• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

This is why i do not hate Islam or Muslims

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
Except the places where the majority of Islamist violence is taking place are regions without civil authorities. What would a pacifist do in that place? Let his neighbor die I guess.
We would help those who get hurt by the war. To give care for those in need. without being afraid for our own life. But personally i choose to not use voilance toward other.
If you do not like my way of living that is no problem to me I respect that you chooses to live differently.
 

night912

Well-Known Member
God / Allah Did not ask them to do terror. It is their distorted views that make them go to terror.
Just because someone say kill, does not make it good or right to do.
Killing is immoral
Exactly. That's why I have problems with those two points. People have used that excuse throughout history. And majority of them believe they weren't doing moral acts. Keep in mind that humans created the words, "Islam" and "Muslim." It's based on religion and belief. Those two points are based on individual personal belief. Just because you believe that killing is wrong, someone else may believe that killing is right. Same as someone believe that it's their duty to kill because it's what their god wants.
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
Exactly. That's why I have problems with those two points. People have used that excuse throughout history. And majority of them believe they weren't doing moral acts. Keep in mind that humans created the words, "Islam" and "Muslim." It's based on religion and belief. Those two points are based on individual personal belief. Just because you believe that killing is wrong, someone else may believe that killing is right. Same as someone believe that it's their duty to kill because it's what their god wants.
That someone misunderstand the religious texts does not make me want to hate them, it make me want to hep them see the light/Truth
 

Regiomontanus

Ματαιοδοξία ματαιοδοξιών! Όλα είναι ματαιοδοξία.
Diversity.

First off. Islam is not a religion at all, but a full-time political -religious system (theocracy). ,,,.

I don't buy that at all. What about Christianity & the Eastern Roman Empire (Byzantine Empire)? Was Christianity a religion then? Of course. But it was much more than that too, it was the whole world-view of the empire, including all of politics.
 

Cooky

Veteran Member
I don't buy that at all. What about Christianity & the Eastern Roman Empire (Byzantine Empire)? Was Christianity a religion then? Of course. But it was much more than that too, it was the whole world-view of the empire, including all of politics.

So you want to return to that? You want a Christian theocratic empire?
 

Cooky

Veteran Member
That someone misunderstand the religious texts does not make me want to hate them, it make me want to hep them see the light/Truth

How do we help them see the light/Truth..? Wouldn't it be to challenge their beliefs? To address the issue, like I do? Tell them they are wrong?

Some call it "tough love". It's what humans do.
 

icehorse

......unaffiliated...... anti-dogmatist
Premium Member
God / Allah Did not ask them to do terror. It is their distorted views that make them go to terror.
Just because someone say kill, does not make it good or right to do.
Killing is immoral

Not according to some verses in the Quran.

One big problem with Islam (and many religions), is that it makes extraordinary claims. It claims that its book and its prophet are flawless. Such claims breed intolerance and violence, and have done so for centuries even millennia.
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
How do we make them see the light/Truth..?
I would think there are more then one way (peacefully) to do this but example could be discussing with not just muslims (or extremists) but gathering every religions to discuss how to live i the same world without hating each others or fighting each others. And use the different religious texts to look at similarities (there are many)
But i do not have the blueprint for the answer to it
 

Cooky

Veteran Member
I would think there are more then one way (peacefully) to do this but example could be discussing with not just muslims (or extremists) but gathering every religions to discuss how to live i the same world without hating each others or fighting each others. And use the different religious texts to look at similarities (there are many)
But i do not have the blueprint for the answer to it

Can we point out what we don't like?
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
Not according to some verses in the Quran.

One big problem with Islam (and many religions), is that it makes extraordinary claims. It claims that its book and its prophet are flawless. Such claims breed intolerance and violence, and have done so for centuries even millennia.
I might be wrong, but i see a cultural and worldly error in humans Because we look at "I" and not "We" so we speak only by ego
 

night912

Well-Known Member
That someone misunderstand the religious texts does not make me want to hate them, it make me want to hep them see the light/Truth
Who said anything about hating them? I'm talking about those two points. Dismissing those points isn't in any way hating the people. And praising those two points won't help the people understand their religion any better. It actually has the opposite effect.
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
Can we point out what we don't like?
Yes but in a civilized way No bad words toward each other asking questions like Why do you do so or so when the scripture say so or so. An other way to do it is to take a verse from the Qu`ran and ask the extremists how they understand the meaning behind the words written. Again offer it in a peaceful way
 

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
The following article will describe how true Islam does work and how you can find Muslims who are true muslims and not wannabe terrorists.
I add this article because there has been so much negative toward muslims in this forum and since i personally have nothing against Islam i found it good to share this. It talk about what Islam actually was and still is used for.

30 Facts About Islam

I tend to question and criticize religion in general - not just Islam, but any religion or form of superstition.

I think when it comes to things like terrorism, political instability, and extremism - a lot of it may be rooted more in economic disparities and conflicting factions of nationalists. I wouldn't deny that religion is also a factor, but not the only motivation for the violence we're seeing.

Religion is just so much bunkum for the masses - set up so they can become organized and obedient. However, I don't see religion, in and of itself, as being the reason for fighting. Just the same, it can be a useful pretext.

I don't hate any religion or its adherents, but on the other hand, I'm not going to automatically believe that they practice what they preach either. I recognize that some do, but many do not, so I leave it at that. Humans are an imperfect species.
 

dybmh

דניאל יוסף בן מאיר הירש
I don't hate Islam either - no more than any other religion - but I do worry that the spectrum of beliefs and behaviour within Islam (which one might put down to culture, but mostly will be religious) has such extremes, and seemingly hasn't purged past influences so as to enable the following, and the same seems to apply to FGM (mostly found in Islamic cultures):

Girl, 10, forced to marry 22-year-old man in Iran | Metro News

When some complain about the practitioners of Islam still living in mediaeval times, this (the extremes) I would think is what they might be thinking about - apart from the stoning, hand-chopping off, etc. - even if they are illegal or frowned upon. And the burqa/niqab (being black mostly it seems) just seems to be iconic of nihilism - so perhaps not the best choice of colour, and especially where the males wear white. How would one deny equality of the sexes so obviously than by dress? Wow - we didn't think of that!

And equality of the sexes doesn't appear to be an Islamic ideal - males and females having their appropriate place perhaps, but equal, not so much. Which is why Islam apparently will always be at odds with modern Western societies - unless it changes.

I think it's important to highlight 2 items from the linked article:

The authorities have now moved to annul the marriage and press charges against the adults involved.
and
The video was posted on social media in Iran and quickly garnered outrage within the country.

I bring this up, because, the article depicts the reaction of Iranian people as "outraged" by the forced marriage. If the article is accurate, it sounds like forced marriages are not viewed positively among Iranians ( many of whom are Muslims ).

I agree that it is wrong for a marriage like this to occur. However, I think that it's good that the marriage was annulled and that there was local outrage "within the country".
 

EtuMalku

Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
The following article will describe how true Islam does work and how you can find Muslims who are true muslims and not wannabe terrorists.
I add this article because there has been so much negative toward muslims in this forum and since i personally have nothing against Islam i found it good to share this. It talk about what Islam actually was and still is used for.

30 Facts About Islam
I dunno . . . I never got past these two suras:

(Qur'an 5:33)
"The recompense of those who fight Allah and His messenger, and seek to make corruption in the land, is that they be killed or crucified or that their hands and feet be cut off from alternate sides or that they be banished from the land; that is their disgrace in this world and in the Hereafter they will have a great torment."

(Qur'an 20:71)
I will cut off your hands and feet from alternate sides, and I will crucify you on the trunks of the palm trees, and you will come to know which of us is greater in retribution and more lasting!' "
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
I dunno . . . I never got past these two suras:

(Qur'an 5:33)
"The recompense of those who fight Allah and His messenger, and seek to make corruption in the land, is that they be killed or crucified or that their hands and feet be cut off from alternate sides or that they be banished from the land; that is their disgrace in this world and in the Hereafter they will have a great torment."

(Qur'an 20:71)
I will cut off your hands and feet from alternate sides, and I will crucify you on the trunks of the palm trees, and you will come to know which of us is greater in retribution and more lasting!' "

What others see in this two verses will be different from my view i know
Personally i do not see this two verses as literary, they are metaphor for those who do not follow the teaching will not be able to gain the ultimate in Islam they will not find wisdom. Only those who follow and are true to the teaching will see the wisdom.
By the way that count for any religious/spiritual path.

The verses does not speak of actually killing or cutting of people it means spiritually one must follow the teaching to see the truth.
But many people also some muslims do not see this because they do not understand or follow the teaching correctly.
 

icehorse

......unaffiliated...... anti-dogmatist
Premium Member
I might be wrong, but i see a cultural and worldly error in humans Because we look at "I" and not "We" so we speak only by ego

I agree that "ego" is yet another problem. But I was trying to respond to the OP. I have never claimed that Islam was our only problem, I don't think it is. But I think it's one of our pressing problems.
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
I agree that "ego" is yet another problem. But I was trying to respond to the OP. I have never claimed that Islam was our only problem, I don't think it is. But I think it's one of our pressing problems.
The part where we see terrorists using Islam as their shield yes that is a big problem, that i agree on
 

icehorse

......unaffiliated...... anti-dogmatist
Premium Member
The part where we see terrorists using Islam as their shield yes that is a big problem, that i agree on

I think terrorism - while certainly a problem - is a relatively minor problem. The bigger problems to me are the Islamic values of misogyny, homophobia, supremacism, and totalitarianism.
 

Mock Turtle

Oh my, did I say that!
Premium Member
I think it's important to highlight 2 items from the linked article:

The authorities have now moved to annul the marriage and press charges against the adults involved.

and

The video was posted on social media in Iran and quickly garnered outrage within the country.

I bring this up, because, the article depicts the reaction of Iranian people as "outraged" by the forced marriage. If the article is accurate, it sounds like forced marriages are not viewed positively among Iranians ( many of whom are Muslims ).

I agree that it is wrong for a marriage like this to occur. However, I think that it's good that the marriage was annulled and that there was local outrage "within the country".

Probably true that most people in Iran would be outraged by this example (as most would be), but the article did mention what the (Sharia) law allows:

The legal age of marriage in Iran is 13 for a girl and 15 for a boy, according to the country’s interpretation of Sharia Law. However, marriages can still be carried out at a younger age with the consent of the father or paternal grandfather and with permission from a court judge. Since March of last year, there have been 43,000 weddings in Iran where the bride was aged 10-15, according to the Iranian Parliament.

Such that we still have a situation where children are essentially seen as the properties of the parents - and which is still the problem in many other countries too. I know this is not so common in many other Islamic countries but I think it is mainly the religion that enables this - the Sharia Law, that is.
 
Top