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Heaven vs the Kingdom

where are you going?

  • straight up to heaven

    Votes: 1 20.0%
  • going to the grave and wait for bodily resurrection

    Votes: 3 60.0%
  • thought it was the same place

    Votes: 1 20.0%

  • Total voters
    5

j1i

Smiling is charity without giving money
What does this have to do with anything Jesus taught? Was Jesus a prophet? Did he not foretell trouble for the earth? But didnt he teach us to control our emotions, our actions and our thought processes? Didn't he teach us to love our enemies and to be no part of the world? It has always had its troubles and Jesus warned that his disciples would be hated and persecuted, but they were to offer no resistance....no retaliation. Vengeance belongs to God....not us.

You can see who the true disciples of Jesus are by the fact that they refuse to participate in the political violence seen in many parts of the world. They are true peacemakers, Because they refuse to engage in carnal warfare or violence of any sort.



God chooses who goes to heaven. I am not one of them. I have no doubt that God knows exactly whom he will save and whom he will eliminate from existence. (Those are the only two choices according to the Bible) I do not believe that God ever meant for any human to go to heaven....why would he? Earth was meant to be out permanent home. Why is that so hard to accept? Why can't the paradise be the one God intended for us all along? Open your mind and heart and see how reasonable that prospect is.

As for who God deems to be faithful to him....the courage of the martyrs comes to mind.....
The martyrdom we see in Islam is not true martyrdom at all. You can't kill yourself and others if you are a follower of Jesus' teachings. A true martyr has their life taken by their enemies and it is a true sacrifice if it was done without compromise. Like the first Christians presented to the Roman crowds for entertainment in the arenas.....all the Christians had to do to walk free was to place a pinch of incense on the alter as an act of worship to the Emperor, but they refused, knowing that they would suffer death by being torn apart by hungry lions. Whole families suffered this death. That is true martyrdom.



The Gospel of Barnabas is not scripture to us. This is nothing more than anti-Christian propaganda to me. If Jesus Christ was not crucified as the ultimate martyr, then we are all still in our sins and condemned to eternal death. Christ's sacrifice is what redeemed humanity....it was a precious gift from God that assured us of forgiveness of our sins and a resurrection into paradise....for the majority of mankind, that will be a return to life on earth restored to its original paradise conditions. Very few are chosen for a heavenly assignment.


I understand why it is painful....there are no real solutions as long as humans are divided on religious grounds, judging one another and condemning one another. No one wants to be wrong.



True brothers do not hate one another....they do not drop bombs or fire rockets at one another. They don't ignore the plight of the innocent ones caught up in the expressions of their "righteous" hatred.

The ridiculous situation in the Middle East has been going on for centuries....but hatred and bloodshed do not represent the teachings of Jesus Christ. So I believe that all humans need to rethink their position on these things.....where there is bloodshed, God is absent. He will cover his ears to the prayers of those with blood on their hands, no matter how pious or religious they pretend to be. (Isaiah 1:15) Its about our actions and what is in our hearts. We can never justify violence to God. When we do, we stop following Jesus. God then leaves us to our justifications.



Today's Christianity is not what Jesus began, so we see so many defecting from religion altogether because of the blatant hypocrisy in all of them. Who can blame them?

But Jehovah's Witnesses have thousands of former Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, and refugees from Christendom's many sects, who have found true peace in following the true teachings of Jesus Christ. There can be no fanaticism.....no slavery to ritual as if mere performance is all that God requires...it's all about the heart. That is where true peace originates.

I wish you peace.


I want to clarify an issue
It is that criminal acts are a seasonal, ecological, psychological, seasonal behavior that changes human behavior according to life conditions

The world has witnessed a lot of wars with a religious background not only Muslims but many beliefs controlled others because of their beliefs and the land and history are wide

Generally
There is no evidence that the validity of what is based on your religious beliefs is true except a book
This book is quite different from the old original versions

god bless you


We believe in the same God (with out trinity) :rolleyes:
If i pray for the true God and ask him mercy and I love him and I want proximity
Do you think that the approach will be exclusive to businessmen or celebrities only
Or for those who fear and provide charity, alms, good work and true faith
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
I want to clarify an issue
It is that criminal acts are a seasonal, ecological, psychological, seasonal behavior that changes human behavior according to life conditions

The world has witnessed a lot of wars with a religious background not only Muslims but many beliefs controlled others because of their beliefs and the land and history are wide

To my mind, as a Christian, I believe that God no longer sanctions war. Like his appointed King, his people are peacemakers....that means that they do not participate in violence of any sort....for any reason.

Any religion that promotes bloodshed is the wrong religion.
Any religion whose adherents belong to armed military forces cannot be following the teachings of Jesus Christ. He taught us to love our enemies. That is the true test.
We are taught to be no part of this world and it's political and religious squabbles. What religion can say that? We can.

Generally
There is no evidence that the validity of what is based on your religious beliefs is true except a book
This book is quite different from the old original versions

I am not quite sure I understand your statements sometimes. :confused:

Are you saying that you do not believe my scripture because it has been changed from the original writings? Are you saying that your own scripture is incorrect for the same reason?

I have a personal belief that scripture is not written by men alone, but men were inspired by the spirit of God to record his words and thoughts. If the power to write scripture was given by God then that same power will preserve its integrity.

We believe in the same God (with out trinity) :rolleyes:
If i pray for the true God and ask him mercy and I love him and I want proximity

Proximity? What is proximity? My goal is to have friendship and intimacy with my Heavenly Father. I do not need ritual or repetitive prayers to communicate with him.....all I have to do is speak to him respectfully from my heart. I do not believe that he requires 'performance'. He requires obedience to all his requirements.

I do not worship a trinity God. I worship the same God as Abraham and Jesus Christ. (Deuteronomy 6:4)
Jehovah's Witnesses are not part of Christendom. I do not believe that Jesus was God. I do believe that he was the son of God because that is what he called himself.

Do you think that the approach will be exclusive to businessmen or celebrities only
Or for those who fear and provide charity, alms, good work and true faith

What an odd question. o_O

I do not believe that those who hold positions of honour, wealth or fame in the world have any particular place with God...in fact I believe that the opposite is true. These positions mean nothing to him or us.

All of the positive things you mention are correct....but you left out faith in the atoning value of Christ's blood. He was sent by God to offer his life for Adams children, who inherited their father's debt (sin) Jesus became the redeemer by paying the debt....a sinless life for a sinless life. (At-one-ment).

Fearing God and having true faith to us, means believing the truth....there can only be one truth and I believe that only one group of people can be the true worshippers of the true God. It is up to each one of us to find them and become one with them.
 

j1i

Smiling is charity without giving money
To my mind, as a Christian, I believe that God no longer sanctions war. Like his appointed King, his people are peacemakers....that means that they do not participate in violence of any sort....for any reason.

Any religion that promotes bloodshed is the wrong religion.
Any religion whose adherents belong to armed military forces cannot be following the teachings of Jesus Christ. He taught us to love our enemies. That is the true test.
We are taught to be no part of this world and it's political and religious squabbles. What religion can say that? We can.



I am not quite sure I understand your statements sometimes. :confused:

Are you saying that you do not believe my scripture because it has been changed from the original writings? Are you saying that your own scripture is incorrect for the same reason?

I have a personal belief that scripture is not written by men alone, but men were inspired by the spirit of God to record his words and thoughts. If the power to write scripture was given by God then that same power will preserve its integrity.



Proximity? What is proximity? My goal is to have friendship and intimacy with my Heavenly Father. I do not need ritual or repetitive prayers to communicate with him.....all I have to do is speak to him respectfully from my heart. I do not believe that he requires 'performance'. He requires obedience to all his requirements.

I do not worship a trinity God. I worship the same God as Abraham and Jesus Christ. (Deuteronomy 6:4)
Jehovah's Witnesses are not part of Christendom. I do not believe that Jesus was God. I do believe that he was the son of God because that is what he called himself.



What an odd question. o_O

I do not believe that those who hold positions of honour, wealth or fame in the world have any particular place with God...in fact I believe that the opposite is true. These positions mean nothing to him or us.

All of the positive things you mention are correct....but you left out faith in the atoning value of Christ's blood. He was sent by God to offer his life for Adams children, who inherited their father's debt (sin) Jesus became the redeemer by paying the debt....a sinless life for a sinless life. (At-one-ment).

Fearing God and having true faith to us, means believing the truth....there can only be one truth and I believe that only one group of people can be the true worshippers of the true God. It is up to each one of us to find them and become one with them.

I believe we will be with each other
Not based on our ethnic group (God is not racist)
But based on our faith group


I believe in these verses from quran

21:105 to 112

We have written in the Psalms, after the Reminder, that the earth will be inherited by My righteous servants.

Indeed, in this is a message for people who worship.

We did not send you except as mercy to mankind. (means prophet Muhammad)

Say, "It is revealed to me that your God is One God. Are you going to submit?"

But if they turn away, say, "I have informed you sufficiently. Although I do not know whether what you are promised is near or far."

He knows what is said openly, and He knows what you conceal.

"And I do not know whether it is perhaps a trial for you, and an enjoyment for a while."

He said, "My Lord, judge with justice." And, "Our Lord is the Gracious, Whose help is sought against what you allege."

thanks for your replay
god luck sister (^_^)
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
I believe we will be with each other
Not based on our ethnic group (God is not racist)
But based on our faith group

Through his prophet Isaiah God said concerning Jesus as Messiah and judge....

"And he will find delight in the fear of Jehovah.

He will not judge by what appears to his eyes,

Nor reprove simply according to what his ears hear.


4 He will judge the lowly with fairness,

And with uprightness he will give reproof in behalf of the meek ones of the earth.


He will strike the earth with the rod of his mouth

And put the wicked to death with the breath of his lips."
(Isaiah 11:3-4)

I have faith that God knows the hearts of all and that not a single faithful, obedient person will perish.
 

j1i

Smiling is charity without giving money
Through his prophet Isaiah God said concerning Jesus as Messiah and judge....

"And he will find delight in the fear of Jehovah.

He will not judge by what appears to his eyes,

Nor reprove simply according to what his ears hear.


4 He will judge the lowly with fairness,

And with uprightness he will give reproof in behalf of the meek ones of the earth.


He will strike the earth with the rod of his mouth

And put the wicked to death with the breath of his lips."
(Isaiah 11:3-4)

I have faith that God knows the hearts of all and that not a single faithful, obedient person will perish.


Historical events in which the bad guys are defeated are many
The Muslims defeated the Tartars and the Mongols and rid Europe of their evil
This is a noble heroic act
Also the Romans defeated the Persians and saved the Arabs from their evil
There are many heroic acts to serve humanity that cannot be ignored

Now Christianity and Judaism in short
The question is not to believe your words
Your attempt to convince me in this thread is wrong, because it does not accept the principle of reincarnation
I want you to know that the subject of Abraham's sons is integrated

The scenario is totaly minus
I see that there is a building and there is an imperfect building block missing which still that is not complete, except with the thread of Islam

There is an imperfect character
Prophet Muhammad is the building block that will complete the building of faith and humanity

The children of Israel for knowledge
They have been punished on many occasions
Lost in the desert forty years (this shows or evidence that any of the children of Israel could lose the prize, and the ascent of the heavens)
Punishment in the worship of the calf

Here is evidence that the selection of the successful candidates will be based on their faith, not their nationality or ethnicity

The race is open not only to the sons of Abraham
But for all mankind
Faith, good deeds, honesty and sincerity at work


Exodus or (Migration) to god is available to everyone who want from all countries and nations :)

are you ready for honorable challenge :D




I do not disagree that Jesus' personality will be present at the end of time even in Islamic belief
But he will return as an ordinary person as a vengeance and take his right and live his life as a normal human being and not as his God

The former prophets simply worshiped God without Jesus and without a Trinity and their faith was true. If the Trinity was the oldest in existence, we would start from the first source worshiping Jesus.

It is a small lie that has become enormous.

How insulting God or falsely bringing God is a cause of destruction

This is what is happening in the of the world and destruction will come more even to us and all the world because few believe that the only God worthy of divinity
 
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Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
I'm sorry but I believe that English is not your first language and much of what you write is not clear to me. There is much lost in translation I think.

Historical events in which the bad guys are defeated are many
The Muslims defeated the Tartars and the Mongols and rid Europe of their evil
This is a noble heroic act
Also the Romans defeated the Persians and saved the Arabs from their evil
There are many heroic acts to serve humanity that cannot be ignored

I believe that when Jesus came, he taught us to love our enemies.....you cannot do that with weapons.
He taught us to love our neighbor as ourselves.....do we want people to hate us and kill us? We should not do that to them either. He said if someone slapped you to turn the other cheek....IOW don't retaliate to an insult.

If Jesus is also your prophet why do you ignore his teachings? Does Mohamed contradict Jesus, if so then one of them is not from God because he never gives people mixed messages.

Any religion that teaches that bloodshed is all right with God is the wrong religion IMO. (Isaiah 1:15)

There is nothing noble about killing our fellow humans for reasons of hatred towards their race or religion. Religion should have no partnership with politics...it is an unholy alliance.

Now Christianity and Judaism in short
The question is not to believe your words
Your attempt to convince me in this thread is wrong, because it does not accept the principle of reincarnation
I want you to know that the subject of Abraham's sons is integrated

I never asked you to believe my words....they stand alone, firmly grounded in the word of God. You can accept them or reject them....the choice is yours.

I am puzzled about the concept of "reincarnation"....I do not believe in it, nor do I see any scripture that promotes it. I do not believe that Jesus' return will be in physical form.....nowhere does scripture say this.

Reincarnation involves belief in an immortal soul that can exist separate and distinct from the body, which is not taught in either Jewish or Christian scripture. Disembodied spirits in the Bible are either angels (who always materialized) or demons who can impersonate the dead and even invade people's bodies. None are spirits of the dearly departed.

God's warning was clear....

Deuteronomy 18:9-12....
"When you have entered into the land that Jehovah your God is giving you, you must not learn to imitate the detestable practices of those nations. 10 There should not be found in you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire, anyone who employs divination, anyone practicing magic, anyone who looks for omens, a sorcerer, 11 anyone binding others with a spell, anyone who consults a spirit medium or a fortune-teller, or anyone who inquires of the dead. 12 For whoever does these things is detestable to Jehovah, and on account of these detestable practices Jehovah your God is driving them away from before you."

Our beliefs are like our children....we can often excuse their bad behavior for our own reasons....I do not believe that God will.

I wish you peace.
 

j1i

Smiling is charity without giving money
I'm sorry but I believe that English is not your first language and much of what you write is not clear to me. There is much lost in translation I think.



I believe that when Jesus came, he taught us to love our enemies.....you cannot do that with weapons.
He taught us to love our neighbor as ourselves.....do we want people to hate us and kill us? We should not do that to them either. He said if someone slapped you to turn the other cheek....IOW don't retaliate to an insult.

If Jesus is also your prophet why do you ignore his teachings? Does Mohamed contradict Jesus, if so then one of them is not from God because he never gives people mixed messages.

Any religion that teaches that bloodshed is all right with God is the wrong religion IMO. (Isaiah 1:15)

There is nothing noble about killing our fellow humans for reasons of hatred towards their race or religion. Religion should have no partnership with politics...it is an unholy alliance.



I never asked you to believe my words....they stand alone, firmly grounded in the word of God. You can accept them or reject them....the choice is yours.

I am puzzled about the concept of "reincarnation"....I do not believe in it, nor do I see any scripture that promotes it. I do not believe that Jesus' return will be in physical form.....nowhere does scripture say this.

Reincarnation involves belief in an immortal soul that can exist separate and distinct from the body, which is not taught in either Jewish or Christian scripture. Disembodied spirits in the Bible are either angels (who always materialized) or demons who can impersonate the dead and even invade people's bodies. None are spirits of the dearly departed.

God's warning was clear....

Deuteronomy 18:9-12....
"When you have entered into the land that Jehovah your God is giving you, you must not learn to imitate the detestable practices of those nations. 10 There should not be found in you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire, anyone who employs divination, anyone practicing magic, anyone who looks for omens, a sorcerer, 11 anyone binding others with a spell, anyone who consults a spirit medium or a fortune-teller, or anyone who inquires of the dead. 12 For whoever does these things is detestable to Jehovah, and on account of these detestable practices Jehovah your God is driving them away from before you."

Our beliefs are like our children....we can often excuse their bad behavior for our own reasons....I do not believe that God will.

I wish you peace.

Muhammad is a prophet who completes the prophet Jesus and does not oppose the two messages
There are conversations of Muhammad calling as Jesus called. If you compare the advice of the Prophet Muhammad is finer and more merciful than Jesus himself

You are influenced by the subversive propaganda of the Islamic religion
The Koran does not urge murder
Anyone who reads the Koran is shivering his body because of the wisdom, truth and truth, and it is the inevitable words of God and there is no fallacies as people speak in it without the least degrees of consideration

My sister, I meant the concept of reincarnation
That is, do not force me to carry your unsupported ideas
We all agree on the facts
But we disagree on matters
These issues are the subject of dialogue for integration, give and take
It is not compulsory to copy it from you and follow it

I am not a Muslim if I do not believe in Christ
I believe in Christ and his role at the end of time, but according to Islamic culture
jesus will kill the liar

take care
good luck
 
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