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Religious Borrowing and then Theft

shmogie

Well-Known Member
So you're saying G-d told people to bring sacrifices that were totally not required because they didn't do anything anyway? He filled pages upon pages with them, who can do them, how to do them, who can eat what, just to tell people that they're actually worthless? Yeah no.
First, there were sacrifices for minor infractions,which did not atone, but reserved judgement. There were thank you sacrifices, sacrifices for child birth or marriage, there were sacrifices for the poor. Not all were about sin.

The only complete remission of sin came on the day of atonement, where every Jew was to remember and think about every sin they committed during the year, every one, and the sacrifice on that day removed all the sins of the people, and the high priest for the only time in a year entered the most holy place, and sprinkled the blood of the sacrifice on the alter for the atonement of all sin.

This was the biggest deal of all the sacrifices and temple services.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
Evidence has to be interpreted, your interpretation is wrong. The views of both integrate easily with todayś world for those who adopt them.

Before you say it, there is no need for any more prophets, their job had been completed, there is no need for a ¨modern¨ prophet, or apparently a modern reincarnation of Christ, which one B"hai told me your prophet was.

Gods revelation of Himself, His ways, His requirements, His love are eternal, they don´t change with the times.

Those have all been divulged by God, thousands of years ago. The map is totally complete, no additions are required.

This of course what you believe based on faith, and not fact. The Jews, of course, do not share your beliefs, and have a good basis for their belief based on the Torah and the Tanakh.
 

Good-Ole-Rebel

Well-Known Member
Of course Jesus was a Jew, but Christianity bears no resemblance to Judaism today.

Of course it doesn't. Christianity is the product of Jews rejection of Jesus Christ. As I said, the relation of the Church, Christianity, and Israel, to Jesus Christ is different. Judaism today bears no resemblance to the Old Testament. Much less, Christianity.

Good-Ole-Rebel
 

dianaiad

Well-Known Member
It seems needlessly deceptive. Mostly it is used as a veneer to lure orthodox Jews into Christianity and I have an issue with that. It's hijacking another religion, imo, and using it as a cover to decieve people. If you're a Jew who believes in Jesus you've already abandoned your ancestral faith anyway, there's no point pretending you or your views are anything like religiously Jewish.

And it is your job to protect the Jewish culture and religion, that you can be offended upon their behalf?

Rival, with all due respect, they've been around a very long time. They've managed to stay a culture and a religion for a very long time without that.
 

Rival

Si m'ait Dieus
Staff member
Premium Member
And it is your job to protect the Jewish culture and religion, that you can be offended upon their behalf?

Rival, with all due respect, they've been around a very long time. They've managed to stay a culture and a religion for a very long time without that.
It is my job to tell them to cut it out and stop parading themselves around as something they're not and spreading falsities about the religion they claim to be a part of.
 

1213

Well-Known Member
...

It's mostly Christians trying to be Jews, what's up with that?

In Biblical point of view, Christians (=disciples of Jesus) are Jews, because:

For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, neither is that circumcision which is outward in the flesh; but he is a Jew who is one inwardly, and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit not in the letter; whose praise is not from men, but from God.
Romans 2:28-29

But if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive, were grafted in among them, and became partaker with them of the root and of the richness of the olive tree; don't boast over the branches. But if you boast, it is not you who support the root, but the root supports you. You will say then, "Branches were broken off, that I might be grafted in." True; by their unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by your faith. Don't be conceited, but fear;
Romans. 11:17-20
 

Rival

Si m'ait Dieus
Staff member
Premium Member
In Biblical point of view, Christians (=disciples of Jesus) are Jews, because:

For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, neither is that circumcision which is outward in the flesh; but he is a Jew who is one inwardly, and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit not in the letter; whose praise is not from men, but from God.
Romans 2:28-29

But if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive, were grafted in among them, and became partaker with them of the root and of the richness of the olive tree; don't boast over the branches. But if you boast, it is not you who support the root, but the root supports you. You will say then, "Branches were broken off, that I might be grafted in." True; by their unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by your faith. Don't be conceited, but fear;
Romans. 11:17-20
In common speech, they are no more Jews than the Pope is.
 

Prestor John

Well-Known Member
It's one thing for a religion to borrow concepts from other faiths, that happens all the time; but what about those faiths that take directly from others and what looks like to many, just a dress up game? I do believe most such people are sincere, but what do religions get out of this? Messianic Jews who are just Christians wearing tallitot wrong and calling Vicars 'Rabbi'. What's the problem with just being whatever your religion is? If there's this need for something else, what does that say about your faith? Again, I have no issue with people taking things that make sense or for rational reasons; I wear long Islamic style dresses for modesty's sake since I find them the most comfortable and I don't think Muslims are taking an issue with it, but I have no desire to make myself Muslim and start using prayer rugs and whatnot.

It's mostly Christians trying to be Jews, what's up with that?
It's just some people trying to hedge their bets.
 

Dawnofhope

Non-Proselytizing Baha'i
Staff member
Premium Member
It's one thing for a religion to borrow concepts from other faiths, that happens all the time; but what about those faiths that take directly from others and what looks like to many, just a dress up game? I do believe most such people are sincere, but what do religions get out of this? Messianic Jews who are just Christians wearing tallitot wrong and calling Vicars 'Rabbi'. What's the problem with just being whatever your religion is? If there's this need for something else, what does that say about your faith? Again, I have no issue with people taking things that make sense or for rational reasons; I wear long Islamic style dresses for modesty's sake since I find them the most comfortable and I don't think Muslims are taking an issue with it, but I have no desire to make myself Muslim and start using prayer rugs and whatnot.

It's mostly Christians trying to be Jews, what's up with that?
It is natural for faith communities to adapt and align themselves as closely as possible with the culture of the communities they reside without compromising their core beliefs. I haven’t come across Messianic Christians in person. Have you?
 

Rival

Si m'ait Dieus
Staff member
Premium Member
It is natural for faith communities to adapt and align themselves as closely as possible with the culture of the communities they reside without compromising their core beliefs. I haven’t come across Messianic Christians in person. Have you?
Yes. I once tried to be one.
 

Rival

Si m'ait Dieus
Staff member
Premium Member
What was the attraction to this group of Christians as opposed to any other Christians?
My attraction to Judaism and ultimately my dislike for Christianity, hence why I left Christianity in the end.
 

Enoch07

It's all a sick freaking joke.
Premium Member
It's mostly Christians trying to be Jews, what's up with that?

Not really sure what you mean by that.

Don't get me wrong I love most of the stories from the OT. The characters and stories are fascinating and very reflective of human nature as a whole (even for non-Jews). And I do celebrate passover instead of easter. But other than that I don't follow many other customs/traditions/dietary restrictions/habits etc.

And I don't see anything wrong with Messianic Judaism, granted I don't know a whole lot about it. But it seems to me if some Jews want to accept Christ there is nothing wrong with that, so long as they are not harming other people.
 

Terry Sampson

Well-Known Member
Screenshot_2019-09-27 Religious Borrowing and then Theft(3).png



*cringe*
 

InChrist

Free4ever
Yes, this has a context; sacrifices are useless without real intent behind them. G-d does not want meaningless sacrifices without real repentence. If he didn't desire sacrifices, why would he spend page after page describing how to offer them? Why would the messianic age include the third temple?
I believe the messianic age will include the third temple.
As a Christian, I used to wonder why there was so much description of a future temple in the scriptures when Jesus was said to be the ultimate sacrifice and the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world. So what reason would there be for another temple? Now my understanding is that the OT sacrifices pointed forward toward Jesus Christ and His sacrifice on the cross and that the future temple sacrifices during His millennial reign on the earth from Jerusalem, will point back as reminders of His great sacrifice of love and salvation.
 

iam1me

Active Member
It's one thing for a religion to borrow concepts from other faiths, that happens all the time; but what about those faiths that take directly from others and what looks like to many, just a dress up game? I do believe most such people are sincere, but what do religions get out of this? Messianic Jews who are just Christians wearing tallitot wrong and calling Vicars 'Rabbi'. What's the problem with just being whatever your religion is? If there's this need for something else, what does that say about your faith? Again, I have no issue with people taking things that make sense or for rational reasons; I wear long Islamic style dresses for modesty's sake since I find them the most comfortable and I don't think Muslims are taking an issue with it, but I have no desire to make myself Muslim and start using prayer rugs and whatnot.

It's mostly Christians trying to be Jews, what's up with that?

Judaism is the foundation of Christianity, and a sect thereof. From the Christian perspective, there's no stealing going on by learning and adopting more traditional Jewish customs and terms - albeit the merit of doing so is debatable.

It seems like what is bugging you is that Christians don't view Judaism as being a fundamentally distinct religion.
 
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