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What God needs for incarnation or avatar

j1i

Smiling is charity without giving money
What God needs for incarnation and avatar
Baha'i, Christian, Hindu and other religions believe that God is incarnate
To help people and guide them What he needs to do this is to come by himself

Logic
The size of the vast universe has a maker and this maker is great , how God (the great maker) will come to earth to live and eat food and go to the bathroom

It is easy for God to send a mythical being from heaven to be a messenger
I have not heard of a head of state (president ) who sends a message by himself to the post or to another head of state (president ) or other entity

There are senior Hindu, Christian, Baha'i and other officials ,,,,, They feel offended if I don't pay my attention and demand respect
While God does not feel offended to come to live on the planet orbiting the sun eats food

I know the human faith miss mind o_O
But faith must be at least logical
 
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ameyAtmA

~ ~
Premium Member
There are senior Hindu, Christian, Baha'i and other officials ,,,,, They feel offended if I don't pay my attention and demand respect
While God does not feel offended to come to live on the planet orbiting the sun eats foodl

That is correct, because those officials are humans who have ego.
God has no ego and is not human, only takes a human-like form to help and protect humans from evil that exceeds some limits , set an example and give His Gracious association to the devotees.
At all other times, the saints and messengers work on His behalf.
 

j1i

Smiling is charity without giving money
That is correct, because those officials are humans who have ego.
God has no ego and is not human, only takes a human-like form to help and protect humans from evil that exceeds some limits , set an example and give His Gracious association to the devotees.
At all other times, the saints and messengers work on His behalf.


thanks for replay dude
God can create a gentle, tolerant, enlightened teacher to help people
Human invented lighting which is harmless Just reveal the truth to you by vision
How can I believe that God is incapable of sending faithful people who do not have the ego? Like human invention of electric lighting
with full respect
 

ameyAtmA

~ ~
Premium Member
How can I believe that God is incapable of sending faithful people who do not have the ego? Like human invention of electric lighting
with full respect
Who said He is incapable? That is what He does at all other times, but on the rare occasions He makes special appearance. The joy of the devotees knows no bounds. In fact the Devas do appear with Him as relatives, friends and devotees when He comes here. They alone create such waves of inspiration for generations of humans to come, what to speak of Parameshwar.

*I am not a 'dude'
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
thanks for replay dude
God can create a gentle, tolerant, enlightened teacher to help people
Human invented lighting which is harmless Just reveal the truth to you by vision
How can I believe that God is incapable of sending faithful people who do not have the ego? Like human invention of electric lighting
with full respect
In Asian spiritual teaching they teach that to be able to give the truth to humankind, a God, Buddha or other beings who come to earth to give teachings must cultivate their body and mind up to what is called enlightenment, it means they will remember the teachings they had prepared before they materialized in to this world through birth,
So when heavenly beings wish to teach us, humans, they must descend, down through the same path human beings want to cultivate in wisdom. They must get to our physical realm. when they are here they must cultivate up again to become a God or Buddha on earth.
 
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Dawnofhope

Non-Proselytizing Baha'i
Staff member
Premium Member
What God needs for incarnation and avatar
Baha'i, Christian, Hindu and other religions believe that God is incarnate
To help people and guide them What he needs to do this is to come by himself

Logic
The size of the vast universe has a maker and this maker is great , how God (the great maker) will come to earth to live and eat food and go to the bathroom

It is easy for God to send a mythical being from heaven to be a messenger
I have not heard of a head of state (president ) who sends a message by himself to the post or to another head of state (president ) or other entity

There are senior Hindu, Christian, Baha'i and other officials ,,,,, They feel offended if I don't pay my attention and demand respect
While God does not feel offended to come to live on the planet orbiting the sun eats food

I know the human faith miss mind o_O
But faith must be at least logical

The best word from a Baha'i perspective is Manifestation of God, rather than incarnation of God. In that sense the Manifestations are not literally God by reflect His attributes and make His will known. It is like a mirror that reflects the light of the sun. If the Sun reflected through the mirror were to say "I am God" it would be as if the mirror has spoken these words. However the mirror is not the sun. Through the mirror God reveals Himself and makes Himself known. From a Baha'i perspective examples of Manifestations of God are Jesus, Krishna, Muhammad and Baha'u'llah.
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
What God needs for incarnation and avatar
Baha'i, Christian, Hindu and other religions believe that God is incarnate
To help people and guide them What he needs to do this is to come by himself
l
Not this Hindu.
 

ameyAtmA

~ ~
Premium Member
In Asian spiritual teaching they teach that to be able to give the truth to humankind, a God, Buddha or other beings who come to earth to give teachings must cultivate their body and mind up to what is called enlightenment, it means they will remember the teachings they had prepared before they materialized in to this world through birth,
Do when heavenly beings wish to teach us, humans, they must descend, down through the same path human beings want to cultivate in wisdom. They must get to our physical realm. when they are here they must cultivate up again to become a God or Buddha on earth.
This is correct sometims, but not always.
Krishna was a pUrNa avatAr (Full, complete) right from birth. He did not have to cultivate anything.
He performed miracles as a baby of a few weeks (overturned cart of shatkasur),
- 3 months (killed demoness Putna) ,
- 1 yr (TriNAvatra),
- 2 yrs (Damodar, pulled down YamalArjun trees,absorbed beings),
- 5-7 yrs (Danced on hoods of poisonous Kaliya,
killed Bakasur in air,
aghasur,
drank up forest fire to save His buddies, the gopas),
- 7-8 yrs - lifted Govardhan Hill to shelter citizens from Indra's storm and flood,
- 9 yrs - expanded into many forms,
- 10 yrs - Killed Kuvalpeed war elephant, a wrestler and the wicked Kamsa - a westler. All these demons were sent to kill Him by Kamsa who knew the prophesy that Krishna is going to kill him.

The rest was all love and protection of remotest beings untill He taught the 3 Geetas to Arjun, Arjun, Uddhav resp. interleaved with lots of guidance for all - Pandavas, Dwarka residents, Vraj residents.
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
This is correct sometims, but not always.
Krishna was a pUrNa avatAr (Full, complete) right from birth. He did not have to cultivate anything.
He performed miracles as a baby of a few weeks (overturned cart of shatkasur),
- 3 months (killed demoness Putna) ,
- 1 yr (TriNAvatra),
- 2 yrs (Damodar, pulled down YamalArjun trees,absorbed beings),
- 5-7 yrs (Danced on hoods of poisonous Kaliya,
killed Bakasur in air,
aghasur,
drank up forest fire to save His buddies, the gopas),
- 7-8 yrs - lifted Govardhan Hill to shelter citizens from Indra's storm and flood,
- 9 yrs - expanded into many forms,
- 10 yrs - Killed Kuvalpeed war elephant, a wrestler and the wicked Kamsa - a westler. All these demons were sent to kill Him by Kamsa who knew the prophesy that Krishna is going to kill him.

The rest was all love and protection of remotest beings untill He taught the 3 Geetas to Arjun, Arjun, Uddhav resp. interleaved with lots of guidance for all - Pandavas, Dwarka residents, Vraj residents.
I don`t know to much about Hindu beliefs, so yes i might have spoken to much of all Asian religions, when i maybe should have spoken about buddhism alone :)
Thank you for correcting my mistake @ameyAtmA
 

ameyAtmA

~ ~
Premium Member
Not this Hindu.
Although ultimately formless, Shiva is considered Adi Yogi. Natraj is the same Adi Yogi who taught hundreds of Yogic ways to the 7 Rshis - saptaRishi, and to many yogis.
The same formless Parmeshwar revealed as Adi Yogi on Kailash 100000 yrs ago, taught Yog to ancient yogis as YogIshwar and danced as Natraj. He is present in invisible form even today.
The 12 Jyotirlinga are associated with forms of Shiv that descended here in form for very short periods of time, more recently.
 
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Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
Shiva is consideref Adi Yogi, and although ultimately formless, Natraj is the same Adi Yogi who taught N Yogic ways to the 7 Rshis - saptaRishi, and to many yogis.
The same formless Parmeshwar had come as Adi Yogi, taught Yog to ancients as YogIshwar 100000 yrs ago and danced as Natraj.
The 12 Jyotirlinga are associated with forms of Shiv that descended here for very short periods of time..

That's one interpretation, sure. But both AdiYogi (Dakshinamurthi) and Nataraja are eternal and timeless.

I have no reason to believe that God (Siva) needs to ever 'descend' as He exists throughout all form, is timeless and formless (the Absolute Being, causal) . The idea that he needs to take on one particular humanoid body at one particular time makes no sense ... to me. But sure, for those who need to think some other human knows it all, fine.
 

ameyAtmA

~ ~
Premium Member
That's one interpretation, sure. But both AdiYogi (Dakshinamurthi) and Nataraja are eternal and timeless.
Of Course, that is why I said " the same formless timeless Parmeshwar", but to teach Saptarushis, sitting under a tree ...

I have no reason to believe that God (Siva) needs to ever 'descend' as He exists throughout all form, is timeless and formless (the Absolute Being, causal) . The idea that he needs to take on one particular humanoid body at one particular time makes no sense ... to me.

It is not about Him needing to.
It is about appearing in form for the sake of / to reward one or more devotees OR to stop the ugra beings and asuras from harming themselves..
So saying "He cannot " is limiting Him in my view. This is what I am telling J1i also.

It is LeelA. Perhaps descend is not a good word for you :) sorry about that.


But sure, for those who need to think some other human knows it all, fine.
I was not implying about any know-all.
Only showing the evidence from scripture and history, as well as experiences of devotees. myself included.
 
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Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
Of Course, that is why I said " the same formless timeless Parmeshwar", but to teach Saptarushis, sitting under a tree ...



It is not about Him needing to.
It is about appearing in form for the sake of / to reward one or more devotees OR to stop the ugra beings and asuras from harming themselves..
So saying "He cannot " is limiting Him in my view. This is what I am telling J1i also.

It is LeelA. Perhaps descend is not a good word for you :) sorry about that.

I was not implying about any know-all.
Only showing the evidence from scripture and history, as well as experiences of devotees. myself included.

Not how I see, but sure. I'll leave it at that.
 

j1i

Smiling is charity without giving money
Not how I see, but sure. I'll leave it at that.

Thank you :)


What you wrote does apply in some cases.


Thank you for participating and giving me information about your beliefs
I appreciate your efforts and I definitely respect your opinions 100%


The most important and fundamental question
What is proof that your beliefs and thoughts are true
I mean, I have a group of people who want to become Baha'is, Hindus or Christians
How can I prove that the information you think is correct?
Please help me I am confused
I want evidence that God has passed from here
So I can convince my family and friends

Some may say that these fictional stories may not be true
Some may say that the incarnations were angels, not God
How these data proved to be correct

WITH FULL RESPECT

I WILL NOT REPLAY AGAIN
So they don't think I'm trying to change people's ideas
Only I want to know how to prove to others the validity of your beliefs
Because the papers and documents are modified or added scenarios and what proves that this data is true and accurate
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
The most important and fundamental question
What is proof that your beliefs and thoughts are true

Not a fundamental question to me, but to you, sure.

I have no proof whatsoever.
Personally, I need no proof whatsoever.
 

Jainarayan

ॐ नमो भगवते वासुदेवाय
Staff member
Premium Member
In fact the Devas do appear with Him as relatives, friends and devotees when He comes here.

Yes, just as Goddess Lakshmi incarnates with Lord Vishnu at times he incarnates... as Sita, Rukmini, Radha; Adishesha as Lakshmana and Balarama with Rama and Krishna, respectively, Goddess Durga as Krishna's baby sister (Narayani), the list goes on. :)
 

Brickjectivity

Turned to Stone. Now I stretch daily.
Staff member
Premium Member
..Only I want to know how to prove to others the validity of your beliefs...
Beliefs are by definition not provable. If they are proved then they are facts.

What God needs for incarnation and avatar Baha'i, Christian, Hindu and other religions believe that God is incarnate
To help people and guide them What he needs to do this is to come by himself
Christians almost always believe God is omnipresent. Therefore to say that God incarnates is actually semantics, since God is in all of us. There are songs about this, and there are plentiful scriptures referring to it.

There are three major views of Jesus among Christians of all kinds:
  • When Jesus comes he is different in that he does no evil, however he is still just as human as all people. When he dies he is purified of his human flaws and ceases to be human.
  • A second view is that he is never truly human, so he lacks certain human characteristics.
  • A third view is that he is incomprehensible, as if all of God were both omnipresent and also concentrated in Jesus, completely impossible to describe or to contemplate.
 

1213

Well-Known Member
What God needs for incarnation and avatar
Baha'i, Christian, Hindu and other religions believe that God is incarnate
...

That is interesting, because I don’t think Bible teaches so. So, from where does that idea come from?
 
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