If you think that homeless shelters are businesses, I don't know what planet you're from.
Tom
-
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:- Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
- Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
- Access to private conversations with other members.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
Should Women's Homeless Shelters Ban Trans Identified Males?
- Thread starter The Reverend Bob
- Start date
Tom
ImmortalFlame
Woke gremlin
So you have no idea about the difference between biological sex and gender?
That's like saying "aside from the fact that this is a structure built of bricks with four walls, a floor and a ceiling, it isn't a building".
Actually, there really isn't. This is literally the way bathrooms have always operated. They don't have "genital scanners" to check the genitals of everyone who comes in.
And why not? What studies or actual concrete evidence can you give of the harm caused by admitting pre-op trans people into shelters?
Except that "guy" is actually a woman, and is also coming to seek shelter and protection from having been abused.
And you have yet to provide a single justification for this position.
Koldo
Outstanding Member
Either you completely misunderstood it or I did it. Because what I understood is that shelters will be able to decide who is a woman and who is not. It has nothing to do with forbidding them from accepting transgender. If anything, it gives more power to shelter operators, not less.
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
I know, and in most cases there would not be a problem. But what is to be done with the rare case where women cannot take the presence of any genetic male? I think that in most cases it would be far better if women's shelters took in trans-females too. But at times a bit of flexibility might be desirable.
ImmortalFlame
Woke gremlin
Ah, I was misled by the thread title and poll question.
I've thought more about it weighing everything and seeing other peoples opinions on the matter.
And I've officially changed my vote from not sure/undecided to trans women shouldn't be banned from womens shelters, because it's the right decision to make.
The main concern I had was "What if a predator pretended to be trans in order to obtain admission to the shelter." Well after reflecting on that for a bit I realized. It's a shelter, with many women there. If a predator pretending to be trans got in, and tried to do something. The other women in the room would help, and stop the assault from happening. While that is not 100% safe, it is as close as we can get without discrimination, and without endangering innocent lives (trans included).
And I've officially changed my vote from not sure/undecided to trans women shouldn't be banned from womens shelters, because it's the right decision to make.
The main concern I had was "What if a predator pretended to be trans in order to obtain admission to the shelter." Well after reflecting on that for a bit I realized. It's a shelter, with many women there. If a predator pretending to be trans got in, and tried to do something. The other women in the room would help, and stop the assault from happening. While that is not 100% safe, it is as close as we can get without discrimination, and without endangering innocent lives (trans included).
Kangaroo Feathers
Yea, it is written in the Book of Cyril...
You don't think "the guy who just SAYS 'but I'm a woman!'" sometimes end up seeking shelter and protection from men who have abused them? Is their need somehow less?
How about we let the staff of the shelter decide who to let in and who to keep out?
This whole thing is about requiring staff of homeless shelters to do things they don't think is a good idea. Maybe they know more about the situation than you and your SJW buddies do?
Tom
*eyeroll again* neverminding that privately owned homeless shelters and state subsidized landlords who operate homeless shelters for money are both things that exist Homeless shelters prove profitable
That you chose to focus on that instead of the actual point tells me that we're done here.
I can well understand why you'd prefer to avoid the discussion.
Have a nice day.
Tom
What does "take the presence of a genetic male" even mean? And why would this not the case for transwomen? Or a cis woman with another woman? It just seems like transwomen are being unfairly singled out.
Back at you, on both statements.
For sure the staff discernment should always be in play.
But you can't have a rule explicitly saying trans woman are banned entirely.
And SJWs are not always wrong about everything. They do tend to be wrong about a lot, mind you
, but they are right on some issues. That's why its important to listen to the opposition. Not only to understand their arguments better, so that you can better counter those arguments, but hell, you might agree with em every once in awhile.Hell I even been watching Contrapoints lately on YT. She's a trans female communist intellectual. While I disagree with her on 99% of everything she says, she makes some good points, let's me see how my opposition views my positions from their POV, and she's entertaining. Very dramatic ole Contrapoints she is, good entertainment.
She reminds me of a mutual friend of ours here on RF Tom (not gonna out her you know who).
Last edited:
dianaiad
Well-Known Member
It's about the women who come to shelters who are afraid of men, for good reason. Men lie. Men who are stalkers lie. It would not be a bit difficult for a man to come to a shelter and SAY 'but "i'm a woman!" and gain entrance for the purpose of coming after someone.
Is this a little 'out of the realm of possibility?" Not really. Women who must resort to such shelters are dealing with men who will do just about anything.
So...a man who cannot prove that he is properly diagnosed and on a treatment plan to change his physical gender would be, were I in charge, told no. when he can come with the paperwork, ok, but based only on his word?
No.
dianaiad
Well-Known Member
It's sad. However, it's not THAT hard to get properly diagnosed and get on the hormones.
The staff discernment should be the bottom line.
That's what this is all about. People trying to tell the staff of a homeless shelter who they are required to admit.
I don't think that is a good idea. The issues that they have to deal with are huge, and I think it best to let them decide without outsiders telling them what to do.
Tom
Stanyon
WWMRD?
In a perfect world everyone would have a safe place to go but reality dictates that someone has to pay the light bill, property taxes, maintain equipment and clean, counseling services, administration etc. Considering all this vs. the very small amount of people it might actually serve, is it worth it and who will pay the bill in the meantime?
Would some local churches, mosques, synagogues, temples etc. oppose helping on religious grounds?
Would some local churches, mosques, synagogues, temples etc. oppose helping on religious grounds?
Father Heathen
Veteran Member
People always talk about MtF but never FtM. I imagine women would have an even bigger flipout over transmales entering women's shelters or restrooms despite having been born female.
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
Pretty straightforward. It obviously includes both cis males and trans females. And no, trans women are neither not being singled out. This is a problem that we do not have all of the answers to yet. A dogmatic approach from either extreme is not the answer.
Kangaroo Feathers
Yea, it is written in the Book of Cyril...
... what does that have to do with people in legitimate need of shelter fleeing abuse?