Witchcraft vs Wicca

I have no idea of the difference.

Wicca is a specific tradition of witchcraft. Witchcraft is generally thought of as the act of performing magic to manipulate the physical world. Wicca is a pagan religion that uses witchcraft, but it it not the ONLY religion to use witchcraft. Druids (neodruids, that is), Satanists, ceremonial magicians, and even Christianity (though they won't admit that when they pray they are basically doing magic--sending their will out to the divine, entreating It to do what they are asking of It) are all religions that incorporate witchcraft into their spiritual practices.

Wicca is a specific tradition of witchcraft

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I'm sorry, but no it isn't. They are two seperate entities running parallel to each other.

A witch is somebody who casts spells using the natural cycles as allegory and guide. He/she might also summon spirits, work ritual magick, and so forth. These spells can be of any nature at all.

A Wiccan, on the other hand, is a spiritual descendent of Gerald Gardner and/or Alex Sanders and operates under the tenet "An it harm none, do as thou wilt." Although there are many schools of Wicca now - from Faery to Seax to Celtic (the word eclectic crops up time and again in Wiccan self-description) - the general precepts is that the Wiccan worships the Goddess and Horned God (usually with the Goddess in the precedence). The Goddess and God are seen as manifest in all other gods and goddesses, the Divine is easily assessed and recognised in many fms. However, this aspect is shared with some other witches.

Essentially, all Wiccans are witches but not all witches are Wiccans. Within the category of Witchcraft, there are more differentiations. This includes Traditional Witchcraft, which is animistic and polytheistic like many other types of magickal belief, but which admits no superioer entity. The God and Goddess are seen as innate in nature rather than external lofty forces (most Wiccans will see them as both), although spirits will often be called upon to help the witch meet her aim. These spirits are perceived as equal but different, as is all in the cosmos., There is no hierarchy in Traditional Witchcraft, while in Wicca, deities exist are are obviously our "superiors". (Not in the Judeo-Christian/Islamic sense. The deities are respected as evident in natural things - the trees and earth, for example, and the stars and sky - and there is no aspect of fear or punishment in the sense of divinity.)

Wicca tends to be more ritualistic than Traditional Witchcraft, which is simple and often involves no paraphernalia atall. Traditional Witchcraft does not involve casting a Circle, for example, but all places are seen as sacred. The Traditional witch must therefore be naturally fully attuned to magickal thought processes at all times. A Wiccan, on the other hand, can afford to "be mundane" (sometimes a necessity in this world), knowing as she does that small ritual will restore her to her magickal persona and create a spere in which the worlds intermingle.

Wicca is ethical, while Traditional Witchcraft is amoral. In Traditional Witchcraft, emphasis is placed on taking responsibility for one's actions and on intent. The forces of the Universe are seen as neutral (like weather), rather than good or evil. Curses and hexes are used for self-preservation, whereas a Wiccan would never curse, believing in the law of threefold return and in the ethics of "An' it harm none."

Like Wiccans, Traditional witches celebrate the seasonal sabbats and lunar esbats. however, no invocations to theLords of the Watchtowers would precede a Traditional ritual; if protection were needed, spirits and elementals might be summoned to assist, but the mode would not be high magickal. Clothes would be kept on in most Traditional Witchcraft covens, rather than working in ritual robes, or skyclad, as most Wiccans tend to do.

There are witches that belong to neither of these categories, especially as magick and spell-casting have become popular since the 1960s. Information has exited the broom cupboard and landed inteh most public of forums. Thousands of books have become available, leading to this characteristic awareness of natural cycles, the widespread practice of maick, the emergence of new covens, and self-initiation. There are now as many types of witch as there are individuals practising the Craft.

Every Wiccan I have encountered says that Wicca is a tradition of Witchcraft. On this one, I am going to allow themselves to define themselves.

It depends on your definition of Witchcraft.

Essentially, all Wiccans are witches but not all witches are Wiccans.

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Yes, we have established this. I said that Wicca is a branch of Witchcraft (they focus on the "white" magic only, not the "black" or even the "gray"). A Wiccan IS a witch, but a witch is not necessarily Wiccan.

Wicca tends to be more ritualistic than Traditional Witchcraft

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Here you are even saying that Wicca is a particular tradition of Witchcraft. You are comparing Wiccan Witchcraft ot Traditional Witchcraft.

I never said that Wicca is ONLY Witchcraft. I think you believe I did.

Like Wiccans, Traditional witches celebrate the seasonal sabbats and lunar esbats.

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Not all Wiccans celebrate esbats.

Every Wiccan I have encountered says that Wicca is a tradition of Witchcraft. On this one, I am going to allow themselves to define themselves.

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Every wiccan would as then it gives them a history that otherwise they couldn't lay claim to as Wicca actually originated in the 1950s with Gerald Gardner and therefore didn't predate Christianity... however, Witchcraft - or what we believe to have been witchcraft (not having a time machine we can't say for sure) does appear to have predated it.

I said that Wicca is a branch of Witchcraft

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Actually you said it was a specific tradition of witchcraft, but we won't be picky.... and I said it isn't a specific tradition of witchcraft. It is, in actual fact, a branch of paganism that USES some of the tenants of witchcraft.

Here you are even saying that Wicca is a particular tradition of Witchcraft. You are comparing Wiccan Witchcraft ot Traditional Witchcraft.

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No I'm not, I'm comparing some of the parallels between the two. I didn't once say that wicca is a tradition of witchcraft.

Not again... lol

From my understanding You have Paganism (defined already) and then you have as a subclass to that Wicca (Alexandrian, Gardnerian, etc. ) and Wicca is more the "Organized Religion" with specific rituals and practices done a more specific way. Now, I'm not saying that there isn't room for personal changes and beliefs and practices in Wicca, just that Wicca is a more structured form of Paganism.

Witchcraft is only the practice of doing magic, in whatever belief structure.

They coincide quite happily.

But NOT all Witches are Wiccans. And NOT all Pagans are Witches OR Wiccans.

Good grief.

EL

Do you ever get the feeling the stars and sun aren't gods? I do.

They coincide quite happily.

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Coincide.. yes.... but wicca still isn't a tradition of witchcraft *grin*

Do you ever get the feeling the stars and sun aren't gods?

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Sacrilege!!! How could you even THINK that LOL

Bah. Don't be quoting me to use in your "discussion" with Runt. We need a separate forum for just you two.

EL

Yeah, sure.. "discussion"... same as the "discussions" your parents have with the door closed. LOL

We're arguing?. I thought we were discussing

Sounds good to me

i dont think this has any thing to do with this disscuision but this is how i few myself- i am wiccian part of wicca for ME is witchcraft preforming rtiuals and spells being at one with nature, that is MY feelings i am not suggesting my views are the same as everyone elses.

when some one says i have never heard of wicca this is how i explain it to people with no knowledge

christianity has different branches chatholic jewism and protestants in the same way paganism has different branches , does anyone support that belief or understand where i am coming from

blessed said:

christianity has different branches chatholic jewism and protestants in the same way paganism has different branches , does anyone support that belief or understand where i am coming from

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I see it the same way that Blessed does, but I am HIGHLY uneducated in this area, so if in fact I am misguided, I would love to be set straight....

I know that witchcraft is more like a tradition and wicca is a religion.Wicca also is a far newer religion whereas witchcraft is the oldest.But what else?Do they have a difference in the way they do magick?(Wiccans are more strict maybe..)I've searched a lot to find the difference but I'm not satisfied yet.can you help me? : )

Well, to begin with, you've confused your ideas somewhat. WIcca is a religion - Witchcraft is not. People who are Wiccans may practice witchcraft, and so may people of other faiths, but it is not a belief system in it's own right. Witchcraft is more of a system of how to go about magic itself (the "k" was added by Aleister Crowley to differentiate it from stage magic, something that is no longer needed). You may indeed meet practitioners of Witchcraft who are athiests, or agnostics. Wicca does not neccesarily precurse magic, but Witchcraft does, it is a form of magical casting.

You must also remember to differentiate between magic and ritual - that's very important!

Actually, Wicca and Witchcraft don't necessarily have anything to do with one another.Wicca is a religion, while Witchcraft is simply practicing magic. Two very different things.

Not all Wiccans are Witches. I know of some Wiccans who don't practice magic, therefore, they aren't Witches. It's not central to their belief system. If they choose to, fine, but it's not required or even necessarily connected.

As of now, my personal term of 'witchcraft' is the use of energies, spirits, and rituals to help manipulate the world around you. Thus, as I see it, things such as Wicca, Paganism, Voodoo (or Vodoun, however you spell it), and even Native American religions are witchcraft in some way or form.

Alright, don't take my opinion too seriously, I'm still learning about a lot of this.

Wicca, Paganism, etc use witchcraft, but that doesn't mean that they are witchcraft.

Catholicism uses incense during mass, it doesn't mean the it is incense.