This is Why Your God Will Condemn You Atheist Bashers to Hell

robocop (actually) · Oct 24, 2019

Sunstone said:
An open letter to atheist bashers.

Dear Atheist Basher,

Let's get real. If there is a god, and if that god is (as you atheist bashers seem to believe) personally interested in your morals and values, then what possible grounds do you have to assume even for a nanosecond that god is going to want to spend eternity next to someone as hateful as you?

I mean, you not only figuratively froth at the mouth with hatred when bashing atheists, you so very often lie about atheists when you bash atheists. What are the odds your god is going to want you and your kind by their side?

If I was you, and I believed in the personal god you believe in, I would first beg that god to forgive me for being a hateful person, and then I would spend the rest of my life trying to appreciate and understand this world, their creation, rather than spend even one more minute condemning it.

I'm not BSing you: That is exactly what I would do if I believed in your god but had spent as many years as you have bashing atheists -- atheists and only your god knows how many other people and groups of people.

Oh by the way, if I believed in your god, I would expect to spend eternity in hell right alongside people who bash theists like you bash atheists. So, you might want to get to like theist bashers. Seems to me you're going to be spending a whole lot of time with them if you are right about your god. But it should not be too hard for you to get to like theist bashers. After all, you have so much in common with them.

Now I don't believe in your god, but if I did --- I sure as certain would not be bashing atheists -- and perhaps just about everyone else -- while expecting a pleasant reward for being hateful and (most often) deceptive.

Sincerely.

______________________
And now....

Um... good Christians should want to help reclaim atheists.

shmogie · Oct 24, 2019

robocop (actually) said:
Um... good Christians should want to help reclaim atheists.

Yes, by presenting truth.

We cannot make their choices for them, nor do we have to stand for the arrogant abuse some employ.

As Christ said, present the truth, and if it isn´t accepted, move on down the road.

Arguing with personal comments is counter productive, even if it is employed against you.

loverofhumanity · Oct 24, 2019

Unfortunately we live in an age where possessions, wealth, power and things mean much more to us than people.

To make others happy, to be thoughtful and considerate seems to have taken a nose dive and even religionists sometimes seem more interested in egotistical claims of superiority than being loving and accepting of others.

No one should be shunned or treated with contempt because they believe differently. We are all human beings and we should respect all regardless of religion or no religion.

Workman · Oct 24, 2019

But..YeT!
Here “I Am”...
Confident As I Ever to B...ETERNITY!

“Why? O’ Why!!, Said!.O Vain man.
For Wilt!.Thy Say...NoT! They see?
But YeT!!!.....O’ Vain Man.”

If only You knew of Me..
That..you have realised already!
But You did Not know me..
Than..you’ve realise it already!
And then your see in tears..
‘The Bashing’ was “Bashed to death!”

Your Worst enemy..
Is The inner-me..
Make Peace with your(self).

From now and then forever..
Only God Be My Witness..
For None Other Than Will I Answer For.
I am to take by what I gave..
By in The Name of God..
Forgive Me!..For they do not Understand,
But Now! I WILL force myself to sin.

For In The Name Of God.

A Vestigial Mote · Oct 24, 2019

shmogie said:
Well, satire ( most people no longer understand it), or hyperbole are fine when used regarding a belief or position taken.

Why insult anyone ? Your idea that an insult gets someone to think is true, they think how rude you are, or how to get back at you, their thinking about the issue, your justification for insult, doesn´t survive.

I a a geezer now, and my beliefs have changed, but there was a time when the face to face expression of an insult to me might have netted you some serious pain. Either side in that scenario accomplished nothing.

Insulting someone is the refuge of those who cannot articulate a cogent argument.

If I choose to insult, I have allowed my correspondent to steer my behavior and make me do something that is wrong.

I try my very best to not do it.

Insult doesn't have to be overt, and "in your face." There are ways to hit people pretty hard, mentally or emotionally, without resorting to direct name calling. And I have never, in my entire life, physically attacked anyone for mere words they spoke. Within my life experience, I quickly came to understand that the person who takes discouraging words to heart has literally CHOSEN to do so. It is all too easy for me, myself, to simply dismiss people's words of disparagement toward me. They don't have to mean anything unless I let them.

And as for more "covert" assaults that are actually quite effective, I have an interesting anecdote. I had just gotten into a verbal tiff with the woman next door, because she refused to pick up a dead rat that had somehow ended up in her driveway (probably via a cat) and was goading her 8 year old son to do it. She was basically shivering all over the place, and too disgusted to even look at the thing, and here she was, trying to force someone even younger with less experience to do the dirty work. Mind you, I already had issues with the woman's behavior in the past - one time she was out hooting and hollering on her porch with friends and her kids for 3 whole hours, bragging about how she kicked some other woman's butt in a fight - kept showing pictures and video on her phone to everyone, etc. And another night her and her friend got home at 11:30, which I happened to notice because they were being loud next door. It turns out they left their kids at the house, the eldest of which was 11. They were all asleep because it was a school night, and the one that finally came to the door due to all the noise the women were making was no older than 3. Anyway, the rat thing wouldn't have been such a big deal if it weren't for the fact that I knew her to be lazy, entitled, and just a rather unsavory person overall. But I took issue with it because she wasn't willing to pick it up herself, and the kid was wary, and I could tell he was frightened and there may also have been a tinge of understanding that he was being taken advantage of. This wasn't some assignment of chores, or a lesson in how he may need to do something like this someday - this was happening because the woman was too weak to do anything like this herself. Anyway, I went out and picked up the rat for them both, threw it in the garbage, shaking my head in disgust at her behavior. She caught onto it and wanted to get into it with me, so I obliged her. Anyway, long story short - the woman bad-mouthed me up and down to her kids after she went inside, and they apparently had it out for me, because when my son and I walked to the park, the kids followed us. So we got to the park, and while I was pushing my 5 year old on the swings, they stood right by us and started calling us names and hurling insults, talking back and forth to one another about how stupid and terrible we were. When I asked them to stop, they told me "we're not talking to you, we're talking to each other." because obviously they thought they were just so very smart. Well, when they called my 5 year old the b-word, I had had about enough so I turned to my son and said "You hear those words they're using, son? We don't use those words, okay? Only MORONS use those words." They then piped up to protest, but I simply told them: "I'm not talking to you, I'm talking to my son." You should have seen the looks on those kids' faces. Priceless. They knew in that moment that I had mentally defeated them without so much as even talking to them directly. They seemed to realize that no matter how many curse words they threw out, or how many ways they insulted me directly, they had no more ammunition that was of any use. I had already dropped the H-Bomb. The insults immediately stopped, and they slowly turned their attention elsewhere. They had failed, miserably, and I feel they learned something. Now I am not advocating going around making fun of children. Not at all. What I advocate for is using your wit, tearing people down a few pegs if they need it by showing them that sometimes there's more to it then they ever even contemplated, and maybe they aren't doing things the best way they could be. Maybe they have more to learn, and maybe, just maybe, they came away with an understanding I came to long ago: that you can never know when you are outgunned, so it is best just not to draw in the first place.

Evangelicalhumanist · Oct 24, 2019

Nimos said:
So all in all I don't think God have a huge problem with them bashing atheists and people of other religions. Remember God is all good, as long as you accept that everything he does is good. Which makes you wonder exactly what was meant in the creation story that Adam and Eve could now see the difference between them, clearly something didn't work as intended.

Well, there's your problem! "God is all good, as long as you accept that everything he does is good." But since we can easily read the book you quote so liberally from, and see that much that he did is NOT good, and in fact is evil in the most heinous way, we can dismiss your thinking without further ado.

Nimos · Oct 24, 2019

Evangelicalhumanist said:
Well, there's your problem! "God is all good, as long as you accept that everything he does is good." But since we can easily read the book you quote so liberally from, and see that much that he did is NOT good, and in fact is evil in the most heinous way, we can dismiss your thinking without further ado.

I assume you didn't read my follow up, so Ill link it here:

First of all im an atheist, so if God exists Im pretty sure ill end up in some unpleasant place, on the other hand, living under the rule of God with the morals he is capable of, I would consider this just as bad... and remember that this is also for eternity. So my hope is that God doesn't exist and I can rest in peace when the time comes, as again neither of the solutions seems good to me

My point was that in light of the bible and God, there doesn't seem to be any especial reason to believe that theists bashing unbelievers or those of other religions, is something that concerns God. Looking at the passages, God have no issue condemning people to death for simply believing differently, so why would he be concerned about those simply bashing atheists?

And as an atheist, I find God immoral, hateful, childish and a monster. Which is neither good, all knowing or all powerful... Which clearly demonstrate to me that he is man made and not a God as believers claim he is. He is simply to incompetent to be a God, if he is said to have such characteristics.

What I answered in the first reply, was the specific question from the OP, "why people bashing atheist would think that God would care to spend time with them, for doing so?" I merely pointed out, that based on the bible, there is nothing to suggest that God cares about or would see anything wrong with it. Because he himself in some cases demand that unbelievers and people of others religions ought to be killed simply for not believing.

Since the OP did not reference the bible or made his case based on what it actually says. He is clearly making a statement based on how he "think" God ought to behave, rather than what God actually do see as being wrong. So reference verses showing that God do not actually care about unbelievers could hopefully show him why those bashing atheists shouldn't have anything to fear in regard to God.

But since we can easily read the book you quote so liberally from, and see that much that he did is NOT good, and in fact is evil in the most heinous way, we can dismiss your thinking without further ado.

That is why in the end of the first post I wrote the example with Adam and Eve, If people have truly learned the difference between good and evil as the bible say, then everyone ought to agree that God is good, which we know a lot of people don't. And therefore something must not really have worked out correctly as they ate it.

shmogie · Oct 24, 2019

A Vestigial Mote said:
Insult doesn't have to be overt, and "in your face." There are ways to hit people pretty hard, mentally or emotionally, without resorting to direct name calling. And I have never, in my entire life, physically attacked anyone for mere words they spoke. Within my life experience, I quickly came to understand that the person who takes discouraging words to heart has literally CHOSEN to do so. It is all too easy for me, myself, to simply dismiss people's words of disparagement toward me. They don't have to mean anything unless I let them.

And as for more "covert" assaults that are actually quite effective, I have an interesting anecdote. I had just gotten into a verbal tiff with the woman next door, because she refused to pick up a dead rat that had somehow ended up in her driveway (probably via a cat) and was goading her 8 year old son to do it. She was basically shivering all over the place, and too disgusted to even look at the thing, and here she was, trying to force someone even younger with less experience to do the dirty work. Mind you, I already had issues with the woman's behavior in the past - one time she was out hooting and hollering on her porch with friends and her kids for 3 whole hours, bragging about how she kicked some other woman's butt in a fight - kept showing pictures and video on her phone to everyone, etc. And another night her and her friend got home at 11:30, which I happened to notice because they were being loud next door. It turns out they left their kids at the house, the eldest of which was 11. They were all asleep because it was a school night, and the one that finally came to the door due to all the noise the women were making was no older than 3. Anyway, the rat thing wouldn't have been such a big deal if it weren't for the fact that I knew her to be lazy, entitled, and just a rather unsavory person overall. But I took issue with it because she wasn't willing to pick it up herself, and the kid was wary, and I could tell he was frightened and there may also have been a tinge of understanding that he was being taken advantage of. This wasn't some assignment of chores, or a lesson in how he may need to do something like this someday - this was happening because the woman was too weak to do anything like this herself. Anyway, I went out and picked up the rat for them both, threw it in the garbage, shaking my head in disgust at her behavior. She caught onto it and wanted to get into it with me, so I obliged her. Anyway, long story short - the woman bad-mouthed me up and down to her kids after she went inside, and they apparently had it out for me, because when my son and I walked to the park, the kids followed us. So we got to the park, and while I was pushing my 5 year old on the swings, they stood right by us and started calling us names and hurling insults, talking back and forth to one another about how stupid and terrible we were. When I asked them to stop, they told me "we're not talking to you, we're talking to each other." because obviously they thought they were just so very smart. Well, when they called my 5 year old the b-word, I had had about enough so I turned to my son and said "You hear those words they're using, son? We don't use those words, okay? Only MORONS use those words." They then piped up to protest, but I simply told them: "I'm not talking to you, I'm talking to my son." You should have seen the looks on those kids' faces. Priceless. They knew in that moment that I had mentally defeated them without so much as even talking to them directly. They seemed to realize that no matter how many curse words they threw out, or how many ways they insulted me directly, they had no more ammunition that was of any use. I had already dropped the H-Bomb. The insults immediately stopped, and they slowly turned their attention elsewhere. They had failed, miserably, and I feel they learned something. Now I am not advocating going around making fun of children. Not at all. What I advocate for is using your wit, tearing people down a few pegs if they need it by showing them that sometimes there's more to it then they ever even contemplated, and maybe they aren't doing things the best way they could be. Maybe they have more to learn, and maybe, just maybe, they came away with an understanding I came to long ago: that you can never know when you are outgunned, so it is best just not to draw in the first place.

My working life was in law enforcement and of course I endured every name in the book with nothing more than a stern look. There were a few times when a career criminal scroat, after hurting someone began the mouthy stuff, and paid dearly for it. Street justice.

Of course, this is unprofessional, and as I moved up in rank I punished for street justice, if I knew about it.

Now, as a Christian, I try not to make derogatory comments, and avoid those who do.

shmogie · Oct 24, 2019

LightofTruth said:
Are you so ignorant that you don't know what the RCC and most protestant groups teach?

Tell me about what we Protestants teach.

No, there is no immortal soul, that is a fairy tale.

shmogie · Oct 24, 2019

Mock Turtle said:
I suspect that many atheists (me at least) couldn't give a fig what the religious think of us, and the sentiment is rather returned tenfold when such divisions exist within the religious fraternity. We are essentially just another amongst the mix - and possibly less hated.

We are not the cause of the divisions.

No one should be hated, even a democrat.

shmogie · Oct 24, 2019

Nimos said:
First of all im an atheist, so if God exists Im pretty sure ill end up in some unpleasant place, on the other hand, living under the rule of God with the morals he is capable of, I would consider this just as bad... and remember that this is also for eternity. So my hope is that God doesn't exist and I can rest in peace when the time comes, as again neither of the solutions seems good to me

My point was that in light of the bible and God, there doesn't seem to be any especial reason to believe that theists bashing unbelievers or those of other religions, is something that concerns God. Looking at the passages, God have no issue condemning people to death for simply believing differently, so why would he be concerned about those simply bashing atheists?

And as an atheist, I find God immoral, hateful, childish and a monster. Which is neither good, all knowing or all powerful... Which clearly demonstrate to me that he is man made and not a God as believers claim he is. He is simply to incompetent to be a God, if he is said to have such characteristics.

So, you have an opinion. Everyone does. Why should I hate you for your opinion, no matter how wrong ?

PureX · Oct 24, 2019

I think atheism is a foolish, unnecessary, and groundless negation of possibilities that could be helpful and useful to them, and that have been helpful and useful to a great many other humans.

How is this "hateful"? How is this "bashing" atheists?

Nimos · Oct 24, 2019

shmogie said:
So, you have an opinion. Everyone does. Why should I hate you for your opinion, no matter how wrong ?

Obviously you shouldn't. Any religious person that believe God is the final judge in the end, should see little reason to bash atheists for simply demanding evidence for God. Any atheists having a go at God will ultimately be punished by him if need be.

But my guess is that you can find atheists, just as well as theists that feel a need or that its their job to defend or ridiculous others beliefs to justify their own.

For me, I see no issue in questioning someones beliefs or their scriptures, but I would never have a go at them for believing differently than me. But I will to the extend of my knowledge argue against what they are saying, if it is not supported by their scriptures, but merely stuff that they have made up, because they believe that is how it is. But this is more out of respect for the scriptures than anything else.

74x12 · Oct 24, 2019

Evangelicalhumanist said:
Well, there's your problem! "God is all good, as long as you accept that everything he does is good." But since we can easily read the book you quote so liberally from, and see that much that he did is NOT good, and in fact is evil in the most heinous way, we can dismiss your thinking without further ado.

According to what objective moral system do you condemn God? You obviously don't have a leg to stand on when it comes to logic. Because logically you can't be more intelligent than God. Therefore who are you to say you are right and God is wrong?

Baroodi · Oct 24, 2019

Sunstone said:
An open letter to atheist bashers.

Dear Atheist Basher,

Let's get real. If there is a god, and if that god is (as you atheist bashers seem to believe) personally interested in your morals and values, then what possible grounds do you have to assume even for a nanosecond that god is going to want to spend eternity next to someone as hateful as you?

I mean, you not only figuratively froth at the mouth with hatred when bashing atheists, you so very often lie about atheists when you bash atheists. What are the odds your god is going to want you and your kind by their side?

If I was you, and I believed in the personal god you believe in, I would first beg that god to forgive me for being a hateful person, and then I would spend the rest of my life trying to appreciate and understand this world, their creation, rather than spend even one more minute condemning it.

I'm not BSing you: That is exactly what I would do if I believed in your god but had spent as many years as you have bashing atheists -- atheists and only your god knows how many other people and groups of people.

Oh by the way, if I believed in your god, I would expect to spend eternity in hell right alongside people who bash theists like you bash atheists. So, you might want to get to like theist bashers. Seems to me you're going to be spending a whole lot of time with them if you are right about your god. But it should not be too hard for you to get to like theist bashers. After all, you have so much in common with them.

Now I don't believe in your god, but if I did --- I sure as certain would not be bashing atheists -- and perhaps just about everyone else -- while expecting a pleasant reward for being hateful and (most often) deceptive.

Sincerely.

______________________
And now....

Theists can not be truly theists without having love and best wishes for all mankind

Evangelicalhumanist · Oct 24, 2019

74x12 said:
According to what objective moral system do you condemn God? You obviously don't have a leg to stand on when it comes to logic. Because logically you can't be more intelligent than God. Therefore who are you to say you are right and God is wrong?

I make no such claim. What I do claim is that it is certainly possible that I can be more intelligent -- and a lot better informed -- than those who invented god in the first place. And I know the difference between right an wrong -- and ordering the sacrifice of a child (thus scaring the **** of him and his father, too), and the slaughter and rape of innocents I put on the side of "wrong." Theists apparently see that differently when God does it. That's baffling beyond belief.

But I forget -- you cannot even imagine that I don't actually believe there is such a thing as the god you worship. That is a big failure of imagination on your part, which is really quite surprising, since you have no difficulty at all imagining your deity.

Yokefellow · Oct 24, 2019

Sunstone said:
I mean, you not only figuratively froth at the mouth with hatred when bashing atheists, you so very often lie about atheists when you bash atheists.

I'm not exactly sure who you are referencing, but a True Christian does not hate, but rather is almost universally hated by all.

Be thankful you don't get to experience that.

74x12 · Oct 24, 2019

Evangelicalhumanist said:
I make no such claim. What I do claim is that it is certainly possible that I can be more intelligent -- and a lot better informed -- than those who invented god in the first place. And I know the difference between right an wrong -- and ordering the sacrifice of a child (thus scaring the **** of him and his father, too), and the slaughter and rape of innocents I put on the side of "wrong." Theists apparently see that differently when God does it. That's baffling beyond belief.

But I forget -- you cannot even imagine that I don't actually believe there is such a thing as the god you worship. That is a big failure of imagination on your part, which is really quite surprising, since you have no difficulty at all imagining your deity.

No, I didn't imagine you weren't perceptive enough to realize we were obviously speaking of hypotheticals. Since you speak of God as if God is evil; I am just going along with your hypothetical scenario. Yet you continue to judge God based on your own failing human reasoning. It's irrational.

As in the story of Job; God did not really answer Job's charges. God basically just asked Job what he knew about anything. Yet, Job was a righteous man. Again I say; who are you to accuse God? Wisdom tells us you are just a man and even if you were the most intelligent person to ever live yet you would not know enough to argue with God and prove God is evil.

I conclude that all your reasoning and arguments about how evil God is are irrelevant.

Trailblazer · Oct 24, 2019

Sunstone said:
An open letter to atheist bashers.

Dear Atheist Basher,

Let's get real. If there is a god, and if that god is (as you atheist bashers seem to believe) personally interested in your morals and values, then what possible grounds do you have to assume even for a nanosecond that god is going to want to spend eternity next to someone as hateful as you?

I mean, you not only figuratively froth at the mouth with hatred when bashing atheists, you so very often lie about atheists when you bash atheists. What are the odds your god is going to want you and your kind by their side?

If I was you, and I believed in the personal god you believe in, I would first beg that god to forgive me for being a hateful person, and then I would spend the rest of my life trying to appreciate and understand this world, their creation, rather than spend even one more minute condemning it.

I'm not BSing you: That is exactly what I would do if I believed in your god but had spent as many years as you have bashing atheists -- atheists and only your god knows how many other people and groups of people.

Oh by the way, if I believed in your god, I would expect to spend eternity in hell right alongside people who bash theists like you bash atheists. So, you might want to get to like theist bashers. Seems to me you're going to be spending a whole lot of time with them if you are right about your god. But it should not be too hard for you to get to like theist bashers. After all, you have so much in common with them.

Now I don't believe in your god, but if I did --- I sure as certain would not be bashing atheists -- and perhaps just about everyone else -- while expecting a pleasant reward for being hateful and (most often) deceptive.

Sincerely.

______________________
And now....

I do not bash atheists. I love atheists, and I invite them all to my forum. I have one Christian on my forum, he is very nice. He gets a bit bashed by my atheists but it is all in fun.

My Christian friend never bashes atheists but he bashes me because I am a Baha'i.

dfnj · Oct 24, 2019

Sunstone said:
Dear Atheist Basher,
Let's get real. If there is a god, and if that god is (as you atheist bashers seem to believe) personally interested in your morals and values, then what possible grounds do you have to assume even for a nanosecond that god is going to want to spend eternity next to someone as hateful as you?

Fighting hate is not hate. As some point fighting hate is just standing up for civility. As far as God is concerned, the atheists deserve what the get just as much as anyone else.

I think you argument is weak. You make many assumptions about God and what the afterlife would be like. Once people experience eternal Heavenly bliss I would bet hate is the last thing people are thinking about. I would imagine once you enter the bliss experience you probably would not have any thoughts at all.

I doubt very much anyone could ever have enough hate for God to care or notice. And if they did then God is fully capable of educating every spirit He encounters turning them into the purest of angels where every bit of hate is left behind. Maybe if someone is too hateful God forces them to spend another life on Earth in order to be educated and humbled.

This is Why Your God Will Condemn You Atheist Bashers to Hell

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