Question for Americans voting in upcoming election.

PureX said:

They aren't going to pay their share of taxes so long as they can bribe the government to let them not pay for less than the taxes would cost them.

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Which is why I voted for character and competence.

Anybody can promise anything during the campaign. Trump made many promises, but his degree of character and competence was pretty low. He didn't keep many of them.
Tom

Mindmaster said:

If the top 10% gain, we gain on taxing them collectively -as far as public resources.

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That's less and less true the lower we allow their taxes to go. Right now the rich's taxes are at basement low levels.

But, don't feel sorry for the <90% or think they're being ripped off -- they've decided that safety is better than risk, and that's why they are where they are. Life is easier if you wake up every day to a conventional job and you know as long as you show up you're getting X money. Entrepreneurs wake up and have no idea what they'll make. That's the trade -- you get a safe comfortable life for a smaller share of the rewards... and honestly... it makes a great deal of sense that it works that way...

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This presumes every rich person earned their money from the ground up by being innovative and hard-working. That's just a myth. Most rich people were born into rich families and inherited their wealth, along with connections and opportunities as a function of their family that enabled them to increase their wealth further. Rags to riches stories make heart-warming movies that tug at our emotions, but they are not reality for most people. They are the lucky ones.

Mind you, nothing is stopping you from taking that other path other than yourself.

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This completely ignores the myriad of societal barriers that prevent the poor from being more successful.

So, again, won't feel pity or whatever people try to stoke to evade that simple amount of truth. Want proof? Look up every rich guy you see now -- there was some point, probably in their early twenties, where they completely wiped out their finances.

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What is your evidence for this, besides anecdote?

No one really talks about it, but it's happened so many times... For some people, like Trump it happened later... But, it still happened... How often do you or anyone you know ever put that amount of risk on the table?

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Trump's "risks" have been completely insulated as a function of the massive wealth he inherited and the fact that his daddy underwrote all his early business endeavors.

columbus said:

Which is why I voted for character and competence.

Anybody can promise anything during the campaign. Trump made many promises, but his degree of character and competence was pretty low. He didn't keep many of them.
Tom

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None of them keep their promises if they promised anything to anyone but the wealthy elite that 'own' them. They are paid servants of the wealthy. Their promises are meaningless until they have the autonomy to act on them. And right now, they do not. They have to keep taking the bribe money, and doing what they're told, to pay for their next campaign. The system ensures that they cannot exhibit any "character". If they do, and they act contrary to the will of the wealthy elite that are paying for their campaigns, they will soon be out of office.

Men and women of character are not sponsored into the system. And if they do get in, somehow, they will soon be cast out by the campaign money-machine. Our votes can be bought. And elections can be bought, regardless of our votes. Money determines who wins the office, and money determines who keeps it, and who doesn't. Character is irrelevant. In fact, character is just a hindrance to the system. A functional distraction. Charisma is a far better asset for the U.S. politician, than character is.

columbus said:

Why would you think this?
Do you think Trump is the only billionaire who has a phalanx of lawyers who keep him from paying income tax? Do you think he's the only "smart" one?
Tom

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Why do you think rich people don't pay income taxes? This is a trope and completely not true.

First, it's possible to use corporate balance sheets (offsets of losses versus profit) to do mathematical gymnastics to effectively have zero profit on paper. It's not possible to do the same for your personal income taxes. Your company may pay no taxes if the accounts are clever, but taxes will still paid via the wealth you are generating via employee income taxes and the owners own tax forms when they pay themselves. Thus, plenty of taxes are being paid and there really isn't much of a way to avoid them. Anyone is Trump's income bracket is certainly paying way more than an average person because they are far exceeding the amounts you can gift, trust, or otherwise gain credits/discounts from. There are also rules with corporations that trigger that mandate minimum amounts of pay for certain positions in the company... Whether that pay was in cash or stocks it still would be taxable.

Mindmaster said:

Why do you think rich people don't pay income taxes? This is a trope

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I'd go to the trouble of finding the claim from Trump that he doesn't, because it's the"smart" thing to do.
But I doubt that it would be worth my trouble.
Tom