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Jesus vs. Nietzsche

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
It doesn't matter whether he loathed the Nazis or not. Hitler was a major Nietzsche fanboy. Which goes to show, even if it's a misread, even if they're your enemies, you are responsible for what you write and the extremes ppl take it.

Nietzsche's Influence on Hitler's Mein Kampf, by M. Kalish

How the Nazis Hijacked Nietzsche, and How It Can Happen to Anybody

See, the thing is, when you write something, you have to be responsible for it, because a wacko can and will take it to its logical extreme. Talk about Darwinist evolution and "survival of the fittest" someone (Hitler also used that) will tell ppl that it's our duty to control favorable evolution and kill off inferior people.

Another one of those who see Christianity as life destroying (probably as a result of some movies where they show "Christians" killing gays or burning abortion clinics, I've seen those movies too and they suck) . Christianity is life destroying but not in the way you'd think. As a result of being shamed by multiple ppl (including these movies) to the point of being cowed, as a result of being told the Crusades were their fault (actually, Islam was at their doorstep in Turkey and Spain, and they were driving it back to its borders), quite a few Christians are pacifists.

( TPAM, Islam misrepresents Jesus, making him a character that requests food from Heaven (see his three temptations to why this is NOT something the real Jesus would do), turning children into pigs (don't ask, it's from al-Tabari), that Jesus and his disciples submitted to the faith of Islam (nvm that Islam came centuries after), and lets someone die in his place. And basically they only mentioned him to sort of point to Muhammad and to be able to say "See? We're the same as you Jews and Christians." Well no, because what you write about many of the Jewish and Christian leaders is either insulting, or not how their text says it happened. So let's call that 1/3 again because that not the Jesus I know. )

Bur remember I said text can be taken to a logical extreme that is unhealthy? Well, week after week, priests around the country preach "love your enemies" and " welcome the stranger". Nevermind that America has a border crisis, as does most of the EU. Nevermind that many of these immigrants are not the brightest and best, but in some cases they send their scumbags, terrorists, and criminals. Jesus also is depicted as some sort of wishy-washy milquetoast type who never rejects anyone.

Soooo, did he welcome Roman officials into his house to spy on him? No. Did he welcome Jewish Pharisees? Not usually (there was one time with that short guy, and another with the guy who didn't do anything for him while that creepy woman used her hair to annoint him). Those two things don't add up to "welcome your enemies.". Yet that's what priests today are trying to push as many of them are idealists or outright radicals.
Why not read Nietzsche yourself instead of being spoon fed bull**** about him? No one with half a functioning brain will find Nazi messages, endorsements, or ideas, as Friedrich himself hated those things, but his ***** sister Elizabeth twisted his words into something Hitler works like, which wasn't Nietzsche but a heavily distorted and warped view of Nietzsche. You can't hold him responsible or accountable for the Nazis because it's just not there unless you want to confuse Elizabeth Forster-Nietzsche-who was a Nazi-with Friedrich Nietzsche, who loathed anti-Semitism. Really, truly, it's as bad, truthful, and honesty as claiming Led Zeppelin tells paroled to worship the devil and Judas Priest gets people to kill themselves. Those are false, unfounded, and unsupportable.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
YES! That's why this forum has hundreds of Christian members, plus atheists who troll them.

YES! The Bible has only endured for 3,500 years now.

YES! Only 1/3 of people acknowledge Jesus as Lord worldwide (Christianity), plus 1/3 of people as a prophet (Islam)m so ONLY 2/3 of humanity knows who Jesus is. Jesus is on the decline!

Your good works are almost done! Keep plugging away until none of us have any religion, salvation (IMHO) or objective morality!
Are you denying that globally Christianity is on dwindling? Around the turn of the millennium many of us left at the end of our teens and as young adults, and 2 decades later the millennial generation followed suit and are leaving the church, especially the fundamentalist and evangelical types. But here, Europe, and Asia, Christians are becoming fewer and fewer.
 

BilliardsBall

Veteran Member
Are you denying that globally Christianity is on dwindling? Around the turn of the millennium many of us left at the end of our teens and as young adults, and 2 decades later the millennial generation followed suit and are leaving the church, especially the fundamentalist and evangelical types. But here, Europe, and Asia, Christians are becoming fewer and fewer.

Yes, I'm denying that. A friend has seen 25,000 Bolivians saved in five years through his movement, another is seeing record crowds of salvations in India and Nepal, another is reaching many people in Nepal and China... China is trying to suppress the Bible again but has 60-100 million born again Christians...

In America, more people are saying their atheist than ever, and more are going churchless, but who said Americans are the wisest people on Earth? People tend to abuse their freedoms, but here in America we're not "free" from alcoholism, pornography addiction, etc., etc.

Praise Jesus for He is building ONE THING--His Church!
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
Yes, Christianity is almost gone, thank God. Only 2/3 of the Earth know who Jesus is--and Jesus's nation of Israel has been Jewish since '48, in fulfillment of prophecy!

Almost... gone...
People have been pointing to this event and that event for about 2000 years now. The Black Death didn't bring prophecy, WWI and II didn't bring it, what makes you think an Israel nation (one that rejects Christ as divine and messiah) will be any different? For 2000 years end of time predictions have been made countless times. So certain was one group it was a "Great Disappointment" when it didn't happen. They shouldn't be though, because the predictions have failed 100% of the time. What really makes your claim any different?
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
Saying it's the end of the world, I see it as no different than someone donning a cape or makeshift wings and proclaiming they can fly. A part of me wants to see them try.
 

BilliardsBall

Veteran Member
People have been pointing to this event and that event for about 2000 years now. The Black Death didn't bring prophecy, WWI and II didn't bring it, what makes you think an Israel nation (one that rejects Christ as divine and messiah) will be any different? For 2000 years end of time predictions have been made countless times. So certain was one group it was a "Great Disappointment" when it didn't happen. They shouldn't be though, because the predictions have failed 100% of the time. What really makes your claim any different?

Some prophecies:

1) The Jews, after rejecting their Messiah, were to be scattered to many nations

2) They would bless each and all of these nations

3) They would be persecuted in each and all of those nations

4) They would inaugurate a Jewish nation again, in 1948 CE!

5) Messiah would return to the Jews

# 4 is fascinating.

After modern Israel was incepted, Christians proclaimed the fulfillment of Bible prophecy, atheists noticed that it was a void prophecy, because…

Ezekiel prophesied a number of years in captivity:

“…As for you [Ezekiel], lie down…for the number of days…three hundred and ninety days (for Israel’s sin)…When you have completed these…I have assigned it to you for forty days (for Judah’s sin)…a day for each year.”—Ezekiel 4:4-6

That's 430 years (biblical years of 360 days each). 70 years of captivity were served in Babylon, leaving 360 years.

Modern atheists noted this... surely the final Jewish diaspora into modern times lasted more than 360 years since the end of the Babylonian captivity! Surely the Bible was wrong:

606 BCE …Judah/Israel taken captive to Babylon

536 BCE …Cyrus allows return to Israel

...360 years later is pre-Roman times in Israel!

Some readers, noticed, however, that Leviticus 26:14-46 says Israel will pay seven times over for disobedience, specifically, in diaspora: "…If also after these things you do not obey Me, then I will punish you seven times more for your sins."

They multiplied 7 times 360 360-day years from the Cyrus decree and in the Gentile calendar this comes out to: Whoa! May 14, 1948 CE! God left it as written to demonstrate it wasn't a self-fulfilled prophecy, and for skeptics to draw it out!


What about coincidence? There are numerous Bible prophecies, these are the sole passages on the God-commanded length of the lengthy diaspora. The coincidence would be millions-to-one. There are similar precise number prophecies relating to other aspects, if you're interested. The date for Christ's crucifixion appears in the Septuagint, which scholars know dates to at least two-and-a-half centuries before Christ.
 

Rational Agnostic

Well-Known Member
Some prophecies:

1) The Jews, after rejecting their Messiah, were to be scattered to many nations

2) They would bless each and all of these nations

3) They would be persecuted in each and all of those nations

4) They would inaugurate a Jewish nation again, in 1948 CE!

5) Messiah would return to the Jews

# 4 is fascinating.

After modern Israel was incepted, Christians proclaimed the fulfillment of Bible prophecy, atheists noticed that it was a void prophecy, because…

Ezekiel prophesied a number of years in captivity:

“…As for you [Ezekiel], lie down…for the number of days…three hundred and ninety days (for Israel’s sin)…When you have completed these…I have assigned it to you for forty days (for Judah’s sin)…a day for each year.”—Ezekiel 4:4-6

That's 430 years (biblical years of 360 days each). 70 years of captivity were served in Babylon, leaving 360 years.

Modern atheists noted this... surely the final Jewish diaspora into modern times lasted more than 360 years since the end of the Babylonian captivity! Surely the Bible was wrong:

606 BCE …Judah/Israel taken captive to Babylon

536 BCE …Cyrus allows return to Israel

...360 years later is pre-Roman times in Israel!

Some readers, noticed, however, that Leviticus 26:14-46 says Israel will pay seven times over for disobedience, specifically, in diaspora: "…If also after these things you do not obey Me, then I will punish you seven times more for your sins."

They multiplied 7 times 360 360-day years from the Cyrus decree and in the Gentile calendar this comes out to: Whoa! May 14, 1948 CE! God left it as written to demonstrate it wasn't a self-fulfilled prophecy, and for skeptics to draw it out!


What about coincidence? There are numerous Bible prophecies, these are the sole passages on the God-commanded length of the lengthy diaspora. The coincidence would be millions-to-one. There are similar precise number prophecies relating to other aspects, if you're interested. The date for Christ's crucifixion appears in the Septuagint, which scholars know dates to at least two-and-a-half centuries before Christ.

Can you cite a single Bible verse that says that Israel would be re-established as a Jewish nation in 1948? Or are you just imagining that vague prophecies say what you want them to say?
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
Some prophecies:

1) The Jews, after rejecting their Messiah, were to be scattered to many nations

2) They would bless each and all of these nations

3) They would be persecuted in each and all of those nations

4) They would inaugurate a Jewish nation again, in 1948 CE!

5) Messiah would return to the Jews

# 4 is fascinating.

After modern Israel was incepted, Christians proclaimed the fulfillment of Bible prophecy, atheists noticed that it was a void prophecy, because…

Ezekiel prophesied a number of years in captivity:

“…As for you [Ezekiel], lie down…for the number of days…three hundred and ninety days (for Israel’s sin)…When you have completed these…I have assigned it to you for forty days (for Judah’s sin)…a day for each year.”—Ezekiel 4:4-6

That's 430 years (biblical years of 360 days each). 70 years of captivity were served in Babylon, leaving 360 years.

Modern atheists noted this... surely the final Jewish diaspora into modern times lasted more than 360 years since the end of the Babylonian captivity! Surely the Bible was wrong:

606 BCE …Judah/Israel taken captive to Babylon

536 BCE …Cyrus allows return to Israel

...360 years later is pre-Roman times in Israel!

Some readers, noticed, however, that Leviticus 26:14-46 says Israel will pay seven times over for disobedience, specifically, in diaspora: "…If also after these things you do not obey Me, then I will punish you seven times more for your sins."

They multiplied 7 times 360 360-day years from the Cyrus decree and in the Gentile calendar this comes out to: Whoa! May 14, 1948 CE! God left it as written to demonstrate it wasn't a self-fulfilled prophecy, and for skeptics to draw it out!


What about coincidence? There are numerous Bible prophecies, these are the sole passages on the God-commanded length of the lengthy diaspora. The coincidence would be millions-to-one. There are similar precise number prophecies relating to other aspects, if you're interested. The date for Christ's crucifixion appears in the Septuagint, which scholars know dates to at least two-and-a-half centuries before Christ.
There's nothing remarkable about that separate or distinguish it from the rest of the 2000 year history of failed prophecies. You seem like every other arrogant Christian who wants to pretend you know what Jesus himself said that not even he knows.
 

BilliardsBall

Veteran Member
Can you cite a single Bible verse that says that Israel would be re-established as a Jewish nation in 1948? Or are you just imagining that vague prophecies say what you want them to say?

I cannot, since the prophecies encompass more than a single verse, for example, here is just ONE of many prophecies about Jesus, circa 700 BCE,

Who has believed our message
and to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?
2 He grew up before him like a tender shoot,
and like a root out of dry ground.
He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him,
nothing in his appearance that we should desire him.
3 He was despised and rejected by mankind,
a man of suffering, and familiar with pain.
Like one from whom people hide their faces
he was despised, and we held him in low esteem.

4 Surely he took up our pain
and bore our suffering,
yet we considered him punished by God,
stricken by him, and afflicted.
5 But he was pierced for our transgressions,
he was crushed for our iniquities;
the punishment that brought us peace was on him,
and by his wounds we are healed.
6 We all, like sheep, have gone astray,
each of us has turned to our own way;
and the Lord has laid on him
the iniquity of us all.

7 He was oppressed and afflicted,
yet he did not open his mouth;
he was led like a lamb to the slaughter,
and as a sheep before its shearers is silent,
so he did not open his mouth.
8 By oppression and judgment he was taken away.
Yet who of his generation protested?
For he was cut off from the land of the living;
for the transgression of my people he was punished.
9 He was assigned a grave with the wicked,
and with the rich in his death,
though he had done no violence,
nor was any deceit in his mouth.

10 Yet it was the Lord’s will to crush him and cause him to suffer,
and though the Lord makes his life an offering for sin,
he will see his offspring and prolong his days,
and the will of the Lord will prosper in his hand.
11 After he has suffered,
he will see the light of life and be satisfied;
by his knowledge my righteous servant will justify many,
and he will bear their iniquities.
12 Therefore I will give him a portion among the great,
and he will divide the spoils with the strong,
because he poured out his life unto death,
and was numbered with the transgressors.
For he bore the sin of many,
and made intercession for the transgressors.

...NOT A "SINGLE VERSE", Farnsworth!
 

BilliardsBall

Veteran Member
There's nothing remarkable about that separate or distinguish it from the rest of the 2000 year history of failed prophecies. You seem like every other arrogant Christian who wants to pretend you know what Jesus himself said that not even he knows.

There's "nothing remarkable" about the Jews receiving a nation-state 2520 years as prophesied, despite persecution and martyrdom? Are you Italian-American for 50 years but don't even speak Italian? (slaps forehead).
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
There's "nothing remarkable" about the Jews receiving a nation-state 2520 years as prophesied,
You're doing the same sort of mathematical gymnastics that many before you have attempted. All did a hard face plant into the ground for the final dismount.
 

BilliardsBall

Veteran Member
You're doing the same sort of mathematical gymnastics that many before you have attempted. All did a hard face plant into the ground for the final dismount.

Defaming the prophecies and my abundant explanation of them isn't a counter-factual.

You can, any way you like, demonstrate how, for example, Israel DID NOT become a nation in one day as prophesied, and in 1948 CE!
 

Rational Agnostic

Well-Known Member
I cannot, since the prophecies encompass more than a single verse, for example, here is just ONE of many prophecies about Jesus, circa 700 BCE,

Who has believed our message
and to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?
2 He grew up before him like a tender shoot,
and like a root out of dry ground.
He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him,
nothing in his appearance that we should desire him.
3 He was despised and rejected by mankind,
a man of suffering, and familiar with pain.
Like one from whom people hide their faces
he was despised, and we held him in low esteem.

4 Surely he took up our pain
and bore our suffering,
yet we considered him punished by God,
stricken by him, and afflicted.
5 But he was pierced for our transgressions,
he was crushed for our iniquities;
the punishment that brought us peace was on him,
and by his wounds we are healed.
6 We all, like sheep, have gone astray,
each of us has turned to our own way;
and the Lord has laid on him
the iniquity of us all.

7 He was oppressed and afflicted,
yet he did not open his mouth;
he was led like a lamb to the slaughter,
and as a sheep before its shearers is silent,
so he did not open his mouth.
8 By oppression and judgment he was taken away.
Yet who of his generation protested?
For he was cut off from the land of the living;
for the transgression of my people he was punished.
9 He was assigned a grave with the wicked,
and with the rich in his death,
though he had done no violence,
nor was any deceit in his mouth.

10 Yet it was the Lord’s will to crush him and cause him to suffer,
and though the Lord makes his life an offering for sin,
he will see his offspring and prolong his days,
and the will of the Lord will prosper in his hand.
11 After he has suffered,
he will see the light of life and be satisfied;
by his knowledge my righteous servant will justify many,
and he will bear their iniquities.
12 Therefore I will give him a portion among the great,
and he will divide the spoils with the strong,
because he poured out his life unto death,
and was numbered with the transgressors.
For he bore the sin of many,
and made intercession for the transgressors.

...NOT A "SINGLE VERSE", Farnsworth!

You are aware that the authors of the New Testament knew these Old Testament "prophecies", correct? It is quite easy to write a book that fulfills "prophecy" but the only way that you can conclude these are fulfilled prophecies is if you assume the New Testament is true.
 
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