Spirit of Light
Be who ever you want
We as a human being can forgive each other yes.
Can I ask if you do not believe Hell is real? Maybe not as a place but as a form of experience?
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Is Hell a place where God punishes you or you punish yourself?
- Thread starter Jos
- Start date
Can I ask if you do not believe Hell is real? Maybe not as a place but as a form of experience?
nPeace
Veteran Member
Oh dear.
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe God forgives. That forgiveness is sealed by the blood of Jesus.
I believe it is real fire under the mantle of the earth.
Spirit of Light
Be who ever you want
Thank you for answering my question
Desert Snake
Veteran Member
There is an 'everlasting hell', a type of hell, then in Revelation you get, hell is cast into the lake of fire, at some point. Nowhere do you get, the lake of fire isn't eternal.
Revelation 20:10
Since reference to everlasting hell precedes the book of Revelation, this makes sense[otherwise everlasting hell, and non eternal HELL contradict each other. Can't have both, really.
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The 'other ideas', are non biblical therefore theoretical. What is biblical is everlasting HELL.
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Your argument concerning other variables, doesn't change that.
Yokefellow
Active Member
How does reincarnation not fit in?
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
According to Baha'u'llah, we punish ourselves by not accepting and believing in His Revelation.
“He who shall accept and believe, shall receive his reward; and he who shall turn away, shall receive none other than his own punishment.” Gleanings, p. 339
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Only if you interpret the Bible literally, but it was not intended to be literal. That was just scare tactics to get people to believe and that was necessary back in those days, but it is no longer necessary because people can choose to believe or not based upon rational thought, not emotions.
rrobs
Well-Known Member
I think you might be confusing reincarnation with resurrection.
rrobs
Well-Known Member
Heb 9:27,
And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
First of all, the Bible does speak of resurrection, while it says nothing about reincarnation. Maybe you define reincarnation differently than the mainstream belief of the religions that believe in it.
According to Heb 9:27 we die then there is a judgment. Actually, that is for non-Christians. Christians have already passed judgment and declared to be righteous (Rom 3:22, Phil 3:9, et; al.). Christians get gathered together with Jesus in the air and we will be with him from that time on(1 Thes 4:17).
Yokefellow
Active Member
rrobs
Well-Known Member
That's what I thought too.
Yokefellow
Active Member
You keep highlighting 'once to die' as if you are trying to convince others into thinking that everyone only lives one life, thus they have only one death.
If that is the case, you are teaching against Scripture as there are many examples of people that have either never died (Enoch, Elijah) or were raised from the dead only to die again at a later time (Lazarus, Valley of Dry Bones, etc.).
Don't forget about the Rapture where many will simply be translated and not face death.
There is even mention of a 'Second Death'...
Revelation 21:8
"But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death"
"Die once" and "Die twice" is an obvious contradiction, no matter how One tries to spin it.
Bottom line...
Christians who try to use Hebrews 9:27 as a case against reincarnation are being very deceitful and disingenuous.
Shame on them.
On the contrary, the Bible is replete with verses promoting reincarnation. In fact, it's one of the main themes. The average Christian is told otherwise for various reasons Satan would know about.
Again...
Hell is a parable for the womb and reincarnation.
The 'Lowest parts of the Earth' is the womb...
Jesus descended there to be born from Mary's womb...
The 'Pit' is another word for the womb...
Jonah and the Whale is a story about reincarnation...
The Lake of Fire is the portal back into the Timeline to be born again of corruptible flesh.
This is what Mystery of Iniquity is. Reincarnation...
Etc. etc.
The eyes of both Christians and non Christians alike have been closed to the above concepts in order to make the concept of Hell appear foolish in the face of a loving God.
I see it's working in this thread. Some things never change.
lostwanderingsoul
Well-Known Member
And so what does rational thought say about hell? Would you rather believe rational thought or what God says?
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
We cannot know about heaven or hell by using rational thought. Logically speaking, since God created the heavens and the earth, only God knows what awaits us in the afterlife, which I refer to as the spiritual world, so unless God has revealed that to us through a Messenger/Prophet, there is no way we can know anything about heaven or hell.
Unfortunately, God never revealed anything definitive about heaven or hell and that is why there is so much conjecture. We know that heaven will be joy and gladness but we cannot know how that will play out, as Baha'u'llah was unable to describe it such that we would understand it. Only God knows.
“Death proffereth unto every confident believer the cup that is life indeed. It bestoweth joy, and is the bearer of gladness. It conferreth the gift of everlasting life.
As to those that have tasted of the fruit of man’s earthly existence, which is the recognition of the one true God, exalted be His glory, their life hereafter is such as We are unable to describe. The knowledge thereof is with God, alone, the Lord of all worlds.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 345-346
“Likewise, the rewards of the other world are the eternal life which is clearly mentioned in all the Holy Books, the divine perfections, the eternal bounties and everlasting felicity…The rewards of the other world are peace, the spiritual graces, the various spiritual gifts in the Kingdom of God, the gaining of the desires of the heart and the soul, and the meeting of God in the world of eternity.” Some Answered Questions, pp. 224-225
The most we can know about hell is that it is a state of the soul that is cut off from God, thus distant (metaphorically, not physically) from God. Those people who are distant from God do not have the gift of everlasting life (eternal life), although their soul continues to exist in the spiritual world after their physical body dies.
“In the same way, the souls who are veiled from God, although they exist in this world and in the world after death, are, in comparison with the holy existence of the children of the Kingdom of God, nonexisting and separated from God.” Some Answered Questions, p. 243
lostwanderingsoul
Well-Known Member
So now it is a choice between "Some
answered Questions" and the Bible. Hmmmm. I think I choose the Bible.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
I did not say that it was a choice and you had to pick one or the other...
What is it about the Bible you prefer, going to a Lake of Fire as opposed to just being veiled from God?
nPeace
Veteran Member
According to scripture, Enoch was no more, for God took him. (Genesis 5:21-24) He was put to sleep.You keep highlighting 'once to die' as if you are trying to convince others into thinking that everyone only lives one life, thus they have only one death.
If that is the case, you are teaching against Scripture as there are many examples of people that have either never died (Enoch, Elijah) or were raised from the dead only to die again at a later time (Lazarus, Valley of Dry Bones, etc.).
Don't forget about the Rapture where many will simply be translated and not face death.
There is even mention of a 'Second Death'...
Revelation 21:8
"But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death"
"Die once" and "Die twice" is an obvious contradiction, no matter how One tries to spin it.
Bottom line...
Christians who try to use Hebrews 9:27 as a case against reincarnation are being very deceitful and disingenuous.
Shame on them.
On the contrary, the Bible is replete with verses promoting reincarnation. In fact, it's one of the main themes. The average Christian is told otherwise for various reasons Satan would know about.
Again...
Hell is a parable for the womb and reincarnation.
The 'Lowest parts of the Earth' is the womb...
Jesus descended there to be born from Mary's womb...
The 'Pit' is another word for the womb...
Jonah and the Whale is a story about reincarnation...
The Lake of Fire is the portal back into the Timeline to be born again of corruptible flesh.
This is what Mystery of Iniquity is. Reincarnation...
Etc. etc.
The eyes of both Christians and non Christians alike have been closed to the above concepts in order to make the concept of Hell appear foolish in the face of a loving God.
I see it's working in this thread. Some things never change.
Throughout the scriptures,men lived, and men died.
Elijah like all men, went through the same process.
lostwanderingsoul
Well-Known Member
Perhaps a little thing called "truth". Believe it or not some people believe that the Bible
contains information that God wants people to know. Those who do not believe the Bible are free to make up their own stories.
Yes, I agree that the fire is eternal, but I just don’t think those who are there live or feel anything.