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Can you answer my post?Confused

L

LightofTruth

Well-Known Member
Deeje said:
1Corinthians 15:20-28.....

"20 But now Christ has been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep in death. 21 For since death came through a man, resurrection of the dead also comes through a man. 22 For just as in Adam all are dying, so also in the Christ all will be made alive. 23 But each one in his own proper order: Christ the firstfruits, afterward those who belong to the Christ during his presence."

How is Christ the "firstfruits of those who sleep in death? He is not the first person to be resurrected, but the first human raised to spirit life in heaven. His death payed for Adam's sin and released his children from the sentence of death by assuring them of a return to life. But Paul makes it clear that there is an order in the resurrection of the dead. Jesus was first, but Paul said that his anointed disciples would "sleep" until his return, when he promised to take them "home". (See my previous post)

You will notice that this is during Christ's "presence" (not his "coming"). Jesus gave a multi-faceted sign to alert his living disciples that he was "present". If it was a clearly discernible event, a sign would not be necessary. Clearly Jesus' presence (parousia) was to be signalled by what he said in Matthew 24:3-14.....unprecedented war, food shortages, pestilence, great earthquakes, false Messiahs, an increase in lawlessness and the love of people for one another becoming cold, uncaring. (See also Luke 21:7-33)

We believe that 1914 was the beginning of the "time of the end" foretold by Daniel. He was told that his prophesies would not be understood until that time when God would open up an abundance of knowledge. (Daniel 12:4; 9-10) At that time God would cause a "cleansing, whitening and refining" of his worshippers.....the wicked would not accept the cleansing and would therefore be given no insight or understanding of what was taking place, remaining in a spiritual unclean condition.

Only in this "time of the end" would all the things foretold concerning the kingdom be fulfilled, including the "first resurrection" of those "dead in Christ"...his 144,000 anointed ones.

The general resurrection of the dead does not take place until all enemies of God are defeated. Unfortunately, "many" who assume that they are serving the interests of the Lord Jesus Christ, but who are failing at "doing the will of the Father" will suffer a complete and devastating rejection. (Matthew 7:21-23) We must therefore be vigilant about what we accept as Bible truth. We cannot compromise our faith or participate in pagan practices disguised as "Christian" traditions. (2 Corinthians 6:14-18)

"24 Next, the end, when he hands over the Kingdom to his God and Father, when he has brought to nothing all government and all authority and power. 25 For he must rule as king until God has put all enemies under his feet. 26 And the last enemy, death, is to be brought to nothing. 27 For God “subjected all things under his feet.” But when he says that ‘all things have been subjected,’ it is evident that this does not include the One who subjected all things to him. 28 But when all things will have been subjected to him, then the Son himself will also subject himself to the One who subjected all things to him, that God may be all things to everyone."

This is interesting because Paul now jumps forward in time to when "the end" comes. This is not the "end of the age", because in context, he is speaking about a time after that has already taken place.....this is the end of the Kingdom's purpose.....which was to bring about reconciliation of redeemed humanity back with their Creator.....a relationship that was severed in the beginning by Adam. Jesus' death bought back what Adam had lost for his children. The role of the Kingdom is to repair that damage and bring us back to God, removing the the thing that separates us from him...sin.

You see there that when Christ's mission is accomplished and the Kingdom has done all that God purposed for it to do, Jesus hands rulership back to his Father, who alone is man's rightful Sovereign. Everything returns to what God first purposed in Eden. (Isaiah 55:11)

The 144,000 are "bought from the earth" to assist Jesus in his role as Chief Administrator of the Kingdom's benefits to mankind. (Revelation 21:2-4) Since God is the one who chooses them, we have no say in who goes there. Those resurrected to life on earth will experience the joy of living forever in paradise.....it doesn't have to be heaven. That was never God's purpose in creating us.

That is what I believe the Bible teaches.
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My question was, "Where does the Bible say that the 144,000 are resurrected first?"
 
L

LightofTruth

Well-Known Member
74x12 said:
So you have no explanation for Moses!
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Most Christian sects believe it's a conscious immaterial soul or spirit that leaves the body when it dies. Moses was seen in glory. He had a body. That means that he had been raised from the dead sometime prior to his appearing where he spoke to Jesus about what Jesus was to accomplish in Jerusalem.
 
L

LightofTruth

Well-Known Member
Deeje said:
Two resurrections mentioned here....the first resurrection is for those who proved faithful to their death and who were anointed with God's spirit. All of the first Christians were natural Jews, rejected by the Jewish leaders, but accepted by Christ.

"The Israel of God" spoken about by the apostle Paul (Galatians6:16) were anointed followers of Jesus, not just natural Jews because now Gentiles were counted among those who will rule in heaven with Christ.

"The rest of the dead" "come to life" in a real sense only when the 1,000 years have ended because satan is released from his prison for one last test of these ones before everlasting life is granted. (Revelation 20:1-3)
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The first resurrection refers to those who had been slain by the sword for refusing to worship the beast and his image. The second resurrection, or "the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished", refers to the red dragon and all of his associates.
All those who take part in the first resurrection will reign with Christ for a thousand years. And after the thousand years, those who had killed those who reigned with Christ will be raised and will try to overthrow God's kingdom but will fail and die a second death.
 
tгєรкเค

tгєรкเค

Member
LightofTruth said:
Most Christian sects believe it's a conscious immaterial soul or spirit that leaves the body when it dies. Moses was seen in glory. He had a body. That means that he had been raised from the dead sometime prior to his appearing where he spoke to Jesus about what Jesus was to accomplish in Jerusalem.
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A glorious body is not necessarily a physical resurrected earthly flesh, Jesus was of flesh and is physically alive upon transfiguration.

We all knew what went with Elijah's body and so is Moses.

It was said that Elijah(spirit) came through the body (person) of John the baptist and that he was slain.
 
L

LightofTruth

Well-Known Member
tгєรкเค said:
A glorious body is not necessarily a physical resurrected earthly flesh, Jesus was of flesh and is physically alive upon transfiguration.

We all knew what went with Elijah's body and so is Moses.

It was said that Elijah(spirit) came through the body (person) of John the baptist and that he was slain.
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The physical body in the resurrection of the faithful is a spiritual body. It is not an earthy body. The body of the earthy man is the natural mortal body. The body of those raised in glory is a spirit body. They are both physical bodies
 
tгєรкเค

tгєรкเค

Member
LightofTruth said:
The physical body in the resurrection of the faithful is a spiritual body. It is not an earthy body. The body of the earthy man is the natural mortal body. The body of those raised in glory is a spirit body. They are both physical bodies
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There is resurrection of the dead in flesh out from the graves, in endtimes.
 
tгєรкเค

tгєรкเค

Member
LightofTruth said:
The first resurrection refers to those who had been slain by the sword for refusing to worship the beast and his image. The second resurrection, or "the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished", refers to the red dragon and all of his associates.
All those who take part in the first resurrection will reign with Christ for a thousand years. And after the thousand years, those who had killed those who reigned with Christ will be raised and will try to overthrow God's kingdom but will fail and die a second death.
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The second death is the lake of fire. They won't die a second death but their eternal resurrected flesh will be tormented for eternity
 
L

LightofTruth

Well-Known Member
tгєรкเค said:
Jesus' resurrected glorious body is both material and immaterial, both spiritual and 'meta'-physical (heavenly), can you agree?
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No, because immaterial bodies don't exist. It's a contradiction to say something has a body and at the same time is immaterial. A heavenly body is a body raised in glory. it partakes of the divine nature.
 
tгєรкเค

tгєรкเค

Member
LightofTruth said:
No, because immaterial bodies don't exist. It's a contradiction to say something has a body and at the same time is immaterial. A heavenly body is a body raised in glory. it partakes of the divine nature.
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Jesus' resurrected divine nature has a physical body, a flesh but with incorruption. Remember his wounds. The immaterial nature is the spirit of the son of god that dwells within that physical body.
 
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