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Is Halloween evil?

amorphous_constellation

Well-Known Member
It's when you say stuff like this that I simply can't take you seriously.

People who grew up in seasonal places with really cold winters noticed days getting longer, and obviously wanting the the heat of the sun to come back, saw it as a rebirth when it did come. You have to think outside of your normal framework I think, I really have to recommend you read a few books / watch youtube videos on paganism to learn about it..
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Here, read chapter five of this book, "The Religion of the Ancient Celts." Brigid was our goddess of knowledge among other things. She was one figure among many turned into a saint.

Religion of the Ancient Celts.
Isn't this a Neo-Pagan book? Sorry, but I have no respect for Neo-Paganism because, quite frankly, they lie.

They falisify history, claiming to be the continuation of Old Paganism, but the truth is that the Old Paganism died out, and there was no one to teach it. So the new Pagans did the best they could with the limited information in books, and added a whole bunch of stuff that they simply made up out of whole cloth.

In many cases, they left out stuff that they found unappealing, such as human sacrifice by the Celts in Central Europe.

And they don't actually believe in magick, which works every time. Instead they believe in magick as a form of prayer, which may or may not work. They even encourage their members to make up their own magick spells, which simply wouldn't happen if they truly believed in the integrity of magick.
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
People who grew up in seasonal places with really cold winters noticed days getting longer, and obviously wanting the the heat of the sun to come back, saw it as a rebirth when it did come. You have to think outside of your normal framework I think, I really have to recommend you read a few books / watch youtube videos on paganism to learn about it..
I'm not disputing the origins of paganism. I'm simply saying that Christianity (and All Hallows Even' by extension) is not pagan, but replaced paganism).
 

amorphous_constellation

Well-Known Member
Isn't this a Neo-Pagan book? Sorry, but I have no respect for Neo-Paganism because, quite frankly, they lie.

The dude who wrote it was obviously a pretty intense scholar judging by his footnotes

So here's a quote from chapter 5 (and it's a public domain book so I guess I'll quote away)

"Danu is also identified with Brigit, goddess of knowledge (dán), perhaps through a folk-etymology. She was worshipped by poets, and had two sisters of the same name connected with leechcraft and smithwork.223 They are duplicates or local forms of Brigit, a goddess of culture and of poetry, so much loved by the Celts. She is thus the equivalent of the Gaulish goddess equated with Minerva by Cæsar, and found on inscriptions as Minerva Belisama and Brigindo. She is the Dea Brigantia of British inscriptions.224 One of the seats of her worship was the land of the Brigantes, of whom she was the eponymous goddess, and her name (cf. Ir. brig, "power" or "craft"; Welsh bri, "honour," "renown") suggests her high functions. But her popularity is seen in the continuation of her personality and cult in those of S. Brigit, at {69} whose shrine in Kildare a sacred fire, which must not be breathed on, or approached by a male, was watched daily by nineteen nuns in turn, and on the twentieth day by the saint herself."

Ok so... there was a Celtic tribe named after Brigit, and there are inscriptions from roman times describing her. But according to you it's the protestants that doing this.... ok.. right
 

Callisto

Hellenismos, BTW
It DIED OUT. Trick or Treating was created in the 20th century.
No. Immigrants brought the tradition with them to the US, mainly the Irish. What you're confusing is it becoming widespread in the 20th century. But yes, before then people were still celebrating Halloween and some of the practices became modified. Instead of turnips and gourds for jack o' lanterns, pumpkins became the norm. instead of dressing up as saints, non-religious costumes. Instead of meal-type food, as often it had been the poor that went door to door, it became sweets.
 

Callisto

Hellenismos, BTW
The equinox is more than a month before.

The whole point of the Christianization was to END pagan holidays, to offer SUBSTITUTES so that people would STOP being pagan. So it's rather stupid for people to insist that the Church is really pagan, don't you think?
No, the point of christianizing pagan holidays was to lull the masses into converting by making Christianity seem less alien. Populations were loathed to give up traditions and customs so the church slapped on a veneer.
 

crossfire

LHP Mercuræn Feminist Heretic ☿
Premium Member
First of all, dressing up as animals is a far cry from the costumes we have today.

Second of all, these practices DIED OUT. Trick or treating began in the 20th century. It is only coincidence that there is any similarity. You might as well draw similarity between Trick or Treating and masquerade balls, it is just as unrelated but alike in some ways.
How many times have Jewish traditions died out and been revived again? There seem to be many examples of such throughout the books of the prophets. How are these revivals any different from the revival of Halloween?
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
you know Jesus wasn't born in December nor did the church celebrate Christmas originally, right? (I hope!)
December 25 was one of the days that many did think was the actual birthday, which is one of the reasons it was chosen. Also it's proximity to the feast of the epiphany.

The original church was a Jewish sect that only celebrated the Jewish holy days. It evolved into the Gentile church that exists today with its own holy days -- no surprises there.
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
How many times have Jewish traditions died out and been revived again? There seem to be many examples of such throughout the books of the prophets. How are these revivals any different from the revival of Halloween?
Can you give an example of a major Jewish tradition that died out and was revived? Please give a web link and quote documenting it.
 

crossfire

LHP Mercuræn Feminist Heretic ☿
Premium Member
Can you give an example of a major Jewish tradition that died out and was revived? Please give a web link and quote documenting it.
What about the destruction of Solomon's Temple and the Babylonian captivity and the rebuilding of the Temple and reinstitution of the sacrificial rites there? Do you really need a web link for this?
 

exchemist

Veteran Member
The equinox is more than a month before.

The whole point of the Christianization was to END pagan holidays, to offer SUBSTITUTES so that people would STOP being pagan. So it's rather stupid for people to insist that the Church is really pagan, don't you think?
Yes of course. If you want to convert people who have established traditions, you are obviously going to get a far more sympathetic hearing from them if you do not try to deprive them of traditional customs that mark the rhythm of the seasons.

You will find that in Christianity it will usually be the extreme Protestants that affect to disapprove of Hallowe'en, Christmas etc. These are people who are suspicious of all ritual and tradition, insisting as they do on a stripped-back form of belief that relies on personal emotion, often whipped up by demagogic preachers. For the rest of us, ritual and tradition play a legitimate role, being ways of engendering a sense of community and getting into a frame of mind to consider spiritual things.

It's fair to say that modern, post-Christian practices, at both Hallowe'en and Christmas, have rather lost the plot on this, however.;)
 

JJ50

Well-Known Member
Yes of course. If you want to convert people who have established traditions, you are obviously going to get a far more sympathetic hearing from them if you do not try to deprive them of traditional customs that mark the rhythm of the seasons.

You will find that in Christianity it will usually be the extreme Protestants that affect to disapprove of Hallowe'en, Christmas etc. These are people who are suspicious of all ritual and tradition, insisting as they do on a stripped-back form of belief that relies on personal emotion, often whipped up by demagogic preachers. For the rest of us, ritual and tradition play a legitimate role, being ways of engendering a sense of community and getting into a frame of mind to consider spiritual things.

It's fair to say that modern, post-Christian practices, at both Hallowe'en and Christmas, have rather lost the plot on this, however.;)

Ritual and tradition are meaningless, especially when practiced by the RCC.
 

JJ50

Well-Known Member
The RCC is one of the worst Christian doctrines, it is corrupt. It has been responsible for much evil over the centuries, like the Spanish Inquisition, turning a blind eye to the paedophile priests, and the evil perpetrated by some nuns in charge of schools, and those terrible Magdalene laundries.:mad::mad::mad:
 
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