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What does the Bible say about the origins of the Earth in relation to what science say?

shmogie

Well-Known Member
No, the straw man was YOU suggesting that age of geology was tied to fossils found therein and that age of fossils was determined by age of geology, thus creating a straw man impression that there was circular methodology taking place.
I said, nor suggested any such thing. I said if true, it was problematic that a tree could be fossilized in two different strata with millions of years separating the alleged ages of the strata.

Apparently you see no problem with this, fine.

Don´t attribute to me things I never said.
 

Wandering Monk

Well-Known Member
Since the alleged age of the geology determines fossil age, determining the age of geology is critical. Sometimes the stated age of the geology doesn´t seem right..

Did you say this or not? It is patently not true.

As for multistrate tree fossils, I asked you for your source, last line of post 295.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
I said, nor suggested any such thing. I said if true, it was problematic that a tree could be fossilized in two different strata with millions of years separating the alleged ages of the strata.

Apparently you see no problem with this, fine.

Don´t attribute to me things I never said.

Where do you think that that is observed? Creationists often make the error of assuming that all deposition had to occur at the same rate. Some layers were deposited very slowly, some at a much more rapid rate, and it is relatively easy to understand why the rates are different for different environments. The so called "polystrate" trees are not polystrate since technically theyare found in one stratum.

Trees can stand for hundreds of years today without falling:

Ghost forest - Wikipedia

All it takes for them to eventually fossilize is a continued sea level rise or depression of land. Both have known to occur from natural processes. No magic needed.

Some of the stumps found in ghost forests can be up to 2,000 years old You appear to hate the derision that others respond with to your posts, but if all that you have are PRATT's then that derision is well earned.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Did you say this or not? It is patently not true.

As for multistrate tree fossils, I asked you for your source, last line of post 295.

Ironically many of the articles from creationists on "polystrate trees" rely on illustrations from articles over 100 years ago explaining how they formed naturally.
 

shmogie

Well-Known Member
Did you say this or not? It is patently not true.

As for multistrate tree fossils, I asked you for your source, last line of post 295.
Yep, I said it, it says nothing about fossil age determining geology age. That came from your imagination.

Did you not read ¨ I once read an article¨ ? Does that imply to you that I have the information right at my fingertips ? Dd you not read the caveat ¨if true¨ ? Obviously, I wasn´t pushing the idea as absolute fact, calm down.

What is patently not true ?

Be precise when you are calling someone a liar.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Yep, I said it, it says nothing about fossil age determining geology age. That came from your imagination.

Did you not read ¨ I once read an article¨ ? Does that imply to you that I have the information right at my fingertips ? Dd you not read the caveat ¨if true¨ ? Obviously, I wasn´t pushing the idea as absolute fact, calm down.

What is patently not true ?

Be precise when you are calling someone a liar.
One should not make one's claims that one cannot support. One ends up looking like a liar when one does so. Too bad that you tend to rely on sources that were written by liars, or idiots. If you want a serious discussion on how we know the age of strata I can go over a short history of the development of geologic dating. Why we know it is accurate and how it refutes the flood myth.
 

Wandering Monk

Well-Known Member
Yep, I said it, it says nothing about fossil age determining geology age. That came from your imagination.

Did you not read ¨ I once read an article¨ ? Does that imply to you that I have the information right at my fingertips ? Dd you not read the caveat ¨if true¨ ? Obviously, I wasn´t pushing the idea as absolute fact, calm down.

What is patently not true ?

Be precise when you are calling someone a liar.

My apologies. I read the exact reverse of what you said.

We often hear YECs saying that you can't trust geologic dating because it is circular. I thought that was what you were suggesting.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
No problem !!
You may not accept the false claims of "polystrate trees" but that still does not explain this quote of yours:

"Since the alleged age of the geology determines fossil age, determining the age of geology is critical. Sometimes the stated age of the geology doesn´t seem right.."

Why use the highly prejudicial term "alleged"? Do you treat an "alleged" killer that way after he has been found guilty? Geologic dates very rarely rely on only one test. Scientists like claims to be supported by several independent sources. How does the geology not seem right?
 

Audie

Veteran Member
I said may be. Since the alleged age of the geology determines fossil age, determining the age of geology is critical. Sometimes the stated age of the geology doesn´t seem right.

I read of one case where the fossil of a standing tree was in two geological strata from top to bottom, strata millions of years apart in age.

If this account was true, then something is wrong.

The account is no more true than is the Cardiff Giant
or the Paluxy Man Tracks. There is something wrong
but it is with the integrity and motives of those
who get into such ignoble activities and claims.

There are uncertainties in any science but geologists are not
stupid.

That fossils range in age from " buried yesterday"
to hundreds of millions of years old is not open
to reasonable doubt.

In the event, whether said specimen is
120 or 130 million years old is of technical
interest to paleontologists looking to better
understand its role in the ecosystem of
the day, and position in evolution, it is only
a matter of interest, not an existential
matter re the whole meaning of reality.

Our yecs feel that a date older than their flood
or 6 day poof is a threat, possibly a heinous lie
from Satan.

If btw you enjoy driving about and viewing
the land, even a little time spent with a book
of historical geology will do wonders to make
the landscape come alive.

And get a most enjoyable book called
"Basin and Range" by a John McPhee.

If he does not get you going on thinking about
the what and how you are seeing I will be so
surprised.

This is a gift I am offering! Plz take it.
 

Audie

Veteran Member
You may not accept the false claims of "polystrate trees" but that still does not explain this quote of yours:

"Since the alleged age of the geology determines fossil age, determining the age of geology is critical. Sometimes the stated age of the geology doesn´t seem right.."

Why use the highly prejudicial term "alleged"? Do you treat an "alleged" killer that way after he has been found guilty? Geologic dates very rarely rely on only one test. Scientists like claims to be supported by several independent sources. How does the geology not seem right?


Oh now dont be get bentoutta shape over semantics as
you view them. "Alleged" is as defanged as "awesome',
and for that matter, "admit" long ago quit being used
to mean "reluctantly confess".
 

BilliardsBall

Veteran Member
Look at Bishop Ussher's calculations and tell us where he is wrong. If you can't, then you must agree with ~6000 years.

Jesus's fave title for Himself, "Son of David". They were removed by 14 generations!

MANY scholars have noted the "sons" of the OT could be "notable descendants". Bishop Usher's work has been in disrepute for a century!
 

Wandering Monk

Well-Known Member
Jesus's fave title for Himself, "Son of David". They were removed by 14 generations!

MANY scholars have noted the "sons" of the OT could be "notable descendants". Bishop Usher's work has been in disrepute for a century!

Except if you look at the lineages of the people mentioned in Jesus' genealogy, the NT leaves people out.

The probable reason that the NT settles on 14 generations is that the name 'David' has a numerical value of 14 in the Hebrew language. It was just more mystical story telling.
 

ecco

Veteran Member
Look at Bishop Ussher's calculations and tell us where he is wrong. If you can't, then you must agree with ~6000 years.
Jesus's fave title for Himself, "Son of David". They were removed by 14 generations!

MANY scholars have noted the "sons" of the OT could be "notable descendants". Bishop Usher's work has been in disrepute for a century!

"Sons" can be notable descendants. But the bible uses the term "begat".
6And Seth lived an hundred and five years, and begat Enos:
9And Enos lived ninety years, and begat Cainan:
12And Cainan lived seventy years, and begat Mahalaleel:​

People may try to ignore or argue against Bishop Ussher's work because of the inescapable conclusion it reaches. But, as I stated earlier...Look at Bishop Ussher's calculations and tell us where he is wrong. If you can't, then you must agree with ~6000 years.

Alternatively, you could just admit that the Biblical genealogies are just fantasies like the rest of the Bible.
 

A Vestigial Mote

Well-Known Member
One point, The Bible is clear that God only created one time, what I equate to the big bang. He made from what he created for 6 days.

He has not made or created anything since, as far as our universe is concerned.

Thus, no one will see a tree popping into existence.
Does The Bible go into any details as to why God will no longer create things? I have a good idea why these things might no longer happen, and were never witnessed by anyone in the first place. The easiest answer one can imagine is that it didn't happen as described.
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
There is no science that can prove the existence of God. Your statement begins with an unfalsifiable premise about his existence.
I wonder if there is any science that can prove the non-existence of God.
Seem to me your statement is about the premise about the non-existence of God.
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
"Sons" can be notable descendants. But the bible uses the term "begat".
6And Seth lived an hundred and five years, and begat Enos:
9And Enos lived ninety years, and begat Cainan:
12And Cainan lived seventy years, and begat Mahalaleel:..............​


In God's eyes a thousand years is as a day.- Psalms 90:4; 2 Peter 3:8
So, once Adam sinned No one could live longer than a thousand-year day.
Thus, Adam died at age 930, and the oldest person at age 969 years - Genesis 5:5; Genesis 5:27

As far as the ' creative days ' there is Nothing in Scripture to indicate how long each creative day was or even if they are of the same length of time or of differing lengths of time.
ALL of the creative days are summed up by the singular word ' day ' at Genesis 2:4.
God's 7th day was still on going in the first century as per Hebrews 4:4-11.​
 
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