leov
Well-Known Member
Something similar to Swedenborg's hell.
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Eternal damnation how bad can it be
- Thread starter dfnj
- Start date
That is new information for me.
I wonder from where Swedenborg got his idea______________
leov
Well-Known Member
Direct vision.
I googled his name and read he believed in afterlife.
Afterlife and resurrection are Not the same thing.
Afterlife implies being more alive after death than before death.
Whereas the Bible teaches the dead know nothing - Ecclesiastes 9:5; Psalms 115:17; Isaiah 38:18; John 11:11-14.
The Bible promises a future resurrection from death's sleep, that is why the ' future tense ' is used at Acts of the Apostles 24:15 that there ' is going to be ' a resurrection....
That future resurrection takes place during Jesus coming 1,000-year rule over Earth.
leov
Well-Known Member
Rich man and Lazarus for example.
Bob the Unbeliever
Well-Known Member
Indeed--- if you read the bible carefully? ABSOLUTELY NO free will in "heaven" anyway, so you'll just be a robotic automata mindless "praising" bible-god's massive EGO.
Sounds hellish.
leov
Well-Known Member
My phone changed busy to bust? Lol
Free will is associated only with physical body, in "heaven" there is kind of free will limited by your placement which reflects on your use of your free will while being in your body.
Bob the Unbeliever
Well-Known Member
What? None of that made any sense....
If there is no free will in heaven? Why did your god go through all the bother, in the first place?
Your "heaven" sounds like endless torture, to me-- or worse-- some sort of automaton has stolen the memories of former humans, and are now parodying them in some sort of horrific Cosmic Joke on those victims.
Bottom line: Even your bible states that most don't make 'heaven'-- and are sent to infinite torture instead.
That is a massive, horrific and terrible FAIL on the part of this ... ahem thing you call "god".
Yet? The bible states that this was as god intended all along...!
It is absolutely not good. On an infinite scale of 'not good'....!
Infinite Evil, really.
leov
Well-Known Member
I read Steiner and Swedenborg , it is something in between, I think, I like Swedenborg myself. I think it general Rosicrucian motive, Jung is not far away either.
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Road Less Traveled
Active Member
My Elites or El-ites (God-ites.) Haha.
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe it depends on the person. For some people remembering all the bad things they did would be torture but for others not so much. For some the fire will seem real as though the pain is real for other the ability to detach from it could be there. The worst is boredom and that lack of life.
I do believe a loving God provides the opportunity to avoid Hell but He isn't forcing anyone to avoid it.
I do believe a loving God provides the opportunity to avoid Hell but He isn't forcing anyone to avoid it.
Muffled
Jesus in me
Heaven with the evil god character of the Bible would be eternal damnation of the worst kind.
I believe I can wish you well in your belief that you will enjoy Hell. Somehow I think that will not be the case.
Muffled
Jesus in me
Some people think a lot of things about Heaven but that doesn't make them true.
There is this one:
Mark 12:25 For when they rise from the dead, they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels in heaven.
You think a lot of things, judging by your posts, but that doesn't make them true either.
Bob the Unbeliever
Well-Known Member
After reading the bible's description of "heaven"? Can we just avoid *that* instead? The bible's hell is simply endless pain, and what-not-- you get used to that pretty quickly.
But the horrible description of bible-heaven? Seems it would be infinitely worse... who want's to stroke the massive, over-blown ego of god forever and ever? Like some sort of 'praise-robot'...!
Bob the Unbeliever
Well-Known Member
Of course you don't think that-- you actually believe that people are worth less than pond-scum, and somehow deserving of infinite torture.
That's pretty evil. It's nearly as evil as a being who would create such a place...
Bob the Unbeliever
Well-Known Member
What? Many folk, who are happily married or in loving relationships, literally get the majority of their Self Identity in relation to their Significant Other.
But in this... "heaven" of yours, all that is wiped away?
Wow.... that's beyond evil. Actually.... ! Who want's to be an angel anyway? By all accounts, they get the worst of the worst tasks from "god"....
I am thinking you are referring to Not an actual happening such as found at John 11:11-14 but to Luke 16:14-31.
The 16th chapter of Luke is about parables or illustrations. It is a story and Not a real happening.
The un-named rich man (Luke 16:1) and the un-named rich man of Luke 16:19 are the covetous Pharisees mentioned at Luke 16:14.
The story or parable that Jesus was giving was directed toward those greedy money-loving Pharisees.
The Law (Constitution of the Mosaic Law) and the OT prophets were until (lasted until) John the Baptist - Luke 16:16-17.
That 'Law/prophet arrangement' was like a marriage contract (verse 16)
This is why verse 18 mentions the putting away of the wife as being adultery.
Those Pharisees did Not want to accept that Christ's 'death' would end that old covenant or contract arrangement.
If the Pharisees wanted to become Christ's figurative bride (or bride class) they must be released from the old Law.
Also, remember the Lazarus of John 11:11-14 lived with his sisters Mary and Martha.
The Lazarus of Luke 16:20 was a beggar begging for spiritual crumbs - Luke 16:20-21
Since Lazarus was a common name back then, then using the name Lazarus represented the common people.
Plus, father Abraham (like King David -Acts 2:34; John 3:13) is still asleep in the grave - Luke 16:22
Even those called to heaven are Not angels but referred to as being saints or holy ones - Daniel 7:18
No human turns into an angel.
Adam and Eve were meant to be husband and wife forever.
So, only those called to heaven (Rev. 20:6; 2:10; 5:9-10) give up their physical bodies.
The majority of resurrected mankind will have a happy-and-healthy 'physical' resurrection on Earth.
This resurrection will take place during Jesus' millennium-long day of governing over Earth for a thousand years.
I find if the Bible's hell was endless pain then Jesus would be in endless pain - Acts of the Apostles 2:27.
If the Bible's hell was permanent Jesus would still be in biblical hell.
Jesus never taught any post-mortem pain or double jeopardy for sins.
Rather, Jesus taught ' sleep ' in death - John 11:11-14.
Jesus learned that 'sleeping state about the dead' from the old Hebrew Scriptures, such as:
- Psalms 6:5; Psalms 13:3; Psalms 115:17; Isaiah 38:18; Ecclesiastes 9:5
So, the Bible's hell is simply mankind's temporary stone-cold grave for the sleeping dead.