syo
Well-Known Member
Are the Apostles liars? They are not Jesus, but still they seem trustworthy?But there's a difference between "Jesus said..", and stories written by people saying "Jesus promised me the Paraclete, and I got it!"
Tom
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Are the Apostles liars? They are not Jesus, but still they seem trustworthy?But there's a difference between "Jesus said..", and stories written by people saying "Jesus promised me the Paraclete, and I got it!"
Tom
I don't know.Are the Apostles liars? They are not Jesus, but still they seem trustworthy?
It seems to me that if we are sufficiently non-virtuous we will wipe ourselves out, some degree of overall virtue seems to be required for our continued survival.
Something does not need to be written in a text to be true.It's an interesting approach; I think it would be stronger with some scriptural examples from diverse sources.
Suggest a better one that demonstrates God cares if you can.That's a very, very low bar to clear.
Suggest a better one that demonstrates God cares if you can.
This post is for both believers and atheists:
- Believers: Do you think God cares how many people believe in Him?
Believers and atheists:
- Atheists: If God existed, do you think God would care how many people believe in Him?
- Do you think God cares if some people are atheists?
- If God sent Messengers, would God care how many people believed in His Messengers?
- If God sent a Messenger, would God have a certain time frame on how soon afterward people believed in His Messenger?
That is true, and God could prove He exists to EVERYONE and make all men believers IF He wanted to.If a god existed and was proven to exist there would be no atheist.
God is not human so God does not have an ego.Were we made in God's image, then God would have an ego like ours, so of course [he]'d care about how many. (This would contradict any idea that [he] was perfect, but what test will tell you if something's perfect in this abstract sense anyway?)
No, I do not think God cares if there are atheists because God does not need any believers at all.Not that [he]'s ever thought to mention to me, no.
God knows that at least one person will believe in His new Messenger and then the Messenger will gather disciples and from there it will spread to other people gradually over time.Big problem is, we only have the word of ordinary humans that they're messengers. Why an omnipotent god, or even just a very powerful one, would choose such a clumsy and fraud-prone system escapes me. A bit like one of those letters from Nigeria ... If I went about my business in as inept a fashion, I'd have already accepted the risk that maybe no one at all would believe my messenger.
So that would explain why not many people believe in these Messengers, at least not at first, and for a long time afterwards.I think my previous answer covers that ─ if I send a message in an inefficient and fraud-prone manner, I can hardly be surprised if I'm disbelieved or ignored.
God could offer clear evidence but He doesn't. Obviously He must have His reasons...If I were using efficient communications, like phone, SMS, email, and offered clear evidence of my identity, I think if I received no answer within a month or so, I was probably being ignored. But even then I could scarcely blame the ignorer.
That is true, and God could prove He exists to EVERYONE and make all men believers IF He wanted to.
Baha'u'llah wrote that.
I have probably posted this to atheists about 100 times on my forum and here, but what the heck...
“He Who is the Day Spring of Truth is, no doubt, fully capable of rescuing from such remoteness wayward souls and of causing them to draw nigh unto His court and attain His Presence. “If God had pleased He had surely made all men one people.” His purpose, however, is to enable the pure in spirit and the detached in heart to ascend, by virtue of their own innate powers, unto the shores of the Most Great Ocean, that thereby they who seek the Beauty of the All-Glorious may be distinguished and separated from the wayward and perverse. Thus hath it been ordained by the all-glorious and resplendent Pen…”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 71
In the context of the passage above, If God had pleased He had surely made all men one people it means that God could have made all people believers, but IF God has pleased, implies that God did not want to make all people into believers, verified by the fact that not all men are believers. The passage goes on to say why God didn’t want to make us believers... In short, God wants us to do our own homework and become believers by our own efforts (by virtue of their own innate powers).
I think that God cares about humans; otherwise God would not have created humans.Do you think God cares at all ?
Why should God care about naive , mediocre minded animals ?
Yes, that is true about the God Christians believe in. That God thinks everyone should believe in Him or else.The christian God? christian priests say yes. so they preach to attract more members.
The christian God? christian priests say yes. so they preach to attract more members.
The christian God? there aren't messengers. there is only Jesus.
The christian God? there aren't messengers. there is only Jesus.
I agree with all of that except I do not think that most people choose to suffer. A few people might, they are called masochists. The rest of the people suffer for any number of reasons, many of which are outside of their control. In short, I believe that this material world is a storehouse of suffering.Yes, God cares. Assuming God is not "out there" but comes from within. Our joys are God's joys. Our pain and frustrations are God's as well.
The problem is most people do not accept a living God as being perfect, whole, complete, without any needs or desires. Such a God would seem to be indifferent to both atheists and believers. Such a God would hold all facets of His creation in equal value.
Believing in God in a proper way alleviates our suffering of doubts about our place the Universe. Choosing to ignore His messengers only creates more opportunity for us to suffer with our own imperfections. Choosing to believe in His messengers creates an opportunity for us to alleviate our suffering as we live our lives.
Some of us choose to suffer more than others. The power of God comes from within as well as the source of all our suffering. Choice is not a decision based on reason. Choice is a shift in our conscious way of being. We all get to choose hate and suffering. Or we can choose love and the glory of God over hate and suffering.
The most sacred of all joys comes from the realization that our own joy is boosted thousands of times over when we help other people find their joy. There's always ample opportunity to find sacred joy by helping others find joy.
If you are waiting, it would do no harm to say some prayers while you are waiting, is what I tell my atheist friends who say they are waiting... Kind of like reading a magazine while you wait at the doctor's office.Still waiting.
No, I don't, nobody does, not even the Messengers of God know the Mind of God...In short, you can read the mind if your god? Surely that tells you something.
If you are waiting, it would do no harm to say some prayers while you are waiting, is what I tell my atheist friends who say they are waiting... Kind of like reading a magazine while you wait at the doctor's office.
If they are not waiting and don't even care, there is no reason to say any prayers.
No, I don't, nobody does, not even the Messengers of God know the Mind of God...
They just get communication from God and turn that into words we can understand, like what I quoted.
No, of course not. I either exist or not. It is the same with God. How many people *believe* that God exists doe not change the fact that God exists, if God exists.If you think about it, do you care how many people believe you exist. Regardless of how many people believe you exist does not change the fact that you do does it?
I agree. If God did not care, God would not have sent Messengers to lend guidance to humans.As far as caring if someone believes in your actual existence or not; would it bother you if an individual believed in your existence or would you take into consideration the person's understanding of what existence is. Apparently there is some kind of concern of what people believe or Messengers would have not been sent. As far as this being of arrogance I would personally debate this understanding with the consideration that nothing had to be done in order to lend Human guidance if there was no relevance of caring for their existence.
I do not believe that God seeks companionship with humans or that we can have companionship with God.I have a counter question; If you where the Creator and most Omnipotent in all Eternities, wouldn't you feel sad and lonely if you created something in which maybe companionship could be achieved? Not trying to imply that this is the reason for human's creation, but maybe a small part of it.
I get your point about the disasters and I agree. Why say prayers after the fact?This is why i prefer to get off my butt and actually do something rather than wasting my time praying to a myth
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Nobody can read God's Mind. God reveals what He chooses to reveal to the Minds of the Messengers.So you dont read your gods mind, you wait for someone else to read your gods mind then follow them. Cool
This post is for both believers and atheists:
- Believers: Do you think God cares how many people believe in Him?
Believers and atheists:
- Atheists: If God existed, do you think God would care how many people believe in Him?
- Do you think God cares if some people are atheists?
- If God sent Messengers, would God care how many people believed in His Messengers?
- If God sent a Messenger, would God have a certain time frame on how soon afterward people believed in His Messenger?
Please elaborate the premise.
What are we calling "God" here?