Eternal damnation how bad can it be

leov · Jul 27, 2019

I

URAVIP2ME said:
I am thinking you are referring to Not an actual happening such as found at John 11:11-14 but to Luke 16:14-31.
The 16th chapter of Luke is about parables or illustrations. It is a story and Not a real happening.
The un-named rich man (Luke 16:1) and the un-named rich man of Luke 16:19 are the covetous Pharisees mentioned at Luke 16:14.
The story or parable that Jesus was giving was directed toward those greedy money-loving Pharisees.
The Law (Constitution of the Mosaic Law) and the OT prophets were until (lasted until) John the Baptist - Luke 16:16-17.
That 'Law/prophet arrangement' was like a marriage contract (verse 16)
This is why verse 18 mentions the putting away of the wife as being adultery.
Those Pharisees did Not want to accept that Christ's 'death' would end that old covenant or contract arrangement.
If the Pharisees wanted to become Christ's figurative bride (or bride class) they must be released from the old Law.

Also, remember the Lazarus of John 11:11-14 lived with his sisters Mary and Martha.
The Lazarus of Luke 16:20 was a beggar begging for spiritual crumbs - Luke 16:20-21
Since Lazarus was a common name back then, then using the name Lazarus represented the common people.
Plus, father Abraham (like King David -Acts 2:34; John 3:13) is still asleep in the grave - Luke 16:22

I
do not think that it was a real event, but it reflects people’s views about afterlife , basically Hades.

Bob the Unbeliever · Jul 27, 2019

URAVIP2ME said:
Even those called to heaven are Not angels but referred to as being saints or holy ones - Daniel 7:18
No human turns into an angel.
Adam and Eve were meant to be husband and wife forever.
So, only those called to heaven (Rev. 20:6; 2:10; 5:9-10) give up their physical bodies.
The majority of resurrected mankind will have a happy-and-healthy 'physical' resurrection on Earth.
This resurrection will take place during Jesus' millennium-long day of governing over Earth for a thousand years.

So you think the other christian was wrong?

What'ya know? Two christians, each thinking the other christian is DEAD WRONG?

It's as if....there isn't any Higher Authority to give either one accurate information....

Hmmmmm.... mass chaos....

Bob the Unbeliever · Jul 27, 2019

URAVIP2ME said:
I find if the Bible's hell was endless pain then Jesus would be in endless pain - Acts of the Apostles 2:27.
If the Bible's hell was permanent Jesus would still be in biblical hell.
Jesus never taught any post-mortem pain or double jeopardy for sins.
Rather, Jesus taught ' sleep ' in death - John 11:11-14.
Jesus learned that 'sleeping state about the dead' from the old Hebrew Scriptures, such as:
- Psalms 6:5; Psalms 13:3; Psalms 115:17; Isaiah 38:18; Ecclesiastes 9:5
So, the Bible's hell is simply mankind's temporary stone-cold grave for the sleeping dead.

I'll TAKE it! It's 1000000000 times better than the hideous ego-stroking needed in the bible's "heaven"...

Trailblazer · Jul 27, 2019

JJ50 said:
Heaven with the evil god character of the Bible would be eternal damnation of the worst kind.

You won't have to worry about that because only people who love God go to heaven to be with God...
Everyone else goes to another destination.

Trailblazer · Jul 27, 2019

Bob the Unbeliever said:
Indeed--- if you read the bible carefully? ABSOLUTELY NO free will in "heaven" anyway, so you'll just be a robotic automata mindless "praising" bible-god's massive EGO.

Sounds hellish.

Sheesh Bob...
It won't be like that at all.
God does not need any praise, and besides, there will be lots to do in heaven, work to do, just like we have here.
For your own edification, I suggest you read this book. It could save you a lot of grief.

Heaven and Hell

There is work in hell too but the scenery and accommodations are not as nice.

Bob the Unbeliever · Jul 28, 2019

Trailblazer said:
Sheesh Bob...
It won't be like that at all.
God does not need any praise, and besides, there will be lots to do in heaven, work to do, just like we have here.
For your own edification, I suggest you read this book. It could save you a lot of grief.

Heaven and Hell

There is work in hell too but the scenery and accommodations are not as nice.

So sure you are. So utterly devoid of a single reason to think your comment, above, has any basis in reality.

You do not even have an ancient Bronze Age Book Of Superstition to go by!

It's as if.... you were just making it up as you go along?

Trailblazer · Jul 28, 2019

Bob the Unbeliever said:
So sure you are. So utterly devoid of a single reason to think your comment, above, has any basis in reality.

You do not even have an ancient Bronze Age Book Of Superstition to go by!

It's as if.... you were just making it up as you go along?

I do not need a Bronze Age book because I have a new age books, the Writings of Baha'u'llah.
Those generally concur with what I posted from the book Heaven and Hell.

You do not have to take me seriously but you will find out what the reality is soon enough.

URAVIP2ME · Jul 31, 2019

Bob the Unbeliever said:
So you think the other christian was wrong?
What'ya know? Two christians, each thinking the other christian is DEAD WRONG?
It's as if....there isn't any Higher Authority to give either one accurate information...
Hmmmmm.... mass chaos....

Hmmmmm.... mass clarification......... as reported at Matthew 7:21-23.
Remember: Jesus informs us that MANY would come ' in his name ' but prove false.

Don't forget the teaching about the fake ' weed/tares ' Christians and the genuine ' wheat ' Christians how they would grow together over the centuries until the Harvest Time, or the soon coming ' time of separation ' on Earth as found at Matthew 25:31-33,37,40

URAVIP2ME · Jul 31, 2019

Trailblazer said:
There is work in hell too but the scenery and accommodations are not as nice.

I'm happy to report that I find there is NO work in hell, biblical hell that is.
This is because the dead know nothing as per Ecclesiastes 9:5,10.
Or, as Jesus teaches us the dead are peacefully sleeping - John 11:11-14.
What Jesus taught is in harmony with the old Hebrew Scriptures:
- Psalms 6:5; Psalms 13:3; Psalms 115:17; Isaiah 38:18
So, the Bible's scenery and accommodations in biblical hell is pitch blackness in the stone-cold grave (biblical hell ).
Also, if biblical hell was a permanent place then Jesus would still be in hell - Acts of the Apostles 2:27.
Problem is: false clergy often teach a religious-myth hell of burning forever as being Scripture.

URAVIP2ME · Jul 31, 2019

Trailblazer said:
You won't have to worry about that because only people who love God go to heaven to be with God...
Everyone else goes to another destination.

Except for the wicked who are ' destroyed forever ' as per Psalms 92:7, everyone else Not called to heaven (John 3:13) goes to another destination:
That destination is ' resurrection ' . That resurrection is future according to Acts of the Apostles 24:15.
Future because the physical resurrection takes place during Jesus coming 1,000-year reign over Earth.
A happy-and-healthy physical resurrection of heart, mind and a perfect body being brought back to live life on Earth.
This is why 1 Corinthians 15:24-26 informs us that even ' enemy death ' will be No more on Earth.- Isaiah 25:8.
There will be ' healing ' for earth's nations as mentioned at Revelation 22:2.
This is why we are all invited to pray the invitation of Revelation 22:20 for Jesus to come !
We do Not pray to be 'taken away' to Jesus, nor pray to be 'taken up' to Jesus, but fore Jesus to come !
Come as Prince of Peace to usher in global Peace on Earth among persons of goodwill.

URAVIP2ME · Jul 31, 2019

Bob the Unbeliever said:
I'll TAKE it! It's 1000000000 times better than the hideous ego-stroking needed in the bible's "heaven"...

I find No ego-stroking in Heaven, but jobs to be done, work to be done.
I see two (2) jobs to be accomplished during Jesus' 1,000 year governmental reign over Earth.
At Revelation 5:9-10 those called to Heaven will be servants for those people who inherit the Earth.
They serve as ' kings ' under Christ taking care of governmental responsibilities for people living on Earth.
They also serve as ' priests ' under Christ as High Priest caring for the spiritual needs of people living on Earth.

MonkeyFire · Jul 31, 2019

All I can say is God doesn't hate, but the devil is.

URAVIP2ME · Jul 31, 2019

leov said:
I do not think that it was a real event, but it reflects people’s views about afterlife , basically Hades.

I find absolutely No afterlife mentioned at John chapter 11.
'Afterlife' basically means being more alive after death then before death.
Whereas, the Bible teaches future resurrection ( being restored back to life at a future time )- Acts of the Apostles 24:15.
Some people having a first or earlier resurrection to heavenly life as per Revelation 20:6; 2:10; 5:9-10.
The majority of people will be awakened from death's deep sleep during Jesus' 1,000-yar reign over Earth.
Sleeping in biblical hades (haides) as taught at Psalms 6:5; Psalms 13:3; Psalms 115:17; Isaiah 38:18; Ecclesiastes 9:5.
Whereas, it is false clergy who teach Not sleep but teach pain after death. That is a non-biblical teaching.

leov · Jul 31, 2019

URAVIP2ME said:
I find absolutely No afterlife mentioned at John chapter 11.
'Afterlife' basically means being more alive after death then before death.
Whereas, the Bible teaches future resurrection ( being restored back to life at a future time )- Acts of the Apostles 24:15.
Some people having a first or earlier resurrection to heavenly life as per Revelation 20:6; 2:10; 5:9-10.
The majority of people will be awakened from death's deep sleep during Jesus' 1,000-yar reign over Earth.
Sleeping in biblical hades (haides) as taught at Psalms 6:5; Psalms 13:3; Psalms 115:17; Isaiah 38:18; Ecclesiastes 9:5.
Whereas, it is false clergy who teach Not sleep but teach pain after death. That is a non-biblical teaching.

It rich man and Lazarus story in Luke. Lazarus from John is something else.

Hockeycowboy · Jul 31, 2019

Bob the Unbeliever said:
I'll TAKE it! It's 1000000000 times better than the hideous ego-stroking needed in the bible's "heaven"...

Huh, whaddaya know. Where’s that Scripture about “hideous ego-stroking” in heaven? I never read that one.

Now, I did read that “life’s water” is “free”! Revelation 22:17

Water That Leads to Life — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY

Isn’t that loving of God? Everlasting life (on Earth) is free for you to have, won’t cost you a thing.

And the alternative is free, also: complete non-existence, forever. Won’t cost you a thing.

But if you’re into S & M...sorry, you’ll be disappointed.

Bob the Unbeliever · Aug 1, 2019

URAVIP2ME said:
Hmmmmm.... mass clarification......... as reported at Matthew 7:21-23.
Remember: Jesus informs us that MANY would come ' in his name ' but prove false.

Don't forget the teaching about the fake ' weed/tares ' Christians and the genuine ' wheat ' Christians how they would grow together over the centuries until the Harvest Time, or the soon coming ' time of separation ' on Earth as found at Matthew 25:31-33,37,40

All of that? Only proves that if your god is real? It is an utter and near-complete failure at being GOOD.

That is to say, even your own ugly book admits your god is grossly incompetent at managing.

The mere fact you say that "most christians are false christians" alone, points to incredible failure-- if a company created a product, that had to throw away most of the product as a failure? It would soon fade into obscurity.

Worse-- if there were competing products that were not Genuine™ -- but were 100% indistinguishable from the "original" in every way that matters? What difference would it make which product you got? NONE!

Your entire post is utter condemnation for your tiny slice of the Religious Pie. You paint a picture of a god who is either an absolutely dumb incompetent?

OR WORSE: ONE OF MALICIOUS NEGLIGENCE.

In the final analysis, the ONLY outcome that is not Pure Evil? Is the one where your god simply doesn't exist in the first place...

Bob the Unbeliever · Aug 1, 2019

URAVIP2ME said:
I find No ego-stroking in Heaven, but jobs to be done, work to be done.
I see two (2) jobs to be accomplished during Jesus' 1,000 year governmental reign over Earth.
At Revelation 5:9-10 those called to Heaven will be servants for those people who inherit the Earth.
They serve as ' kings ' under Christ taking care of governmental responsibilities for people living on Earth.
They also serve as ' priests ' under Christ as High Priest caring for the spiritual needs of people living on Earth.

that is even WORSE! But nevermindthat-- if Revelation describes the Literal End of the Earth?

WHAT IS LEFT FOR YOU EGOMANIACS TO BE ALL-POWERFUL KINGS OVER? No humans are left on Earth. Earth itself was destroyed... what would there be to be ruler OVER?

Revelation is just one giant pile of contradiction after another... but it's PERFECT if you consider the writer (whomever that was-- we really have no rational or accurate clue) was HIGH AS A KITE on mushrooms, or other hallucinogenic.

Bob the Unbeliever · Aug 1, 2019

Hockeycowboy said:
Huh, whaddaya know. Where’s that Scripture about “hideous ego-stroking” in heaven? I never read that one.

Now, I did read that “life’s water” is “free”! Revelation 22:17

Water That Leads to Life — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY

Isn’t that loving of God? Everlasting life (on Earth) is free for you to have, won’t cost you a thing.

And the alternative is free, also: complete non-existence, forever. Won’t cost you a thing.

But if you’re into S & M...sorry, you’ll be disappointed.

That's so CUTE-- you don't even read your own ugly bible's depictions of ... ahem.... "heaven".

I'll leave you to your gross ignoring of the majority of your immoral bible.

I'd say it was "mostly harmless".... except that people like you keep trying to pass Hate Laws based on what YOU think it "Says".... (especially when it doesn't.... C.F. anti-abortion-- the bible's actually okay with that.. )

URAVIP2ME · Aug 5, 2019

leov said:
It rich man and Lazarus story in Luke. Lazarus from John is something else.

Yes, the rich man /Lazarus 'story' ( an illustration and Not a real happening ) is in Luke.
Whereas, John chapter 11 is about a real actual happening.
Without a parable ( story / illustration ) Jesus would Not address the crowds as per Matthew 13:34.
Remember: just being ' rich ' (wealthy) is Not a sin - see James 2:2
However, those ' rich men ' (Pharisees) were greedy/covetous money-loving people - Luke 16:14,19
Jesus was addressing those unfaithful 'rich men' Pharisees (Luke 16:16)
Jesus' faithful death ended that old Mosaic Law Constitution but the Pharisees wanted it to continue- Romans 10:4

URAVIP2ME · Aug 5, 2019

Bob the Unbeliever said:
that is even WORSE! But nevermindthat-- if Revelation describes the Literal End of the Earth?
WHAT IS LEFT FOR YOU EGOMANIACS TO BE ALL-POWERFUL KINGS OVER? No humans are left on Earth. Earth itself was destroyed... what would there be to be ruler OVER?.................

I don't understand how there can be a literal end to Earth when there will be healing for earth's nations- Revelation 22:2
Sure false churches and schools teach Earth destroyed but the Bible teaches Earth abides forever - Ecclesiastes 1:4 B
Jesus referred to Psalms 37:9-11 when he said the meek will inherit the Earth at Matthew 5:5.
So, in order for humble people to inherit the Earth, then Earth will be here. Here as described at Isaiah 35th chapter.
Thus, Revelation is a revealing about the ' happy climax ' of paradise restored to Earth forever.

Eternal damnation how bad can it be

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Veteran Member

Veteran Member

Well-Known Member

Veteran Member

Veteran Member

Veteran Member

Veteran Member

Veteran Member

Well-Known Member

Veteran Member

Well-Known Member

Witness for Jehovah

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Veteran Member

Veteran Member