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Love For All, Hatred For None

TransmutingSoul

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Perhaps this will help?

I didn't read the story. If you can understand why I did not read it; you will also understand the point that I am trying to make.

That is your choice and I understand we make choices, that we think are the best for us, but may very well not be.

I can only wish you all the best in your choices, may they be right for you.

Regards Tony
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
How do you know that? Why would God confuse us with each religious teaching in one age that contradicted the last? This to me, is nonsense.
The actual scriptures of the various religions do not contradict each other. They are simply renewed in every age and some of the teachings and laws are updated to accommodate the needs of humanity in the new age.
Since there is no mention of future dispensations, I would like to know how its not confusing to have a rabble of different religions all crammed into a one size fits all belief system?
There is mention of future Dispensations, even if they are not referred to as such. The entire Bible, OT and NT, is chock full of prophecies that say what will happen in the future.

There is no such thing as a one size fits all religion, there are simply new religions revealed by Manifestations of God in every new age, and these are the religions God wants humanity to adhere to in that new age. However, what has happened is that people have refuse to relinquish the religion they believe in and look at the new religion
The God of the Bible never borrowed ideas or practices from religions outside of the one he prescribed....it was humans who did that. It corrupted his truth and he was not happy about it. There can only be one truth. All roads do not lead to Rome.
Of course God would not want anyone following anything but the Bible during the Dispensation of the Bible, because the Bible was the One Truth that everyone should be adhering to during that Dispensation.

Truth from God is revealed successively throughout the ages, as mankind needs it and is able to understand it. Back in the days of Jesus, humanity was unable to bear what Baha’u’llah revealed. That is why Jesus said:

John 16:12-13 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
If you know about Jesus' parables, then you would also know that "weeds" of false Christianity were to be sown by the devil after the death of Jesus and his apostles. These "weeds" were to grow along with the "wheat", in the same field (the world) right up until the end of the current system of things. It was then that a final separation was to be made and God would send his angels to gather the weeds up and dispose of them permanently. Only then would the genuine wheat be gathered. (Matthew 13:24-30; 36-43)
I agree that weeds have grown up in Christianity, but that is what happens over time with any religion, most followers fall away from the teachings of the Prophet. That is why those teachings need to be renewed from age to age.

There is more than one way of interpreting those verses. I believe that “the end of the world” refers to the end of the religious cycle we were living in, the Prophetic Cycle, also called the Adamic Cycle. That religious Cycle ended with Muhammad, and that is why He was called “the Seal of the Prophets.” The Bab and Baha’u’llah ushered in a new religious the Baha’i Cycle, or the Cycle of Fulfillment, because it is during this religious Cycle that all the Bible prophecies will be fulfilled; not all at once but over time.

I believe that the Harvest Time has come and it was ushered in by the Bab and Baha’u’llah, since Baha’u’llah was the return of the Christ Spirit and the Comforter Jesus promised to send. Jesus was the first Comforter, Baha’u’llah was another Comforter.

John 14:16-17 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.


So, since Jesus set His Own Spirit, those who recognize Baha’u’llah are the wheat and those who reject Him are the chaff, because rejecting Baha’u’llah is akin to rejecting Jesus. In the following passage WE refers to Jesus and Baha’u’llah as the same Spirit of God who came in different human attire.

“WE, verily, have come for your sakes, and have borne the misfortunes of the world for your salvation. Flee ye the One Who hath sacrificed His life that ye may be quickened? Fear God, O followers of the Spirit (Jesus), and walk not in the footsteps of every divine that hath gone far astray… Open the doors of your hearts. He Who is the Spirit (Jesus) verily, standeth before them.” Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh, p, 92

“O kings of Christendom! Heard ye not the saying of Jesus, the Spirit of God, "I go away, and come again unto you"? 2 Wherefore, then, did ye fail, when He did come again unto you in the clouds of heaven, to draw nigh unto Him, that ye might behold His face, and be of them that attained His Presence? In another passage He saith: "When He, the Spirit of Truth, is come, He will guide you into all truth." 3The Summons of the Lord of Hosts, p. 191

Ummmm....who said?
You sure do put a lot of faith in a man who made claims that he could never back up.
And you can back up the claims of Jesus? Do you have any testimony outside of the Bible to even prove that Jesus existed, let alone all that has been attributed to Him? To try to use the Bible to prove the Bible is circular reasoning, as my atheist friends love to say. ;)

I do have testimony outside of what Baha’u’llah wrote that validate the existence of Baha’u’llah and what He did on His Mission.
The Christ of the first century had impeccable credentials.....and he fulfilled hundreds of prophesies about his lineage, his place of birth and the manner of his death. Baha'u'llah had nothing in the Hebrew scriptures to indicate that another "Christ" was even necessary, let alone had other 'scripture" to write.
Jesus fulfilled “some” of the OT prophecies but certainly not all of them, so how do you explain that? If you do not believe that the same man Jesus in the same body will someday return to Earth and fulfill the remainder of those prophecies, how will they ever be fulfilled? If they are never fulfilled that makes God into a liar.

Isaiah 53 is just one chapter that precludes Jesus: Isaiah 53:3, 4, and 5 could refer to Jesus, but Isaiah 53:8, 9, and 10 cannot refer to Jesus. Jesus was not taken from prison and from judgment. Jesus did not make his grave with the wicked and the rich. Jesus did not see His seed. The days of Jesus were cut short, they were not prolonged.

Logically speaking, the only way that Jesus could be the Messiah would be if Jesus fulfilled these prophecies upon His Return. This is just the tip of the iceberg concerning prophecies that were fulfilled by Baha’u’llah and not Jesus.
Where is it written that Ishmael or Islam would have anything to do with the second coming of the Christ?
Baha'u'llah has no credentials....nothing to identify him as one that was expected to come.
But Baha’u’llah fulfilled all the prophecies for the Second Coming, as is carefully delineated in the book entitled Thief in the Night by William Sears. He was a Christian all his life and he carefully researched all the prophecies for seven years and only after he was completely satisfied that they had been fulfilled did he become a Baha’i. The book provides incontrovertible evidence that the prophecies for the Second Coming have been fulfilled. The remainder of the OT prophecies which I refer to as the Messianic Age prophecies are either in the process of being fulfilled or they will be fulfilled during this age.
The Bible completely contradicts his claims because as it says in John 17:11 that you quoted..." And now I am no more in the world".....In a little while the world will see me no more'. (John 14:19)
These were claims made by Jesus because Jesus never planned to return to Earth in the same body, as most Christians believe (Acts 1:10-11). He planned to send His Spirit which would be manifested in another human temple with another name (Revelation 2:17, Revelation 3:12).
Christ was never coming back in the flesh. When mankind was to see Jesus again it was to be at the end of this age, with an angelic army to exact vengeance on those who misrepresented his God and led the majority of people down the wrong track. (Matthew 7:13-14) The trouble is, they went willingly.
Well, it is a welcome relief that you at least do not believe that the same Jesus is going to return in the same body, because I consider that a ridiculous belief. There is no oxygen in heaven, so Jesus could not have ascended in the same body and lived there for 2000 years only to return on a poufy cloud. :rolleyes:

What did the Christians and others do to misrepresent God and lead the majority of people down the wrong track? What form do you think the angelic army will take? Will they be in human form?

I believe that God may get His vengeance if people do not turn to Him by the appointed time:

“We have a fixed time for you, O peoples. If ye fail, at the appointed hour, to turn towards God, He, verily, will lay violent hold on you, and will cause grievous afflictions to assail you from every direction. How severe, indeed, is the chastisement with which your Lord will then chastise you!” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 214
God has one name that is his alone....forever. He has no need to change his unique name. If you have to ask "Why should it matter what name God has?" then you clearly have no idea of its importance. Allah is not Yahweh.
No, I guess I do not understand the importance of the name by which we refer to God. However, logically speaking, there cannot be more than one God, because God is one and alone, exalted above all of Creation, Omnipotent and Omniscient. People might have different conceptions of God or call God by different names, but God is still God.

God is referred to as the Lord throughout the Bible, what about that?
 

Kangaroo Feathers

Yea, it is written in the Book of Cyril...
"Love for All Hatred for None is a universal motto of peace, justice, equality, love, understanding, and mutual reconciliation. The motto was coined by the third spiritual leader of the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community, Hazrat Mirza Nasir Ahmad (ra).
Hazrath Mirza Nasir Ahmad (ra) coined this motto on occasion of the inauguration of the first mosque in Spain in the last 700 years on October 9, 1980. Elaborating on this motto he said, “Islam teaches us to live with mutual love and affection and with humility.”
Islam means Peace and in-order to uphold principles of peace, one needs mutual love and affection. How can one ensure mutual love is continuously spread, clearly with humility? I believe humility aspect is the key reason why ‘Hatred for None’ is present in the motto. If one is humble, one acknowledges that they have many shortcomings and learns to overlook shortcomings of others which help foster an atmosphere of hatred for none."

A History and Description of the Ahmadiyya Motto: Love for All, Hatred for None
...but what about New Zealand?
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
And you know this for a fact, do you? He can have whatever he wants to, according to his will....does he somehow have limitations that we are unaware of?
God cannot HAVE what is not within His nature to HAVE. God is not a human so God cannot have human offspring. Nevertheless, it is a Baha’i belief that Jesus was immaculately conceived of the Holy Spirit. It is considered a mystery how that happened.

1637. Christ, Virgin Birth of

"First regarding the birth of Jesus Christ. In light of what Bahá’u’lláh and ‘Abdu’l-Bahá have stated concerning this subject it is evident that Jesus came into this world through the direct intervention of the Holy Spirit, and that consequently His birth was quite miraculous. This is an established fact, and the friends need not feel at all surprised, as the belief in the possibility of miracles has never been rejected in the Teachings. Their importance, however, has been minimized."
(From a letter dated December 31, 1937 written on behalf of the Guardian to an individual believer)

1639. Bahá’í Teachings in Agreement with Doctrines of Catholic Church Concerning the Virgin Birth

"With regard to your question concerning the Virgin Birth of Jesus: On this point, as on several others, the Bahá’í Teachings are in full agreement with the doctrines of the Catholic Church. In the 'Kitáb-i-Íqán' (Book of Certitude) p. 56, and in a few other Tablets still unpublished, Bahá’u’lláh confirms, however indirectly, the Catholic conception of the Virgin Birth. Also ‘Abdu’l-Bahá in the 'Some Answered Questions', Chap. XII, p. 73, explicitly states that 'Christ found existence through the Spirit of God' which statement necessarily implies, when viewed in the light of the text, that Jesus was not the son of Joseph."
(From a letter dated October 14, 1945 written on behalf of the Guardian to an individual believer)

Lights of Guidance/Christ - Bahaiworks, a library of works about the Bahá’í Faith
By his own admission, Jesus was God's biological son, who came down from heaven and who was a glorious spirit being before his human birth. You do understand the reason for his human birth I assume?
Where in the Bible did Jesus say He was God’s biological Son?

I believe that the soul of Jesus was pre-existent in the spiritual world with God before He was born in this world from the womb of Mary. The Spirit of Jesus descended from heaven and united with His body at the moment of His immaculate conception.

Jesus explained why He came into this world, to bear witness to the truth about God:

John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.
Jesus was the "prophet greater than Moses" who was to come. There are no others mentioned. (Deuteronomy 18:18-19) Jesus taught us all we need to know.
No He did not teach us everything, not according to Jesus:

John 16:12-13 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

Baha’u’llah was the Spirit of truth who came to bring the “many things.”
According to your beliefs perhaps....but not according to any Jewish or Christian scripture.
Of course not according to Jewish or Christian scripture, because those scriptures are about Moses and Jesus. Muhammad and the Bab and Baha’u’llah had not been born yet, so why would they have scriptures written about them thousands of years ago?
I believe that any person emerging from the Muslim faith has nothing whatsoever to do with Jesus Christ.
The three Abrahamic faiths bear little resemblance to one another. And even today are not exactly bosom buddies.
Muslims believe in Jesus and highly revere Him as one of the greatest Messengers of God who ever lived.

These religions are different in their social teachings and laws and they are different in their message, but their spiritual teachings are the same.

They are not bosom buddies because the religious believers do not understand that they all came from the same God.
I do not need to tell the "Christians" any such thing. Jesus was put to death in the flesh but made alive in the spirit. (1 Peter 3:18) He would never be of flesh and blood again. Any "Christian" who believes that flesh and blood can exist in heaven has no idea what scripture teaches.
Hallelujah! So you do not believe in the bodily resurrection of Jesus Christ?

Do Jehovah Witness believe in the resurrection of Jesus?

They believe that after his death, Jesus appeared to his disciples, convinced them of his resurrection, and then ascended into heaven to sit at Jehovah's right hand until he would become the promised king of God's heavenly kingdom.
Jehovah's Witnesses beliefs - Wikipedia

So, you believe that the Spirit of Jesus appeared to the disciples and then it ascended to heaven, no going down into hell as most Christians believe?
That's why wars are fought over them...its why people hate one another because of their differences.

And that is somehow God’s fault? o_O
Where do you get the idea that God can operate through religious systems that he condemned centuries ago? If all religions had the same author, then why did God punish his own people for adopting their beliefs and practices?
What religious system is that?
That is pretty obvious. It would be a long list. But perhaps "ignore" is the wrong word? Perhaps its just ignorance of what Christ actually taught?...meaning that you just have no idea what he taught and you make sweeping statements based on what someone told you he said.
No, the only thing I go by is what Jesus said in the New Testament. I listen to what other people say but I never believe it unless I verify it myself.
If you knew what the Bible says, you could never accept a prophet spawned from Islam in the first place. Has it escaped your notice that most of the refugees in the world are fleeing from Muslim countries? Why are they running away? Like Christians and Jews.....their leaders are not living up to the teachings of their own faith.
How is what Muslims do related to the Baha’i Faith? We are a separate religion based upon a new and separate Revelation from God, with new teachings and laws and a new message.

Muhammad is not responsible for what Muslims have done with His Revelation, not any more than Jesus is responsible for what Christians have done with His Revelation. Free will is why these things happen.
Why did God send Ishmael and his mother away from Abraham's household? Because he was NOT the one through whom the promises were to be fulfilled. Only Isaac was to receive the blessing. Because Ishmael was taunting his younger brother, it demonstrated that he had no respect for God's arrangement. The nation that came from Ishmael were enemies of Israel....and they still are.
Sorry, I do not know anything about that. Are you saying that the promises of Abraham were to be fulfilled through Isaac rather than Ishmael?
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
No one will take up that invitation unless God grants them the heart to do so, faith is a gift and not something we have earned or deserve. Why God gives that heart to people that were not looking, or were not interested, God only knows?
I certainly do not know why at God gave me anything. :rolleyes:

I was not even looking or interested, it just fell out of the sky so to speak. I cannot imagine what I could have ever done to deserve it, but of course as we know Faith in Baha’u’llah is a double-edged sword, because with much knowledge come much responsibility. :eek:

“Be thankful to God for having enabled you to recognise His Cause. Whoever has received this blessing must, prior to his acceptance, have performed some deed which, though he himself was unaware of its character, was ordained by God as a means whereby he has been guided to find and embrace the Truth. As to those who have remained deprived of such a blessing, their acts alone have hindered them from recognising the truth of this Revelation. We cherish the hope that you, who have attained to this light, will exert your utmost to banish the darkness of superstition and unbelief from the midst of the people. May your deeds proclaim your faith and enable you to lead the erring into the paths of eternal salvation. The memory of this night will never be forgotten. May it never be effaced by the passage of time, and may its mention linger for ever on the lips of men.” ~~ Baha’u’llah

The Dawn-Breakers: Nabíl’s Narrative of the Early Days of the Bahá’í Revelation, p. 586
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
This, IMHO, is not love for all. It is too forceful.
That’s just the way God talks to us.

After all, God is All-Powerful so He commands and ordains all kinds of stuff. :D

God is not going to ask us if we like what He has, it is what it is, and we have free will so we can choose to accept or reject it.

“Say: He ordaineth as He pleaseth, by virtue of His sovereignty, and doeth whatsoever He willeth at His own behest. He shall not be asked of the things it pleaseth Him to ordain. He, in truth, is the Unrestrained, the All-Powerful, the All-Wise.”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p, 284
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
Yet the millions of Christians in the US not only condone them, but support them. Why not condemn them as false prophets and perverters of Christ's message?

We do actually...its part of exposing the fake Christianity that people have been led to believe is the real thing, whilst we try to promote the true teachings of Jesus Christ. Most people are gob-smacked when they find out what Jesus actually taught.....and what he didn't.

Those who accept that kind of Christianity are looking to travel the easy road. (Matthew 7:13-14)
Chuck a few dollars at a man on TV who tells you that this is all God requires and bingo! Instant Christians! :facepalm:
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
God cannot HAVE what is not within His nature to HAVE. God is not a human so God cannot have human offspring. Nevertheless, it is a Baha’i belief that Jesus was immaculately conceived of the Holy Spirit. It is considered a mystery how that happened.

The Catholic church does not believe that Jesus was immaculately conceived.....that doctrine applies to Mary. They somehow believe that she was immaculately conceived so that Jesus would have no sin. It has no basis in scripture at all.

Jesus' birth was by the power of holy spirit and God produced a biological son through a process that we could probably never understand with our present knowledge.

Adam was a human created by God, and he too is called a "son of God". (Luke 3:38)
Jesus did not have a human father so he was assumed to be the son of Joseph.

"When Jesus began his work, he was about 30 years old, being the son, as the opinion was,
of Joseph...."
(Luke 3:23)

Where in the Bible did Jesus say He was God’s biological Son?

Jesus is called God's "only begotten son" but he is certainly not the only son of God. Angels too are called "sons of God".

In answer to his accusers, who wanted to charge him with blasphemy, Jesus said...."do you say of him whom the Father consecrated and sent into the world, ‘You are blaspheming,’ because I said, ‘I am the Son of God’?" (John 10:36)

He said, not "a" son of God but "the" son of God. The only one who was a direct creation of his Father...."the firstborn of all creation" (Colossians 1:15-17) who was the agency through whom all things were created.

"I believe that the soul of Jesus was pre-existent in the spiritual world with God before He was born in this world from the womb of Mary. The Spirit of Jesus descended from heaven and united with His body at the moment of His immaculate conception.

If this is what you believe then you have no understanding of the words "soul" and "spirit" in the Hebrew language.
Jesus was a spirit, in the same form as his Father.....the same form that all spirit beings have, but Jesus became a soul, just as Adam became a soul, when he started breathing. The word "soul" never applies to a disembodied spirit.It is always a living, breathing creature, both animal and human.

Jesus explained why He came into this world, to bear witness to the truth about God:

John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

No He did not teach us everything, not according to Jesus:

John 16:12-13 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

Baha’u’llah was the Spirit of truth who came to bring the “many things.”

You believe that "the spirit of the truth" was Baha’u’llah? Why? Because he said so?

The "paraclete" (helper) was God's holy spirit, which was poured out on Jesus' disciples at Pentecost.
Among those "many things" that his disciples could not bear up until that time, had to do with the spiritual nature of the Kingdom and their role in it. At Pentecost, the holy spirit anointed those disciples for life in heaven. Something that they did not really understand until then. The "helper" imparted that knowledge long before your prophet was even born....over 1800 years in fact.

Of course not according to Jewish or Christian scripture, because those scriptures are about Moses and Jesus. Muhammad and the Bab and Baha’u’llah had not been born yet, so why would they have scriptures written about them thousands of years ago?

Its called prophesy.....we are told who and what to expect in the future....there is no mention of any prophet after Christ. There was no need for one. Christ's teachings are contained in one book...the Revelation says no one is to add to it.

Muslims believe in Jesus and highly revere Him as one of the greatest Messengers of God who ever lived.

But they do not see him as the son of God.....do they believe that he was resurrected?

These religions are different in their social teachings and laws and they are different in their message, but their spiritual teachings are the same.

Since God's laws forbade the worship of any god other than Yahweh, that cannot be true....or else why would he punish his people for adopting the religious beliefs and practices of the gods of the Gentile nations. Why was there even a distinction between Jews and Gentiles if that was the case?

They are not bosom buddies because the religious believers do not understand that they all came from the same God.

None of those religious systems believe that they are worshipping the same God. When Israel fell to worshipping Baal, God made it known very clearly that this was unacceptable to him. Out of all the nations on earth, God chose Israel to produce his Messiah. He said that salvation originated with the Jews.

Hallelujah! So you do not believe in the bodily resurrection of Jesus Christ?

Do Jehovah Witness believe in the resurrection of Jesus?

They believe that after his death, Jesus appeared to his disciples, convinced them of his resurrection, and then ascended into heaven to sit at Jehovah's right hand until he would become the promised king of God's heavenly kingdom.
Jehovah's Witnesses beliefs - Wikipedia

So, you believe that the Spirit of Jesus appeared to the disciples and then it ascended to heaven, no going down into hell as most Christians believe?

We do not believe in hell because the Bible does not teach such a heinous doctrine.....

And no, we believe that Jesus would never have compromised the law of God regarding communication with spirits. (Deuteronomy 18:9-12) As a spirit being he materialized physical bodies in order to "appear" to his disciples after his death. In times past, Angels too materialized in order to communicate with God's earthly servants. Gabriel appeared to Mary to inform her of the miracle that would change her life forever.

When he made his appearances after his resurrection, Jesus was not always recognizable. Mary was the first one at his tomb and thought he was the gardener. Jesus produced wounds to convince his disciples that it was him, raised from the dead. At other times there is no mention of his wounds which would have been clearly visible.

Do you ever wonder why Baha’u’llah as Christ returned, has an elaborate tomb, but Jesus doesn't?

And that is somehow God’s fault? o_O

Did I say that? Religious division is man's doing...nothing to do with God....he created humans with one religion and one God. They left him...he didn't leave them.

What religious system is that?

Any religious beliefs or practices that were outside of what God prescribed for Israel....all clearly outlined in the Mosaic law.

How is what Muslims do related to the Baha’i Faith? We are a separate religion based upon a new and separate Revelation from God, with new teachings and laws and a new message.

You are a breakaway from Islam....not Judaism. Salvation, Jesus said is from the Jews, not Islam.

Free will is why these things happen.

Well at least we agree on that.

Sorry, I do not know anything about that. Are you saying that the promises of Abraham were to be fulfilled through Isaac rather than Ishmael?[/QUOTE]

That is what the Hebrew scriptures teach.
 

dybmh

דניאל יוסף בן מאיר הירש
...but what about New Zealand?
If I understand the context, you are speaking about the Terrorist? How is this Terrorist included in Love For All / Hate for None?

When people insist on harming others, I think that is an extreme case. Most people do not insist on harming others using violence. Because I believe that all of creation is connected, when someone harms others, I believe that they are also harming themselves. Love For All in this case, directed at the person who is insisting on violence, would be containment and isolation.
 

Kangaroo Feathers

Yea, it is written in the Book of Cyril...
If I understand the context, you are speaking about the Terrorist? How is this Terrorist included in Love For All / Hate for None?

When people insist on harming others, I think that is an extreme case. Most people do not insist on harming others using violence. Because I believe that all of creation is connected, when someone harms others, I believe that they are also harming themselves. Love For All in this case, directed at the person who is insisting on violence, would be containment and isolation.
No, I was talking about New Zealand the alleged country.
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
I think you nailed it, Vinayaka.

Love for One is natural for almost any person. Either loving themselves or loving their preferred god(s) and/or prophet(s).

Love for all, begins with wanting to nurture someone else in harmony with that other person's priorities and preferences. And that takes wisdom and individual attention. You said it so well.

If you take a look at my offer to Tony, it was sincere. I am offering to help him, because I do think he is a good person.

But it is also an example of what I think "love for all" looks like in action.

It is a desire to nurture ( "if I can help you, I am at your service" ) that is in harmony with the other person's priorities and preferences ( "It really has nothing to do with what your purpose is. I may or may not agree with it at all." )

It is , as you said, individualized ( "If you want to discuss it further, I am happy to do so. Please send me a PM." ) And I didn't send quotes which may have been counter-productive. This was my attempt at wisdom.

I am offering assistance, but I am not pushing it on him. I am not trying to change him. I am trying to offer help in the form of intellectual, emotional, spiritual support only if it is harmonious with Tony's priorities and preferences. But if it is not wanted, I will try not to be pushy. Emphasis on **try**. Like I said. I am very new to this.

That is my version of Love for All demonstrated in my offer to help Tony including the elements you spoke about. I thank you.

I understand why you want to help, but it's like leading a horse to water. Personally, I'm in no position to help anyone. If some kind of behaviour changes through long discussions, fine, but it's like being married to an abusive alcoholic. Just how long does one wait before filing for divorce?
 
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Kangaroo Feathers

Yea, it is written in the Book of Cyril...
I'm not sure how to respond. Instead of taking another guess, would you please provide more context on this specific perspective?
Well, when you call on people to love not hate everyone, obviously you didn't mean New Zealand. I mean, clearly that's just a given.
 

dybmh

דניאל יוסף בן מאיר הירש
Well, when you call on people to love not hate everyone, obviously you didn't mean New Zealand. I mean, clearly that's just a given.
I like the Maori. They're adorable. :p ( The tongue-out is intended to be a Maori reference; but I'm also being silly because they are fierce. Super nice, until they're not.)
 

Road Warrior

Seeking the middle path..
We do actually...its part of exposing the fake Christianity that people have been led to believe is the real thing, whilst we try to promote the true teachings of Jesus Christ. Most people are gob-smacked when they find out what Jesus actually taught.....and what he didn't.

Those who accept that kind of Christianity are looking to travel the easy road. (Matthew 7:13-14)
Chuck a few dollars at a man on TV who tells you that this is all God requires and bingo! Instant Christians! :facepalm:
Who is "we"? Obviously there aren't enough of you.
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
Who is "we"? Obviously there aren't enough of you.

Eight and a half million of us in every nation on earth.....Christians who abandoned Christendom over 100 years ago. :) We are getting the job done, one precious soul at a time.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Jesus' birth was by the power of holy spirit and God produced a biological son through a process that we could probably never understand with our present knowledge.
God cannot have a biological son because God is not a man. It’s that simple.

“More specifically, what does the original author mean by “only begotten?” Of course, the original author didn’t write in English; he wrote in Greek. The single Greek word translated “only begotten” is monogenes. Ancient writers often used this adjective to describe a child’s unique relationship with their parent. Moreover, the emphasis was on the specific relationship, not the physical begetting itself. In fact, monogenes is better understood to describe a relationship as “one-of-a-kind” or “unique.” This is exactly how the biblical writers would have understood the word.

Likewise, Jesus is God’s unique, one-of-a-kind Son. You can call him the “only begotten” Son if you like, but remember, this word isn’t about procreation. It’s about a unique relationship between the Father and Son.”
What Does It Mean That Jesus Is God’s Only Begotten Son?
He said, not "a" son of God but "the" son of God. The only one who was a direct creation of his Father...."the firstborn of all creation" (Colossians 1:15-17) who was the agency through whom all things were created.
Jesus was not the agency through which all things were created, God was the agency through which all things were created. I do not consider anything Paul wrote to be “the Gospel Truth.”
If this is what you believe then you have no understanding of the words "soul" and "spirit" in the Hebrew language.
Jesus was a spirit, in the same form as his Father.....the same form that all spirit beings have, but Jesus became a soul, just as Adam became a soul, when he started breathing.
I believe that Jesus already had a soul when He was in spirit form, in heaven, but when He was born into this world, His soul became associated with His body.
The word "soul" never applies to a disembodied spirit.It is always a living, breathing creature, both animal and human.
I already know what it says in the Old Testament about the soul being “the breath of life,” so when the body dies, most Christians believe that the soul also dies, so why do you think Jesus said the following?

Matthew 16:24-26 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?

Why would it matter if we lost our soul if it was not eternal?

The soul animates the body and gives it life, but it is not a Baha’i belief that the soul is only the breath of life and that the soul dies when the body dies. Baha’u’llah wrote that the nature of the soul is a mystery of God, but Baha’u’llah and Abdu'l-Baha wrote extensively about the function of the soul. My encapsulated description of the soul and its function is as follows:

The body is just a vehicle that carries the soul around while we are alive on earth, a place to house the soul. The soul is our self, the sum total of the personality, the person himself; the physical body is pure matter with no real identity. The person, after he dies and leaves his physical body behind, goes to the spiritual world where the soul takes on a spiritual body made up of heavenly elements that exist in the spiritual realm. Since all we have ever experienced is physical, it is impossible for us to understand what it is like to be a spiritual being rather than a physical body.

“The nature of the soul after death can never be described, nor is it meet and permissible to reveal its whole character to the eyes of men.........
The world beyond is as different from this world as this world is different from that of the child while still in the womb of its mother. When the soul attaineth the Presence of God, it will assume the form that best befitteth its immortality and is worthy of its celestial habitation.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 156-157
You believe that "the spirit of the truth" was Baha’u’llah? Why? Because he said so?
I believe it not only because He claimed to be, but because it makes perfect sense given what is written in John, 14, 15 and 16 referring to the Comforter and the Spirit of truth.
The "paraclete" (helper) was God's holy spirit, which was poured out on Jesus' disciples at Pentecost.

Among those "many things" that his disciples could not bear up until that time, had to do with the spiritual nature of the Kingdom and their role in it. At Pentecost, the holy spirit anointed those disciples for life in heaven. Something that they did not really understand until then. The "helper" imparted that knowledge long before your prophet was even born....over 1800 years in fact.
That the Comforter is the Holy Spirit that was sent at Pentecost is one of the biggest misconceptions that Christians have. There is nothing in the account of Pentecost to suggest that the Truth was divulged at Pentecost in its fullness and that now nothing remains to be revealed.

The Holy Spirit is the Bounty of God which is the Comforter/Spirit of truth because it comforts people and brings them the truth. God sent the Holy Spirit (Bounty of God) to Baha’u’llah and then Baha’u’llah brought the Holy Spirit (Bounty of God) to humanity. That is why Baha’u’llah has been referred to as the Comforter/Spirit of truth.

The Church misled Christians into believing that the Comforter and Spirit of truth are the Holy Spirit that Jesus sent to live inside of them, but anyone who thinks can figure out that a spirit living inside of people cannot DO any John 14, 15 and 16; only a man could do those things:

  • Teach you all things
  • Call to remembrance what Jesus said
  • Testify of Jesus
  • Glorify Jesus, receive of Jesus, and shew it unto you
  • Guide you into all truth
  • Speak what He hears and shew you things to come
  • Reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment
Obviously, Jesus was referring to a man who would bring the Holy Spirit, not the disembodied Holy Spirit. Baha’u’llah did all these things and as a result of His revelation the world will be reproved the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment. No spirit living inside of Christians is going to do this.

John 16:14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

John 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:

Referring to Jesus as the Son of Man, Baha’u’llah glorified Jesus and testified of Jesus in His Writings:
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 86

Its called prophesy.....we are told who and what to expect in the future....there is no mention of any prophet after Christ. There was no need for one. Christ's teachings are contained in one book...the Revelation says no one is to add to it.
Muhammad, the Bab and Baha’u’llah were all prophesied in the Bible... For example:

“The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.” (Rev. 11:14) The first woe is the appearance of the Prophet, Muhammad, the son of ‘Abdu’lláh—peace be upon Him! The second woe is that of the Báb—to Him be glory and praise! The third woe is the great day of the manifestation of the Lord of Hosts and the radiance of the Beauty of the Promised One. The explanation of this subject, woe, is mentioned in the thirtieth chapter of Ezekiel, where it is said: “The word of the Lord came again unto me, saying, Son of man, prophesy and say, Thus saith the Lord God; Howl ye, Woe worth the day! For the day is near, even the day of the Lord is near.” (Ez. 30:1-3)

Therefore, it is certain that the day of woe is the day of the Lord; for in that day woe is for the neglectful, woe is for the sinners, woe is for the ignorant. That is why it is said, “The second woe is past; behold the third woe cometh quickly!” This third woe is the day of the manifestation of Bahá’u’lláh, the day of God; and it is near to the day of the appearance of the Báb.

“And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of His Christ; and He shall reign for ever and ever.” (Rev. 11:15).”

The seventh angel is a man qualified with heavenly attributes, who will arise with heavenly qualities and character. Voices will be raised, so that the appearance of the Divine Manifestation will be proclaimed and diffused. In the day of the manifestation of the Lord of Hosts, and at the epoch of the divine cycle of the Omnipotent which is promised and mentioned in all the books and writings of the Prophets—in that day of God, the Spiritual and Divine Kingdom will be established, and the world will be renewed; a new spirit will be breathed into the body of creation; the season of the divine spring will come; the clouds of mercy will rain; the sun of reality will shine; the life-giving breeze will blow; the world of humanity will wear a new garment; the surface of the earth will be a sublime paradise; mankind will be educated; wars, disputes, quarrels and malignity will disappear; and truthfulness, righteousness, peace and the worship of God will appear; union, love and brotherhood will surround the world; and God will rule for evermore—meaning that the Spiritual and Everlasting Kingdom will be established. Such is the day of God. For all the days which have come and gone were the days of Abraham, Moses and Christ, or of the other Prophets; but this day is the day of God, for the Sun of Reality will arise in it with the utmost warmth and splendor.”

Some Answered Questions, pp. 56-57

From: 11: COMMENTARY ON THE ELEVENTH CHAPTER OF THE REVELATION OF ST. JOHN

There are also many prophecies in the OT about a Messiah and what He would do, and Jesus did not do all of those things so He cannot be that Messiah the Jews were waiting for.
 
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Kangaroo Feathers

Yea, it is written in the Book of Cyril...
I like the Maori. They're adorable. :p ( The tongue-out is intended to be a Maori reference; but I'm also being silly because they are fierce. Super nice, until they're not.)
Maori people are fine. I'm talking about New Zealanders.
 
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