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ISIS Rears Its Head, Adding to Chaos as Turkey Battles Kurds

metis

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Throwing a close ally like the Kurds under the bus so as to be slaughtered is going to have repercussions for years as who can trust any promise by Trump, and then maybe even the next president. We formed alliances and stuck with them the best we could for decades so we were considered to be reliable partners and hoped that they would reciprocate.

With Trump, nothing is sacred-- except himself. He will throw his supporters under the bus in an instant of it fits his egomania and his desire to be an autocrat..
 
Salvador

Salvador

RF's Swedenborgian
sooda said:
The Turks and the Kurds should get together and kick Assad to the court in the Hague,
Click to expand...

My concern there would be a regime change in Syria resulting in a post Gaddafi-Libyan type disaster like what happened in Libya after Muammar Gaddafi’s removal from power. In Libya, without civil governance holding the country together, tribal alliances collapsed and a 4-way fight for power ensued.. Removal of Assad from power could result in a persistent militant Islamic State presence in Syria. The ensuing power vacuum following the sudden removal of Assad could be worse than the status quo situation, and feed the already ripe conditions for violent extremists and paramilitary actors.
 
Salvador

Salvador

RF's Swedenborgian
metis said:
Throwing a close ally like the Kurds under the bus so as to be slaughtered is going to have repercussions for years as who can trust any promise by Trump, and then maybe even the next president. We formed alliances and stuck with them the best we could for decades so we were considered to be reliable partners and hoped that they would reciprocate.

With Trump, nothing is sacred-- except himself. He will throw his supporters under the bus in an instant of it fits his egomania and his desire to be an autocrat..
Click to expand...

When we Trump supporters elected Donald J. Trump to be our P.O.T.U.S, he had promised American troops would not get directly involved in this endless civil war. Kudos to Trump for once again keeping his campaign promise.
 
metis

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Salvador said:
When we Trump supporters elected Donald J. Trump to be our P.O.T.U.S, he had promised American troops would not get directly involved in this endless civil war. Kudos to Trump for once again keeping his campaign promise.
Click to expand...
So, his campaign promise is more important to you than hundreds, and maybe thousands of people getting slaughtered? With "friends" like that, who needs enemies. Would you desert your friends in an hour of their need as well and allow them to be slaughtered as well?

We made a promise to the Kurds if they'd help us, and they did. So now their lives are essentially meaningless, right? They are heavily out-manned and out-weaponed by the Turks, so they really are at their mercy unless something is done to stop the latter.
 
Salvador

Salvador

RF's Swedenborgian
metis said:
So, his campaign promise is more important to you than hundreds, and maybe thousands of people getting slaughtered? With "friends" like that, who needs enemies. Would you desert your friends in an hour of their need as well and allow them to be slaughtered as well?

We made a promise to the Kurds if they'd help us, and they did. So now their lives are essentially meaningless, right? They are heavily out-manned and out-weaponed by the Turks, so they really are at their mercy unless something is done to stop the latter.
Click to expand...

Honestly I care more about the lives of American citizens and soldiers than what happens among foreigners . However, if need be, a no-fly zone over northern Syria could be imposed to prevent any mass genocide from happening there. Our formal N.A.T.O. ally Turkish President Erdogan has actually advocated for a U.S.-led no-fly zone over northern Syria.
 
metis

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Salvador said:
Honestly I care more about the lives of American citizens and soldiers than what happens among foreigners .
Click to expand...
A God-given human life is more important than boundaries, imo, nor do I see an American life being more important in the "eyes" of God than a Kurdish life, per the Gospel. We made a promise to protect, and betraying that promise and letting so many people suffer and die is unethical, imo.

So, I guess we'll never agree.
 
sooda

sooda

Veteran Member
Shad said:
Kurd's problem as they could have handed over the prisoners to Assad or Baghdad long ago. The Kurds want to carve out their own nation state as they refused to acknowledge Assad October 8th. The US has no obligation to defend the Kurds as they enact their own agenda.
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Assad couldn't organize a trip to the john..

You think Kurds and Turks should fight while Assad sits on his *** waiting for someone to give him money to rebuild Syria? Nothing has changed. Assad is still a butcher.
 
Salvador

Salvador

RF's Swedenborgian
metis said:
A God-given human life is more important than boundaries, imo, nor do I see an American life being more important in the "eyes" of God than a Kurdish life, per the Gospel. We made a promise to protect, and betraying that promise and letting so many people suffer and die is unethical, imo.

So, I guess we'll never agree.
Click to expand...

Neither I nor our current P.O.T.U.S. ever made any such promise to protect Kurdish lives or end their suffering.

Rather than expecting others like some few dozen American soldiers to put their lives at risk by getting caught in the crossfire between two natural enemies, maybe perhaps any able-bodied persons who feel so strongly about defending Kurdish lives and putting an end to the suffering of Kurds should themselves go to northern Syria and help out the Kurds. ....;)
 
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Wandering Monk

Wandering Monk

Well-Known Member
sun rise said:
Thanks, donny, by allowing Turkey to attack the Kurds who fought along side us in the battle against the terrorists, the terrorists see an opening in the chaos Turkey created. Many innocent victims which probably will include Americans will be on your head. Even the Republican cowards in the Senate are speaking out again what you did. I'm sure you'll be calling all of them traitors soon and asking your followers to primary them.

ISIS Rears Its Head, Adding to Chaos as Turkey Battles Kurds

The Turkish invasion of Kurdish-held territory in northern Syria raised new fears of a resurgence of the Islamic State on Friday, as five militants escaped from a Kurdish-run prison and the extremist group claimed responsibility for a bomb that exploded in the regional capital.

As Turkish troops launched a third night of airstrikes and ground incursions, Kurdish fighters said they had thwarted a second attempt to break out of a detention camp for families of Islamic State members.
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So we should stay in Syria to fend off another NATO nation?
 
T

Terry Sampson

Well-Known Member
Wandering Monk said:
So we should stay in Syria to fend off another NATO nation?
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Gotta think outside the box.
  • "Choices" inside the box, IMO:
    • Send more U.S. troops to defend the Kurds; and impeach & remove Trump, Pence, Pompeo, and Barr; and lock Giulianni and Trump up.
    • Give the Kurds the weapons to defend themselves; and impeach & remove Trump, Pence, Pompeo, and Barr; and lock Giulianni and Trump up.
    • No weapons or soldiers and pull out U.S. soldiers that are there. Let the Kurds figure out their own solution; and impeach & remove Trump, Pence, Pompeo, and Barr; and lock Giulianni and Trump up.
  • "Choices" outside the box, IMO:
    • Sanction the sh** out of Turkey until they decide to figure out a solution in cooperation with the Kurds; and impeach & remove Trump, Pence, Pompeo, and Barr; and lock Giulianni and Trump up.
    • Offer the Kurds transportation to Mexico and see if they can improve it; and impeach & remove Trump, Pence, Pompeo, and Barr; and lock Giulianni and Trump up.
    • ...
 
Salvador

Salvador

RF's Swedenborgian
Terry Sampson said:
Gotta think outside the box.
  • "Choices" inside the box, IMO:
    • Send more U.S. troops to defend the Kurds; and impeach & remove Trump, Pence, Pompeo, and Barr; and lock Giulianni and Trump up.
    • Give the Kurds the weapons to defend themselves; and impeach & remove Trump, Pence, Pompeo, and Barr; and lock Giulianni and Trump up.
    • No weapons or soldiers and pull out U.S. soldiers that are there. Let the Kurds figure out their own solution; and impeach & remove Trump, Pence, Pompeo, and Barr; and lock Giulianni and Trump up.
  • "Choices" outside the box, IMO:
    • Sanction the sh** out of Turkey until they decide to figure out a solution in cooperation with the Kurds; and impeach & remove Trump, Pence, Pompeo, and Barr; and lock Giulianni and Trump up.
    • Offer the Kurds transportation to Mexico and see if they can improve it; and impeach & remove Trump, Pence, Pompeo, and Barr; and lock Giulianni and Trump up.
    • ...
Click to expand...


How about letting the American voters decide next year if Donald J. Trump should be our P.O.T.U.S. for four more years?
 
sun rise

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
Wandering Monk said:
So we should stay in Syria to fend off another NATO nation?
Click to expand...
The Kurds were our allies in the fight against ISIS and really helped us. Or do you want to give terrorists free reign and a safe haven to attack again?

Turkey under the Islamist strong-man Erdogan is no friend of ours. Trump is tearing up other treaties - he can propose the same for Turkey which is slipping down the path to being an Islamist dictatorship.
 
sooda

sooda

Veteran Member
Salvador said:
Neither I nor our current P.O.T.U.S. ever made any such promise to protect Kurdish lives or end their suffering.

Rather than expecting others like some few dozen American soldiers to put their lives at risk by getting caught in the crossfire between two natural enemies, maybe perhaps any able-bodied persons who feel so strongly about defending Kurdish lives and putting an end to the suffering of Kurds should themselves go to northern Syria and help out the Kurds. ....;)
Click to expand...

Trump promised the Kurds and then betrayed them. The Arab allies are pissed.

Trump accused of betraying Kurds and giving ISIS new life after green-lighting Turkey invasion of northern Syria
 
Raymann

Raymann

Active Member
sun rise said:
Thanks, donny, by allowing Turkey to attack the Kurds who fought along side us in the battle against the terrorists, the terrorists see an opening in the chaos Turkey created. Many innocent victims which probably will include Americans will be on your head. Even the Republican cowards in the Senate are speaking out again what you did. I'm sure you'll be calling all of them traitors soon and asking your followers to primary them.
Click to expand...

That's the problem.
You can never satisfy everybody.
There's always somebody ready to complain one way or the other.
If Americans (or westerners) intervene to help the attacked,
then the complaint is:
America mind your own business and stay out of our lands.
If they leave the complaint is:
America why are you leaving now?

The problem with Turkey and the Kurds is very old and the problem would not be solved by America staying or going.
 
sooda

sooda

Veteran Member
Raymann said:
That's the problem.
You can never satisfy everybody.
There's always somebody ready to complain one way or the other.
If Americans (or westerners) intervene to help the attacked,
then the complaint is:
America mind your own business and stay out of our lands.
If they leave the complaint is:
America why are you leaving now?

The problem with Turkey and the Kurds is very old and the problem would not be solved by America staying or going.
Click to expand...
Trump lied at the rally yesterday saying there were no us troops on Syria.
 
Wandering Monk

Wandering Monk

Well-Known Member
sun rise said:
The Kurds were our allies in the fight against ISIS and really helped us. Or do you want to give terrorists free reign and a safe haven to attack again?

Turkey under the Islamist strong-man Erdogan is no friend of ours. Trump is tearing up other treaties - he can propose the same for Turkey which is slipping down the path to being an Islamist dictatorship.
Click to expand...

Turkey has the second largest army in NATO.
 
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