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Consciousness is Relative

robocop (actually)

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
The very fact that you can see this post and agree or disagree proves it. This is the starting point for non realism. Do any of you want to dispute the point that consciousness is relative?
Consciousness does not imply choice.

In my second book I implied the following:

"I just said basically in Flatland that if you connect up thoughts to be a thought thinking it is aware of itself and thinking what it does it is consciousness."
 

Howard Is

Lucky Mud
Thanks, I have bookmarked Dr. Lily. Drugs and isolation chambers can create other forms of consciousness but I don't think they necessarily can explain all forms.

I doubt there is an explanation.

It wasn’t just the use of LSD that characterised Lilly. Those experiments involved preparation of subjects with hypnotic induction prior to the session ( 500 micrograms in an isolation/float chamber) . The hypnotic inductions were used to build specific kinds of belief systems. Then the subjects experiences were analysed in relation to those induced belief systems.

Lilly was attempting to bring the scientific method into exploring the relationship of belief and forms of consciousness.
 

Neutral Name

Active Member
I doubt there is an explanation.

It wasn’t just the use of LSD that characterised Lilly. Those experiments involved preparation of subjects with hypnotic induction prior to the session ( 500 micrograms in an isolation/float chamber) . The hypnotic inductions were used to build specific kinds of belief systems. Then the subjects experiences were analysed in relation to those induced belief systems.

Lilly was attempting to bring the scientific method into exploring the relationship of belief and forms of consciousness.

Very cool!
 
The very fact that you can see this post and agree or disagree proves it. This is the starting point for non realism. Do any of you want to dispute the point that consciousness is relative?

I don't wish to contest the point, but I wish to ask, do you believe the process of consciousness is relative to the qualia of consciousness?
 

osgart

Nothing my eye, Something for sure
There's a real you in there! And regardless of anyone else being, you are still there!

Consciousness is non relative until you make a relative expression.
 
There's a real you in there! And regardless of anyone else being, you are still there!

Consciousness is non relative until you make a relative expression.

What do you mean by "real"? Consciousness is a recursive process. Giving it a label doesn't make it real. There is no static thing that can be grasped or discovered. Every 60 milliseconds there is a flash of consciousness that arrives from the pre-material level of the universe and hits the material threshold collapsing the waveform and like a videotape we perceive the world as continuous but it is not. We miss far more than we perceive. We miss 59 milliseconds of every 60. Doesn't this mean that "real" is a relative concept too?
 

osgart

Nothing my eye, Something for sure
What do you mean by "real"? Consciousness is a recursive process. Giving it a label doesn't make it real. There is no static thing that can be grasped or discovered. Every 60 milliseconds there is a flash of consciousness that arrives from the pre-material level of the universe and hits the material threshold collapsing the waveform and like a videotape we perceive the world as continuous but it is not. We miss far more than we perceive. We miss 59 milliseconds of every 60. Doesn't this mean that "real" is a relative concept too?

Whether i am aware or unaware, i am still existent. And no i cannot be aware of everything, but am usually aware of something. I do not flicker on and off. When i am totally unconscious i still exist.

I do think the senses reflect an accurate representation of reality regardless of how much we miss.

I am witness to my own reality. A feeling of constant pain will let you know that there is reality. And i have such pain, and it reminds me. Lol.
 
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