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Good and Evil

ZenMonkey

St. James VII
I see need for meditation


I like bud it's a little wiser than some prescription meds, but then I like aroma therapy too, and massages, and a sauna is great on occasion. I've never been to a chiropractor, but they say they work wonders. I like nature as medicine and fishing and yes ... sometimes hunting. I think swimming can be good medicine, and select combinations of herbs and spices. How about laughter? Laughter is great medicine and happiness, and even better still ... sex ... yes .. sex is the best medicine, err ... well ... when it comes to treating two or more peope ya know? So yeah ... I agree ... I see need for medicine as well.
 

Fool

ALL in all
Premium Member
I agree ... It's like a woman and a man are into each other, but situations prevent them from being happy together, so both decide they want the other happy, so instead of being unhappy together they part ways so each can truly pursue happiness. That's a friend, you it's like a sacrifice but not ya know? It's a desire for your friend to be and remain happy with or without you in their lives.
love is about letting go, knowing you will be glad to see them again down the journey's path, and know that you will.
 

ZenMonkey

St. James VII
love is about letting go, knowing you will be glad to see them again down the journey's path, and know that you will.


I don't know and don't worry about it much anymore. Life takes us down different roads sometimes and threre's just "So many roads" and so many umm ... trains to ride ... so to speak. Good song by the way:

 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
I don't mind being the judge over what I like and dislike. I am a human with that ability ... you know ... to distinguish between what I enjoy and what I don't.
Same with me, hence the remark "don't say `we`, just speak for yourself"
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
I take it you mean both women and men, right?
Yes, that's what I meant. Usually I just write men, but with all that gender stuff going on, I thought I better add women too. I googled, and saw in Holland they start now with "wo=men". In a way this gender neutral is good, Sai Baba always said "you are all women. God is the only man"
 

Segev Moran

Well-Known Member
Ummm ... ok .... Ummm .... How about you worry about you and yours and I'll wory about me and mine and we'll probably get along just fine ya know?
That exactly the problem of humanity. each cares only for himself.
Imagine how amazing it would be if you and i, both, worried about whats ours.
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
There is quite a bit to address here.....I'll break it up....

I don't carry a gun but once did. I've had many over the years. I don't even pack a blade anymore, but will again this I assure you.

What is "this" that you would arm yourself against?

Do you understand that the power behind all human government was identified when Jesus was tempted by the devil after his baptism. Satan offered Jesus "all the kingdoms of this world" in exchange for "one act of worship".....he said he could do this because....."the Devil said to him: “I will give you all this authority and their glory, because it has been handed over to me, and I give it to whomever I wish. 7 If you, therefore, do an act of worship before me, it will all be yours.” 8 In reply Jesus said to him: “It is written, ‘It is Jehovah your God you must worship, and it is to him alone you must render sacred service.’” (Luke 4:5-8)

Jesus did not dispute the fact that the devil was in control of all those kingdoms and could give authority over them to whomever he wished. So no matter how much we love our country, behind the scenes is the same power controlling all of them. (1 John 5:19)

Gun toting "southern Christian" and it sounds as if you're against our military, which baffles me ... unless you're not American and are against this nation's government and way of life.

I am an Australian, so there is no 'gun toting' mentality instilled in me from infancy. This is a strange mindset to those of us who see the results of your gun violence and wonder why you can't see the problem? Apparently you have more to fear from your fellow citizens than you do from any external threat. :shrug:

The folly of carrying weapons is seen in Jesus' statement...."those who live by the sword (gun) will die by the sword (gun)".....can you not see it? America has mass shootings on a regular basis. Your presidents must get sick of lamenting them, but doing nothing to stop it.

The idea that carrying weapons can protect you from your government is also a bit of a fantasy IMO.....after all, no matter what weapons civilians have, your government has a trained military force who could wipe you out like an insect. Is going down in a blaze of glory really what you envision? I don't get it. You may as well use your weapon to kill yourself....you'll be just as dead.
As Solomoin said...."There is hope for whoever is among the living, because a live dog is better off than a dead lion." (Ecclesiastes 9:4)

As for Jesus being an extremest pacifist I'll disagree and here's why. He told his disciples to buy swords. Like I stated prior, it wasn't for show and tell. It doesn't make much sense to show a gun unless and/or until you aim to utilize it, which brings me to conceal carry, If you're packing a gun plain sight, then damn near anyone could size you up quickly and know exactly how to disarm you. Also, it could scare people ... you know ... carrying a gun plain view. It's dangerous to carry a gun plain view. It's not a deterrent in the least ... at least for anyone accustomed to dealing with people with guns ... like our military, police force, and a host of other Americans.

Jesus was not an extreme pacifist at all. But he advocated being "peacemakers"......we are accustomed to hearing about "peacekeepers" but these are armed troops with tanks and guns. They are not "peacemakers" because making peace does not involve violence....it involves the human will to actively pursue peace with others and maintain it on an individual basis. Christianity is the capture of a human heart and its re-education to become an active follower of Christ. It means following all his teachings, not just the ones that suit us. We are not free to pick and choose. Loving our enemies has no exclusion clause.

Ok, so Jesus rebuked Pete for drawing his sword and cutting an ear off, but then they had only two swords between them against a trained and armed to the teeth Roman troop. Had he not, the entire crew would have been slaughtered on spot and Jesus' entire life would have been for naught. No one left to tell the stories, no one left to carry on his message, no one left to teach the "good news". So yeah, he told them to buy swords and I'll assume after the fact ... you know, the fact that he was apprehended, beat to a bloody pulp, hung on a cross then put in a tomb because they didn't have the means to protect him, or the manpower.

I read your statements like these and I do not see God anywhere in them.
Jesus was destined for this fate. His disciples could not protect him any more than the "twelve legions of angels" that were at Jesus beck and call his whole life. He was a target of the devil from infancy. Remember the "wise men" who alerted Herod that there was a new "king of the Jews" who had been born. The star that guided them to a murderous King was not sent by God. It was a satanic plot, which was thwarted because God was taking care of his son, as he always did, right up to the moment he took his last breath. The devil was never going to let his sacrifice be an easy path....but his God sustained him through it all.

It's different today. We're or rather they're everywhere and many armed to the teeth and yes ... many have become good if not great shepherds like Jesus.

Sorry, but anyone who advocates violence is not a "good shepherd". Anyone who actively promotes participation in retaliatory violence or in military aggression, especially in someone else's country, is not imitating Jesus Christ.
Personal self defense is allowed for, but there can never be a deliberate attempt to kill or maim someone in that attempt. An absence of malice is the difference between murder and manslaughter. God knows what is in the heart.

I don't like or enjoy violence, but I fully support self defense and defending your family and community and country against those who would have you killed, beaten, enslaved or what have you. Hey ... Isn't that what our military do in a nut shell? Stand and kill and sometimes die so you, me, and everyone in this country have the freedom to live, exist, and be happy?

How do you judge the actions of your military? Sometimes we have this fantasy that "we are the good guys and we can whoop the backsides of the bad guys"......but do you know what propaganda is? Hitler fooled his whole nation by feeding them lies about what was really happening behind the scenes. Its strange how people never think that their own governments could ever do that. But because the fantasy is what we want to believe, we will support their actions no matter how bad they are....the bad guys deserve it...Right? There are always two sides to every story.....do you ever hear the other side?
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
But yeah ... I understand how some ... JW's are and how they view things, and what not. Do you know anything about the crusades? They symbol was a cross. It was used war time as a symbol of strength and perseverance.

Ah yes, the Crusades.....what do you know about them?
Do you understand that Christianity had no cross before a pagan Emperor instituted it as a symbol of the Christianity that was instituted in Rome centuries after Jesus' death? Do you also understand that there is no "cross" in the Bible. The Roman Catholic Church was a fusion of pagan sun worship and apostate Christianity. Christianity had no pope. The title borne by the pope is "Pontifex Maximus" (the Pontiff) It is a pagan Roman title.

Emperor Constantine held the pagan title pontifex maximus, or chief priest, and thought himself overlord of all religions in his realm. He was a worshipper of Zeus all his life; he was never really a committed Christian.

The First Crusade was called by Pope Urban II in 1096. "In his eyes military action to reconquer Jerusalem and Palestine would serve several purposes. It would consolidate the unity of Western Christendom and reaffirm the primacy of the Roman Church. It would provide a vent for perpetual disputes among the upper classes. In exchange for religious and, above all, economic benefits, these would put their military expertise to work for a “noble” cause, becoming the armed wing of the church.

On November 27, 1095, before a council at Clermont, France, Urban launched his appeal. The church painted a dark picture of their foes, as those deserving of divine retribution. Foucher de Chartres, a priest who took part in the First Crusade, said that the war was necessary to defend Eastern “Christians” from Muslims. An immediate remission of sins was promised for those who died on the road or in battle. The feudal lords could thus convert their fratricidal disputes into a “holy” war against the “infidels.” At that council, a cry resounded that was to become the motto of the First Crusade: “God wills it!”

The Crusades—A ‘Tragic Illusion’ — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY

The Crusades were nothing but an excuse for a bloodbath.....a very unholy bloodbath. There could never be "an armed wing of the church" without a complete departure from Christ's teachings. Roman Catholicism is the mother of many daughters. Together they make up "Christendom" but it was never true Christianity, as history attests.

Anyway, and for the self righteous who hinder life and freedom and wish to force their doctrine, rules, and religious policies on the rest of us, I'd suggest there are many against this type of religious rule ... Including me.

Can I ask if God has the right to tell us how to live, and how to exercise our freedom of choice in a way that benefits everyone? Is his way the "religious rule" you speak of?

I love this country, and what this countries government was built upon. We have our constitution, declaration of independence, and our bill of rights (amendments included) that afford us all the opportunity to pursue life, liberty and happiness.

That all sounds good unless you put it into a Christian context. Can I ask how many of your citizens in the US are even able to "pursue life, liberty and happiness" in the current circumstances? How many of them believe that they live in the best country on earth? How many of them see America as the land of the free? A reality check is in order perhaps?

It's a damn good foundation. Separation of church and state, freedom of religion, freedom of speech, etc. The right to bear arms, and the others all go hand in hand to help protect us, which include all who are in this country, both citizens and non-citizens.

Perhaps it was a good foundation, but the building upon which it stands is falling apart. Democracy is dying as man is now seeing that it doesn't work. No human government tried by man has succeeded. This is why God has given them the freedom to try them all, and to see for themselves the complete inadequacy of human rulership....all under the ultimate control of the devil.

A quick Google search will reveal why America always seems to be participating or encouraging wars.....

"This is a list of the world's largest arms manufacturers and other military service companies who profit the most from the War economy, their origin is shown as well....

The numbers are in billions of US dollars.

Rank Company name Defense Revenue
(US$ billions)
% of Total Revenue
from Defense

1 Lockheed Martin 44.9 88%
2 Boeing 26.9 29%
3 Raytheon 23.8 94%
4 BAE Systems 22.9 98%
5 Northrop Grumman 22.3 87%
6 General Dynamics 19.4 63%
7 Airbus 11.2 15%
8 Thales Group 9.0 51%
9 Leonardo 8.8 68%
10 Almaz-Antey 8.5 94% "

That is a lot of dollars, but not enough to bail them out of a $22 trillion dollar debt.

This is why God's Kingdom has to "come" and rid the earth of failed governments and to introduce the kind of rulership we were meant to have at the beginning....God's rulership.
Step back and see the big picture.....Jesus came to get us back to Eden.....back to paradise and to enjoy the earth for the wonderful home God meant for it to be. (Revelation 21:2-4)
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Hitler fooled his whole nation by feeding them lies about what was really happening behind the scenes.
Very good point.
Governments might do similar even now.

See how Europe goes down by EU
See how US goes down by Trump

And this is just the beginning
 

Bird123

Well-Known Member
My Master taught me that the final step is to also let go the idea "I have changed many many people" as this is still EGO

Agreed. My statement was merely a statement of fact. My statement is intended to point others from their belief that no one ever really changes. This belief can prevent some from teaching others lessons they have already learned. Everyone is as capable as I. In reality, everyone changes.

We are all changed through the interaction with others. No one is exempt from that. It is part of God's educational process. If one tries to avoid the interaction with others, loneliness will point the way back to school. There is genius behind everything God does.

Hmmm? My Master??? Who defines this person as a Master? A Master of what???

Finally, I'll leave you with something to Think about if I haven't already......Every child is meant to expand beyond the sum of their teachings. Never choose to limit yourself from the possibilities. Doors are all around you.


Well, that's my view.
 

Bird123

Well-Known Member
Interesting spill that does not apply to me, but thank you just the same. I don't hate people ... I've stated that twice on these boards in just the last two days. I hate what people do. I don't attempt to control others either. I'm not sure why you would even suggest that I do. I hate evil, but I don't view people as evil ... just misguided as I have also stated in the last two days. Umm, would you like to move this to another thread yet to be created? I'll title it Christian Atheism, which sums up my views on spot. We can do a tit for tat or we can discuss reasonably or we can have a nice debate or an ugly one.. that'll be on you entirely.


your quote:I hate evil, but I don't view people as evil ...
My Answer: How do you define Evil?

If you hate, people will feel your hate regardless of what you say. What happens when they feel hate? They put up walls and tend to hate back. This compounds the problems leading to fixing the problems leading to resolution.

What others are doing wrong does not matter. Show them the view they are missing. Do this with Unconditional Love and kindness. When one understands all sides, Intelligence will make the Best choices.

I'll keep an eye out for Christian Atheism. If I see it, I might make some comments.
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
There is genius behind everything God does
Amen to that

Hmmm? My Master??? Who defines this person as a Master? A Master of what???
I define Him to be my Master.
You are not really interested.

Finally, I'll leave you with something to Think about if I haven't already......Every child is meant to expand beyond the sum of their teachings. Never choose to limit yourself from the possibilities. Doors are all around you.
You haven't, but my Master already did. But Thanks for the reminder anyway. It's good to stay focused on this and to remind each other.

My Master always addressed the people listening to His discourse with "Embodiments of the Divine". And sometimes He even said "You are God".

"Never choose to limit yourself from the possibilities" has been taken care of quite well in my case.
 
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