth gap and wealth hoarding in the US is so huge that they aren't 'rising the tides,' they're siphoning the water into their own private reserves, and the water goes down for everyone else. There is literally nobody who can, for example, compete with Amazon. The market is dictated by one individual's business choices, and it's such a vast overarching business that even rightwing market professionals are starting to breathe the words 'monopoly.'

Its not a myth. If you provide a better service or product then the next guy, youl beat him. Its simple and logical. And theres many other online shopping stores other then amazon. And they also do good.

How much left wing programs does one country need before it's 'left wing'? Even the mildest of examples like universal healthcare is considered 'extreme left' in the US, but is 'default across party lines' elsewhere.

How many? Lets see.....free healthcare, free college, free school, free money and food stamps, free assisted housing. I think that about sums it up.

Again, this notion of the market correcting itself doesn't actually hold. We recently had a huge lawsuit against tradeschools because these private for profit schools were creating predatory tuition rates and price fixing between them. It wasn't the market that was correcting them, it was regulation. The cost to the individual was much higher for education standards that were much lower. (And this is no less true of league colleges) So since public money is drawn towards these money making schemes, public schools are underfunded and, with the growing wealth gap and more people who cannot afford these private ripoff schools, less and less people in the US are properly educated. We aren't even in the top ten on math, reading and science.

Again, those ripoff schools, the way to deal with them is no one pay for them. Go elsewhere for your education. Do that, and they will quickly kiss your feet, begging you to come back and work with you.

And it amazes me about paying for education. Knowledge is FREE. The library, the internet, a bookstore. You dont need to pay thousands of dollars for knowledge.

I seen a youtuber, he build a whole house JUST FROM BUYING A BOOK. He followed the instructions carefully and over the course of a few years, his house was built. All by himself and his girl friend. And not one day in a stupid school.

I just like drawing eyes. My icon is an old digital illustration practice from several years ago.

Oh now, come on, confess, yuour a member of the illuminati. Lol

Jollybear · Nov 11, 2019

Woberts said:
You are interpreting it that way, yes.

Am i interpreting it correctly though?

Woberts · Nov 11, 2019

Jollybear said:
Am i interpreting it correctly though?

Not really.

Jollybear · Nov 11, 2019

metis said:
But the Pubs not only didn't do that, they didn't even propose it!

Stop making stuff up. Everyone has a budget proposal. Democrats and republicans. Whether its good or bad thats another thing.

Im not a republican either. Im a libertarian. Under libertarianism, cutting spending would TRULY happen.

Also, contrary to what you post without doing the research is that recent Pub presidents thiose in Congress have ramped-up the deficit more than recent Dems.

I dont know about that and i will not take your word for it. If you have a refrence proving that ill look at it.

But in anycase, im a libertarian. They truly slash spending.

It helps if you actually studied scripture,

Back off, dont tell me what i study or dont study. You dont know me or anything about me. Got it!? Good!

as Jesus did not negate the Law whereas all Jews had to tithe, and that tithing went to the Temple that was run by the priests and the governmental leaders. Charity went beyond that.

And, tithing was VOLUNTARY. It was not done by government FORCE.

Ahuh, ya, ahuh, YOU do some study pale!

There is not ONE scripture where Jesus teaches that government should take from others in order to help the poor.

You will find scriptures where jesus says YOU bare personal responsibility to help the poor.

You also will find him saying to pay taxes.

But, thats to fund government. Thats not to take from others to give to the poor.

And Jesus doubled-down on this in his Parable of the Widow's Mite.

Mark 12:41

Lets look at just exactly what Jesus was "doubling down on".

"Jesus sat down opposite the place where the OFFERINGS were put and watched the crowd putting their money into the temple treasury. Many rich people threw in large amounts. But a poor widow came and put in two very small copper coins, worth only a few cents.

Calling his disciples to him, Jesus said, “Truly I tell you, this poor widow has put more into the treasury than all the others. THEY ALL GAVE out of their wealth; but she, out of her poverty, put in everything—all she had to live on.”

Notice the words "offerings" and "they gave". Thats NOT government FORCE TAKING from them.

She even GAVE a higher PERCENT then the wealthy did. If this was tax, it would he the same percent.

Trump has long been well known as being racist, such as when he asked why were are not having more people who "look like Norwegians" coming in? There was also the "Mexican judge" who was born and raised in Indiana that he thought should recuse himself. He also has been strongly supported by right-wing militia groups and the KKK, and they love him! Guess why?

Wheres that norwagan quote? Reference. Calling a country a **** hole isnt racist by the way.

Also, not wanting a mexican judge makes sense if you wanna inforce immigration laws. Its not racist.

Also not all KKK members support trump. Remember the KKK was the arm of the democrate party. Look up your history.

Just so you are aware, the organizer for charlottsville protest, that white supremacist guy, he was not a trump supporter, he in fact voted for obama! Yep, look it up.

You should actually try it, and while you're at it maybe do some studying.

Looks like i just put my foot on your neck. Now beg me for mercy. My points just beat you.

Jollybear · Nov 11, 2019

Woberts said:
Not really.

Explain more, if you would?

Valjean · Nov 11, 2019

Jollybear said:
Lives before money? "Free healthcare" is not free. It takes money, tax money to pay for it. If its taxed, then the medic field will charge elaborate prices. The same principle applies to insurence companies that provide healthcare. If none of that existed then the medic field would charge significantly less.

Not quite following.[/quote]
I agree that eliminating an expensive, parasitical component that provides no actual healthcare would bring down prices, but I don't see why a tax funded healthcare system would necessarily charge 'elaborate' prices. Nor do I understand why you say insurance companies provide healthcare.

ADigitalArtist said: ↑
It is literally what every other civilized nation has done.

Just because they jump over the cliff dont mean anyone else should.

How have other countries jumped off the cliff? Their systems are working better than ours.

Solution, no government healthcare and no insurence healthcare. Problem solved.

How would the average Joe afford healthcare, then? What would prevent the independent practitioners from charging exorbitant fees or denying care to those who could not pay?

Again, those ripoff schools, the way to deal with them is no one pay for them. Go elsewhere for your education. Do that, and they will quickly kiss your feet, begging you to come back and work with you.

What if there is no 'elsewhere'?

And it amazes me about paying for education. Knowledge is FREE. The library, the internet, a bookstore. You dont need to pay thousands of dollars for knowledge

And how many of these autodidacts do you expect would be generated without a public education system?

SkepticThinker · Nov 12, 2019

Jollybear said:
Wheres that norwagan quote? Reference. Calling a country a **** hole isnt racist by the way.

Also, not wanting a mexican judge makes sense if you wanna inforce immigration laws. Its not racist.

Also not all KKK members support trump. Remember the KKK was the arm of the democrate party. Look up your history.

Just so you are aware, the organizer for charlottsville protest, that white supremacist guy, he was not a trump supporter, he in fact voted for obama! Yep, look it up.

Looks like i just put my foot on your neck. Now beg me for mercy. My points just beat you.

It's about as xenophobic or racist as it gets. I can't even believe you just typed that. But please do explain to us how "a Mexican judge" is incapable of doing his job and being impartial when it comes to immigration laws.

FYI: The POS that ran over that poor woman in Charlottesville was a white supremacist neoNazi. You don't seriously believe he supported Obama, do you?

I have a question, where do you get your news from?

metis · Nov 12, 2019

Jollybear said:
Stop making stuff up. Everyone has a budget proposal. Democrats and republicans. Whether its good or bad thats another thing.

Im not a republican either. Im a libertarian. Under libertarianism, cutting spending would TRULY happen.

I dont know about that and i will not take your word for it. If you have a refrence proving that ill look at it.

But in anycase, im a libertarian. They truly slash spending.

Back off, dont tell me what i study or dont study. You dont know me or anything about me. Got it!? Good!

And, tithing was VOLUNTARY. It was not done by government FORCE.

Ahuh, ya, ahuh, YOU do some study pale!

There is not ONE scripture where Jesus teaches that government should take from others in order to help the poor.

You will find scriptures where jesus says YOU bare personal responsibility to help the poor.

You also will find him saying to pay taxes.

But, thats to fund government. Thats not to take from others to give to the poor.

Mark 12:41

Lets look at just exactly what Jesus was "doubling down on".

"Jesus sat down opposite the place where the OFFERINGS were put and watched the crowd putting their money into the temple treasury. Many rich people threw in large amounts. But a poor widow came and put in two very small copper coins, worth only a few cents.

Calling his disciples to him, Jesus said, “Truly I tell you, this poor widow has put more into the treasury than all the others. THEY ALL GAVE out of their wealth; but she, out of her poverty, put in everything—all she had to live on.”

Notice the words "offerings" and "they gave". Thats NOT government FORCE TAKING from them.

She even GAVE a higher PERCENT then the wealthy did. If this was tax, it would he the same percent.

Wheres that norwagan quote? Reference. Calling a country a **** hole isnt racist by the way.

Also, not wanting a mexican judge makes sense if you wanna inforce immigration laws. Its not racist.

Also not all KKK members support trump. Remember the KKK was the arm of the democrate party. Look up your history.

Just so you are aware, the organizer for charlottsville protest, that white supremacist guy, he was not a trump supporter, he in fact voted for obama! Yep, look it up.

Looks like i just put my foot on your neck. Now beg me for mercy. My points just beat you.

You simply do not know what you're talking about, undoubtedly because you appear to have never studied basic Jewish and Christian theology. Nor do you seem even slightly inclined to learn any of it. And your last sentence is a "classic", and it reminds me so much of what Trump brags about and how.

Woberts · Nov 12, 2019

Jollybear said:
Explain more, if you would?

It didn't produce fruits of death.

Jollybear · Nov 12, 2019

Woberts said:
It didn't produce fruits of death.

So, communisms history was not one of death?

Jollybear · Nov 12, 2019

metis said:
You simply do not know what you're talking about, undoubtedly because you appear to have never studied basic Jewish and Christian theology. Nor do you seem even slightly inclined to learn any of it. And your last sentence is a "classic", and it reminds me so much of what Trump brags about and how.

Ya, sure, i didnt study jews or christians. Right. I only read the bible 30 times throlugh and studied it over 30 years too. But, ya, i didnt study it, lol.

Actually........all the points i made and you did not refute PROVE i studied more then you.

You lost, i won. Im right your wrong. Case closed.

oldbadger · Nov 12, 2019

Jollybear said:
Democrate website Jobs and the Economy - Democrats

Communist party usa website What is the path to socialism for the USA?

Definition of communism

"a political theory derived from Karl Marx, advocating class war and leading to a society in which all property is publicly owned and each person works and is paid according to their abilities and needs."

Definition of socialism

"a political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole."

Notice the staunch similarity? Practically identical.

Now some quotes from the democrate site

"Democrats believe that our economy should strengthen our country and work for every American"

"making sure corporations, the wealthy, and Wall Street pay their fair share."

"Democrats cut taxes for working families, provided help for small businesses and homeowners"

"Democrats provided relief for hardworking Americans who lost their jobs through no fault of their own."

"making debt-free college available to all Americans, cracking down on companies that ship profits and jobs overseas, fighting for equal pay and paid leave, and ensuring the wealthiest citizens and largest corporations pay their fair share"

Now quotes from the communist site

"The transition to a socialist USA will be shaped by our country’s unique history and culture. Its wonderfully diverse working class and people will shape it."

"The means to achieve this goal will have to correspond to the end– solidarity, empathy, equality community, compassion and a dedication to putting people and our planet before profits."

"radical economic, political, social and cultural change."

Ok, basically what we got going on here and for you to see this you NEED a critical eye.

All of this is saying in its essence, government control. No liberty.

On one hand they are saying they want equality for all or prosperity for all.

But, you dont get that by over taxing the wealthy. Thats how the wealthy take there companies, along with there jobs out of your countries. And that then collapses your countries.

All you extreme lefties, particularly you young people need to wake up.

Another Rightist rant?

Democrate part is communist

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