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The curse of the forbidden fruit.

Milton Platt

Milton Platt

Well-Known Member
Good-Ole-Rebel said:
Morality and immorality are mans terms. God is righteous in all He does. As I have said before, if He saves 3,000, He is righteous in doing so. If He slays 3,000, He is righteous in doing so.

Good-Ole-Rebel
Click to expand...
All terms are man’s terms. “Righteous” is an English word developed by man, as have all languages. You are playing word games. So a god can be righteous while doing immoral things? Does your god believe slavery and rape are immoral or moral?

Are you saying that morality is unnecessary?
 
sooda

sooda

Veteran Member
Howard Is said:
It makes sense to me.

Amanita muscaria mushrooms look like an apple as they first appear, before opening into a cap.

The Essenes used amanita as a sacrament.

It is the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

Without the scrolls of the Essenes, the Roman psyops version is just bewildering nonsense.

Without the experience to which the symbols refer, even the scrolls are useless.
Click to expand...

Just about every culture had a tree of knowledge of good and evil.. and a tree of life.
 
Good-Ole-Rebel

Good-Ole-Rebel

Well-Known Member
Milton Platt said:
All terms are man’s terms. “Righteous” is an English word developed by man, as have all languages. You are playing word games. So a god can be righteous while doing immoral things? Does your god believe slavery and rape are immoral or moral?

Are you saying that morality is unnecessary?
Click to expand...

No, no games. In the Bible God is righteous in all He does.

Your 'morality' is not in the Bible. Man's morality changes depending on the time, the place, etc.

Slavery is the natural condition of man. Thus you will find institutions of slavery among men. It is supported in the Bible.

Rape gets the death penalty. (Deut. 22:25)

Good-Ole-Rebel
 
Milton Platt

Milton Platt

Well-Known Member
Good-Ole-Rebel said:
No, no games. In the Bible God is righteous in all He does.

Your 'morality' is not in the Bible. Man's morality changes depending on the time, the place, etc.

Slavery is the natural condition of man. Thus you will find institutions of slavery among men. It is supported in the Bible.

Rape gets the death penalty. (Deut. 22:25)

Good-Ole-Rebel
Click to expand...

So does your god's morality change. And slavery is not a "natural" condition. What an absurd thing to state. If slavery is natural because it is found among men, then so is rape, murder, incest, pedophilia, and a host of other things others would find immoral. Because they are all "found among men" just as slavery. A god who supports any of those things is by definition an immoral god.
 
amorphous_constellation

amorphous_constellation

Well-Known Member
SomeRandom said:
But seriously. An all powerful being creates man (presumably knowing full well the flaws and strengths, since he literally created them) and places a fruit in front of man like a shiny object. And then knowing full well that humans respond badly to temptation, tells Adam not to eat it. I mean that’s trolling 101 right there.
Click to expand...

The two fruits must have existed for man, because it probably can be assumed that god didn't actually need them for anything. So then one thinks, perhaps god was getting ready to give both fruits to the man. But the man could never get more or less prepared to actually receive them since his consciousness was in a static state without having knowledge in it. So in that regard, I fail to understand a real moral to the story that anyone can get a grip on. God will tempt you will something that you could never actually deserve I guess is what the takeaway is. And once you get that thing, it is your fault for doing it, though you never even could totally understand what you were getting. It's a story that puts a taboo on mystery.
 
Good-Ole-Rebel

Good-Ole-Rebel

Well-Known Member
Milton Platt said:
So does your god's morality change. And slavery is not a "natural" condition. What an absurd thing to state. If slavery is natural because it is found among men, then so is rape, murder, incest, pedophilia, and a host of other things others would find immoral. Because they are all "found among men" just as slavery. A god who supports any of those things is by definition an immoral god.
Click to expand...

Moral and immoral are not terms to describe God. As I have said, God is righteous.

Actually it is not absurd. Slavery goes all the way back to mans original creation by God. When God created Adam, Adam was answerable to God. Adam was not independent and free. He was given work to do in the Garden. When he disobeyed it brought severe judgement from God.

Not only did it bring judgement from God, it brought into play another slave master, satan. Thus now in the world you are a slave either to God or satan.

This is why I say, slavery is the natural condition of man. He is never free and independent. He likes to think he is, but he isn't. Your going to serve One or the other.

Good-Ole-Rebel
 
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SomeRandom

SomeRandom

Still learning to be wise
Staff member
Premium Member
ideogenous_mover said:
The two fruits must have existed for man, because it probably can be assumed that god didn't actually need them for anything. So then one thinks, perhaps god was getting ready to give both fruits to the man. But the man could never get more or less prepared to actually receive them since his consciousness was in a static state without having knowledge in it. So in that regard, I fail to understand a real moral to the story that anyone can get a grip on. God will tempt you will something that you could never actually deserve I guess is what the takeaway is. And once you get that thing, it is your fault for doing it, though you never even could totally understand what you were getting. It's a story that puts a taboo on mystery.
Click to expand...
I think the moral is supposed to be humans can’t follow simple instructions because they’re dolts.
 
Milton Platt

Milton Platt

Well-Known Member
Good-Ole-Rebel said:
Moral and immoral are not terms to describe God. As I have said, God is righteous.

Actually it is not absurd. Slavery goes all the way back to mans original creation by God. When God created Adam, Adam was answerable to God. Adam was not independent and free. He was given work to do in the Garden. When he disobeyed it brought severe judgement from God.

Not only did it bring judgement from God, it brought into play another slave master, satan. Thus now in the world you are a slave either to God or satan.

This is why I say, slavery is the natural condition of man. He is never free and independent. He likes to think he is, but he isn't. Your going to serve One or the other.

Good-Ole-Rebel
Click to expand...

So your god can be righteous while being immoral, then?
You did not answer my question. why is slavery a "natural" state of man?
 
Good-Ole-Rebel

Good-Ole-Rebel

Well-Known Member
Milton Platt said:
So your god can be righteous while being immoral, then?
You did not answer my question. why is slavery a "natural" state of man?
Click to expand...

All that God does is righteous and good. No matter what term you want to use.

I did answer your question. What part did you not understand? Man when created was a slave to God. After the fall, another slave master was introduced, satan. All of man is slave to one or the other.

Even we who are Christians are slaves to God. We are bought and paid for. (1 Cor. 6:20)

Good-Ole-Rebel
 
Milton Platt

Milton Platt

Well-Known Member
Good-Ole-Rebel said:
All that God does is righteous and good. No matter what term you want to use.

I did answer your question. What part did you not understand? Man when created was a slave to God. After the fall, another slave master was introduced, satan. All of man is slave to one or the other.

Even we who are Christians are slaves to God. We are bought and paid for. (1 Cor. 6:20)

Good-Ole-Rebel
Click to expand...

Sorry, but I do not accept your redefining of slavery. I am not speaking of metaphorical slavery. You well know the slavery I am speaking of. Is it moral or immoral to own another human as personal property and can beat them and pass them down as property to your heirs? That is the form of slavery I am speaking of, and you know it.
If that form of slavery is immoral, then your god is immoral, because your god supported that kind of slavery.
There is no way around that.
 
Good-Ole-Rebel

Good-Ole-Rebel

Well-Known Member
Milton Platt said:
Sorry, but I do not accept your redefining of slavery. I am not speaking of metaphorical slavery. You well know the slavery I am speaking of. Is it moral or immoral to own another human as personal property and can beat them and pass them down as property to your heirs? That is the form of slavery I am speaking of, and you know it.
If that form of slavery is immoral, then your god is immoral, because your god supported that kind of slavery.
There is no way around that.
Click to expand...

Neither am I speaking metaphorically. Because slavery is the natural condition of mankind, then God provides the institutions for slavery in the Bible.

Therefore, I am not saying slavery is immoral. Man may say so, but God doesn't. And God is righteous in what He does.

Good-Ole-Rebel
 
Milton Platt

Milton Platt

Well-Known Member
Good-Ole-Rebel said:
Neither am I speaking metaphorically. Because slavery is the natural condition of mankind, then God provides the institutions for slavery in the Bible.

Therefore, I am not saying slavery is immoral. Man may say so, but God doesn't. And God is righteous in what He does.

Good-Ole-Rebel
Click to expand...

I do not understand why you think it is natural for a man to be enslaved by another human........please explain
 
MonkeyFire

MonkeyFire

Well-Known Member
God forbids knowledge of good and evil which is fighting, war, and hatred and thus I raise that the Christian bible is passive in a cryptic sense.
 
Thief

Thief

Rogue Theologian
Jonathan Bailey said:
Genesis 2:17 King James Version (KJV)
17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

Are we living people going to die in the flesh someday because of the original sins of Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden? Is that forbidden fruit the death curse of us all?

Note that bible says for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

God supposedly guaranteed that mankind would die upon eating the forbidden fruit but does that infer that God guaranteed immortality to mankind for otherwise keeping that original commandment?

God never said that we'd live forever for leaving the forbidden fruit alone.

Mankind had a choice between possibly living forever and absolutely dying. They chose sure death to the joy of undertakers, funeral homes, coffin builders, tombstone makers, crematories and graveyard owners.

It's like I won't get a one-million dollar reward for not stealing but I will get jailed and/or fined if I'm caught and convicted of it.

Click to expand...
it was a test....
to be sure that alteration of body and mind.....in the garden
had taken hold

Man NEEDS to be that creature curious
to KNOW....even if death is pending and the consequence could be dealt
on the same day

we are that creature
some risk all....even if it means dying
 
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