How Smart are Humans in Absolute Terms?

Sunstone · Nov 7, 2019

How smart are humans in absolute terms?

For the purposes of this OP, "intelligence" is defined as "the effectiveness with which an organism is able to purposely interact with its environment in order to realize its goals".

Defined as such, intelligence can in principle be measured in non-relative terms. For instance, you could create a series of problems or challenges to see how well an organism was able to meet them. That sort of thing is routinely done by investigators with both humans and animals. Best of all, such challenges measure human intelligence in more absolute terms than does comparing ourselves to other species.

By the way, there is a sense in which humans are no longer the smartest things on the planet. About four years ago -- in a grossly under-reported story -- researchers brought online the world's first artificial super-intelligence. An artificial super-intelligence is vastly smarter than both humans and other forms of artificial intelligence.

What distinguishes ASI from both human intelligence and conventional artificial intelligence is that ASI can recognize and solve problems that neither humans nor conventional AI are even capable of recognizing are problems.

___________________________
And now for something much better than the OP...

IndigoChild5559 · Nov 7, 2019

I think we are pretty stupid.

We are overpopulating, despite the fact that we can control procreation. This is causing us to be on the brink of water shortage, starvation, etc. Most of our other problems, such as carbon emissions, would be negligible if the population were under control
We have maladaptive priorities, putting men on the moon while people sleep on the streets.
We are short sighted. Whether it is the pleasure of drinking the night before at the expense of a hangover the next day, or sex without contraception at the risk of children we can't afford, yada yada, we simply don't think about the consequences of our actions.
Although Medical Science has come a long ways in a very short time, what we actually know is a grain of sand on a beach.
We know that for our own mental and physical health we need familial and social interactions, yet we create social and work environments where we are isolated. What good is it to build cities if we are lonely within them? In this way and so many others, we are knowingly self destructive.
If I could sum things up, we use our intelligence to bring us comfort, but not happiness. Indeed, we are less happy now than in the past.

Brickjectivity · Nov 7, 2019

Our strongest abilities are related to our feelings. We feel things, and we can combine that with intelligence.

crossfire · Nov 7, 2019

I must not be very intelligent. I'm having difficulty wrapping my mind around the concepts of measuring non-relative terms and more absolute. If anyone wants to help this poor retard understand, it would be appreciated!

Stanyon · Nov 7, 2019

It's 2019, we have it all figured out.

Thief · Nov 7, 2019

Sunstone said:
For instance, you could create a series of problems or challenges to see how well an organism was able to meet them

sharks are genius level

they are even more

they are GODS

Thief · Nov 7, 2019

Jordan Peterson answered a question poorly posed
what to do about intelligence if there really is a racial slant

he managed to dodge the intent of the question
avoiding to say there IS a difference

but then very well responded that IQ ….IS..... a viable and useful test

how smart are humans?
nay
not at all

we still perform the snatch and run tactics of monkeys

we are little more than talking animals

Duke_Leto · Nov 7, 2019

IndigoChild5559 said:
I think we are pretty stupid.

We are overpopulating, despite the fact that we can control procreation. This is causing us to be on the brink of water shortage, starvation, etc. Most of our other problems, such as carbon emissions, would be negligible if the population were under control

We have maladaptive priorities, putting men on the moon while people sleep on the streets.

We are short sighted. Whether it is the pleasure of drinking the night before at the expense of a hangover the next day, or sex without contraception at the risk of children we can't afford, yada yada, we simply don't think about the consequences of our actions.

Although Medical Science has come a long ways in a very short time, what we actually know is a grain of sand on a beach.

We know that for our own mental and physical health we need familial and social interactions, yet we create social and work environments where we are isolated. What good is it to build cities if we are lonely within them? In this way and so many others, we are knowingly self destructive.

If I could sum things up, we use our intelligence to bring us comfort, but not happiness. Indeed, we are less happy now than in the past.

Do you include yourself when calling humans stupid? If so, do you refrain from stupidity when pronouncing this judgement?

dianaiad · Nov 7, 2019

IndigoChild5559 said:
I think we are pretty stupid.

We are overpopulating, despite the fact that we can control procreation. This is causing us to be on the brink of water shortage, starvation, etc. Most of our other problems, such as carbon emissions, would be negligible if the population were under control

Y'know, whenever I see this argument, or an argument similar to this, it's usually from some whacked out 'we need to get back to our roots' type. You know the sort: the kid raised in a comfy urban home...or suburban home, who has never had to live in a place without access to toilet paper, who has never had to walk half a mile to get a bucket of water to cook and clean with, and who has absolutely NO idea what life is like on a modern farm, never mind the sort of 'back to nature' stuff s/he preaches. this is the one who preaches 'organic' and buys everything at farmer's markets where the price is twice what it is at the local supermarket, with money that s/he has earned at Google or some other wonderful computer programming start up.

If not the above, it is preached by some character who declares that his/her parents were irresponsible for having so many (maybe three?) children, and S/HE wasn't going to contribute to the over population.

I keep harking back to all the folks at the beginning of the twentieth century who actually DID something about over population, and the folks in China who actually tried to DO something about overpopulation...and then I consider just how those efforts turned out. With all this in mind, I look at folks who declare how 'stupid' or 'evil' or "horrible' we are for overpopulating the planet, and that we should DO something about that....and I keep thinking the same two words.

You first.

Terese · Nov 7, 2019

AI intelligence is just one type of intelligence Humans possess. Intelligence ≠ Consciousness

Your friendly pro-Human post has ended

Hockeycowboy · Nov 7, 2019

Sunstone said:
For the purposes of this OP, "intelligence" is defined as "the effectiveness with which an organism is able to purposely interact with its environment in order to realize its goals".

Idk....what if it has *very low* goals?

What if the goal is just to eat, drink, and survive?
There’s gotta be something more.

Hockeycowboy · Nov 7, 2019

IndigoChild5559 said:
I think we are pretty stupid.

We are overpopulating, despite the fact that we can control procreation. This is causing us to be on the brink of water shortage, starvation, etc. Most of our other problems, such as carbon emissions, would be negligible if the population were under control

We have maladaptive priorities, putting men on the moon while people sleep on the streets.

We are short sighted. Whether it is the pleasure of drinking the night before at the expense of a hangover the next day, or sex without contraception at the risk of children we can't afford, yada yada, we simply don't think about the consequences of our actions.

Although Medical Science has come a long ways in a very short time, what we actually know is a grain of sand on a beach.

We know that for our own mental and physical health we need familial and social interactions, yet we create social and work environments where we are isolated. What good is it to build cities if we are lonely within them? In this way and so many others, we are knowingly self destructive.

If I could sum things up, we use our intelligence to bring us comfort, but not happiness. Indeed, we are less happy now than in the past.

Awesome post.

On top of that, humans are ‘creatures of hope.’ (At least, I always heard that.)

We will say, “things will get better”...how? Through osmosis? No plan is proposed to make it better. So conditions just get worse and worse.

Brickjectivity · Nov 7, 2019

Thief said:
we still perform the snatch and run tactics of monkeys

we are little more than talking animals

In a way I agree, but I don't agree in every sense. A lot of animals live instinctively, never learning and remembering little. Its like they never truly die, but we are mortal. They're all clones and never change. Look at the ants -- all the same. You can take one ant and replace it with another.

Tumah · Nov 7, 2019

24 smart

Hockeycowboy · Nov 7, 2019

@Tumah ,
Being a member of “Mega-Super-Ultra-Orthodox Judaism”...
what does that entail? I’m just wondering...in Judaism, members offered animal sacrifices. A big part of their worship!

Surely you don’t, do you?

Tumah · Nov 7, 2019

Hockeycowboy said:
@Tumah ,
Being a member of “Mega-Super-Ultra-Orthodox Judaism”...
what does that entail?

Haredi Judaism - Wikipedia

I’m just wondering...in Judaism, members offered animal sacrifices. A big part of their worship!

Surely you don’t, do you?

You've got it wrong. In Judaism, members who had access to the altar in the Temple offered animal sacrifices. Members who didn't have access, such as not being in the country -- or the Temple not existing, didn't offer sacrifices. Like them, since there's no Temple today, we don't offer sacrifices.

Rival · Nov 7, 2019

We're very smart! Isn't that what RF is for?? All the brightest minds coming together to talk about how bright we are and fix all the world's problems??

We Never Know · Nov 8, 2019

IndigoChild5559 said:
I think we are pretty stupid.

We are overpopulating, despite the fact that we can control procreation. This is causing us to be on the brink of water shortage, starvation, etc. Most of our other problems, such as carbon emissions, would be negligible if the population were under control

We have maladaptive priorities, putting men on the moon while people sleep on the streets.

We are short sighted. Whether it is the pleasure of drinking the night before at the expense of a hangover the next day, or sex without contraception at the risk of children we can't afford, yada yada, we simply don't think about the consequences of our actions.

Although Medical Science has come a long ways in a very short time, what we actually know is a grain of sand on a beach.

We know that for our own mental and physical health we need familial and social interactions, yet we create social and work environments where we are isolated. What good is it to build cities if we are lonely within them? In this way and so many others, we are knowingly self destructive.

If I could sum things up, we use our intelligence to bring us comfort, but not happiness. Indeed, we are less happy now than in the past.

Great post. I was going to post one similar but you nailed. We destroy, polute and waste so much it's absurd and we are the only species on this rock that does so.

Shadow Wolf · Nov 8, 2019

Sunstone said:
New How smart are humans in absolute terms?

According to the numbers, only a small percentage of the population is more intelligent than I am.
I lost my glasses today after I took them off to put some conditioner serum in my hair. I've also lost my glasses on my face. In general, I lose everything, including my car in the parking lot at the grocery store. I mix up my left and my right. My recall is prone to being especially faulty and "drawing blanks." And I don't actually really know all that much in regards to all the things there is to know. Oh, and one time when I was changing my car's oil, the I forgot to take the cap off collection pan thingy and I made a hella mess with oil spilling all over the place. And if that's me, an IQ 1-percenter, humanity probably overall isn't that smart, lol.

sun rise · Nov 8, 2019

Sunstone said:
For the purposes of this OP, "intelligence" is defined as "the effectiveness with which an organism is able to purposely interact with its environment in order to realize its goals".

If the goals are not intelligently chosen, of what value is intelligence? A corollary is: if superstition clouds goal choosing, of what value is intelligence. Another is: if political correctness such as conservatives and anti-vaxxers display overrules science, of what value is intelligence?

How Smart are Humans in Absolute Terms?

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