Spartan
Well-Known Member
You know, it's really sad to flippantly categorize Bible scholars as liars.
-
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:- Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
- Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
- Access to private conversations with other members.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
Luke the careful historian tells it like it is
- Thread starter whirlingmerc
- Start date
You know, it's really sad to flippantly categorize Bible scholars as liars.
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
No, it is not. Caesar's activities were well documented by contemporary historians. There are no contemporary writings of Jesus. All that you have is hearsay. What is stupid is believing the myth without valid evidence.
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
Then why do you do that? As I pointed out, there are ways to see if a source simply lies for Jesus or not. You tend to believe even those that lie for your beliefs.
sooda
Veteran Member
How Did the Apostle Luke Die? | Reference.com
World Viewdid-apostle-luke-die-253b93dbd41378c3
Biblical scholars disagree about the circumstances of Saint Luke's death. Most Catholic scholars contend that he either died at the age of 84 in Greece, while many Orthodox scholars assert that he was martyred after the death of Saint Paul. Keep Learning.
how did matthew mark luke & john die?? | Yahoo Answers
https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080630233619AAuVvXS
Jun 29, 2008 · Luke: Neither the Bible nor Eusebius discuss the death of Luke. The Book of the Acts of the Apostles in the New Testament, written by Luke, ends abruptly with the arrest of Paul and his journey to Roman. I infer that Luke, like Paul, died in the persecutions of Nero around 68 AD.
Riders
Well-Known Member
Except that many scriptures and original words were left out of original texts which makes it not perfect word of God.
There is no perfection about the so called, 'word of god'!
Riders
Well-Known Member
Strange sense the Bible says he was going to come back at that time before that generation was over.
That is exactly what happened when Christ came the first time.
Luke 3:4-6
As it is written in the book of the words of Esaias the prophet, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.
Every valley shall be filled, and every mountain and hill shall be brought low; and the crooked shall be made straight, and the rough ways shall be made smooth;
And all flesh shall see the salvation of God.
Funny that, Jesus still hasn't put in an appearance.
sealchan
Well-Known Member
The author of Luke appears to be writing to an individual. Was this an employer?
Luke notes that many have written...what have they written? Competing gospels/biographies of Jesus?
Luke appears to offer relative certainly with respect to the accounts of others. What technique or methodology does he use to accomplish this? How is Lukes' accounts superior to the other known earlier accounts?
Last edited:
BilliardsBall
Veteran Member
Classical scholar and historian Colin Hemer chronicles Luke’s accuracy in the book of Acts verse by verse. With painstaking detail, Hemer identifies 84 facts in the last 16 chapters of Acts that have been confirmed by historical and archaeological research.1 As you read the following list, keep in mind that Luke did not have access to modern-day maps or nautical charts. Luke accurately records:
1. the natural crossing between correctly named ports (Acts 13:4-5)
2. the proper port (Perga) along the direct destination of a ship crossing from Cyprus (13:13)
3. the proper location of Lycaonia (14:6)
4. the unusual but correct declension of the name Lystra (14:6)
5. the correct language spoken in Lystra—Lycaonian (14:11)
6. two gods known to be so associated—Zeus and Hermes (14:12)
7. the proper port, Attalia, which returning travelers would use (14:25)
8. the correct order of approach to Derbe and then Lystra from the Cilician Gates (16:1; cf. 15:41)
9. the proper form of the name Troas (16:8)
10. the place of a conspicuous sailors’ landmark, Samothrace (16:11)
11. the proper description of Philippi as a Roman colony (16:12)
12. the right location for the river (Gangites) near Philippi (16:13)
13. the proper association of Thyatira as a center of dyeing (16:14)
14. correct designations for the magistrates of the colony (16:22)
15. the proper locations (Amphipolis and Apollonia) where travelers would spend successive nights on this journey (17:1)
16. the presence of a synagogue in Thessalonica (17:1)
17. the proper term (“politarchs”) used of the magistrates there (17:6)
18. the correct implication that sea travel is the most convenient way of reaching Athens, with the favoring east winds of summer sailing (17:14-15)
19. the abundant presence of images in Athens (17:16)
20. the reference to a synagogue in Athens (17:17)
21. the depiction of the Athenian life of philosophical debate in the Agora (17:17)
22. the use of the correct Athenian slang word for Paul (sper-mologos, 17:18) as well as for the court (Areios pagos, 17:19)
23. the proper characterization of the Athenian character (17:21)
24. an altar to an “unknown god” (17:23)
25. the proper reaction of Greek philosophers, who denied the bodily resurrection (17:32)
26. Areopagites as the correct title for a member of the court (17:34)
27. a Corinthian synagogue (18:4)
28. the correct designation of Gallio as proconsul, resident in Corinth (18:12)
29. the bema (judgment seat), which overlooks Corinth’s forum (18:16ff.)
30. the name Tyrannus as attested from Ephesus in first-century inscriptions (19:9)
31. well-known shrines and images of Artemis (19:24)
32. the well-attested “great goddess Artemis” (19:27)
33. that the Ephesian theater was the meeting place of the city (19:29)
34. the correct title grammateus for the chief executive magistrate in Ephesus (19:35)
35. the proper title of honor neokoros, authorized by the Romans (19:35)
36. the correct name to designate the goddess (19:37)
37. the proper term for those holding court (19:38)
38. use of plural anthupatoi, perhaps a remarkable reference to the fact that two men were conjointly exercising the functions of proconsul at this time (19:38)
39. the “regular” assembly, as the precise phrase is attested elsewhere (19:39)
40. use of precise ethnic designation, beroiaios (20:4)
41. employment of the ethnic term Asianos (20:4)
42. the implied recognition of the strategic importance assigned to this city of Troas (20:7ff.)
43. the danger of the coastal trip in this location (20:13) 44. the correct sequence of places (20:14-15)
45. the correct name of the city as a neuter plural (Patara) (21:1)
46. the appropriate route passing across the open sea south of Cyprus favored by persistent northwest winds (21:3)
47. the suitable distance between these cities (21:8)
48. a characteristically Jewish act of piety (21:24)
49. the Jewish law regarding Gentile use of the temple area (21:28) (Archaeological discoveries and quotations from Josephus confirm that Gentiles could be executed for entering the temple area. One inscription reads: “Let no Gentile enter within the balustrade and enclosure surrounding the sanctuary. Whoever is caught will be personally responsible for his consequent death.”2
50. the permanent stationing of a Roman cohort (chiliarch) at Antonia to suppress any disturbance at festival times (21:31)
51. the flight of steps used by the guards (21:31, 35)
52. the common way to obtain Roman citizenship at this time (22:28)
53. the tribune being impressed with Roman rather than Tarsian citizenship (22:29)
54. Ananias being high priest at this time (23:2)
55. Felix being governor at this time (23:34)
56. the natural stopping point on the way to Caesarea (23:31)
57. whose jurisdiction Cilicia was in at the time (23:34)
58. the provincial penal procedure of the time (24:1-9)
59. the name Porcius Festus, which agrees precisely with that given by Josephus (24:27)
60. the right of appeal for Roman citizens (25:11)
61. the correct legal formula (25:18)
62. the characteristic form of reference to the emperor at the time (25:26)
63. the best shipping lanes at the time (27:5)
64. the common bonding of Cilicia and Pamphylia (27:4)
65. the principal port to find a ship sailing to Italy (27:5-6)
66. the slow passage to Cnidus, in the face of the typical northwest wind (27:7)
67. the right route to sail, in view of the winds (27:7)
68. the locations of Fair Havens and the neighboring site of Lasea (27:8)
69. Fair Havens as a poorly sheltered roadstead (27:12)
70. a noted tendency of a south wind in these climes to back suddenly to a violent northeaster, the well-known gregale (27:13)
71. the nature of a square-rigged ancient ship, having no option but to be driven before a gale (27:15)
72. the precise place and name of this island (27:16)
73. the appropriate maneuvers for the safety of the ship in its particular plight (27:16)
74. the fourteenth night—a remarkable calculation, based inevitably on a compounding of estimates and probabilities, confirmed in the judgment of experienced Mediterranean navigators (27:27)
75. the proper term of the time for the Adriatic (27:27)
76. the precise term (Bolisantes) for taking soundings, and the correct depth of the water near Malta (27:28)
77. a position that suits the probable line of approach of a ship released to run before an easterly wind (27:39)
78. the severe liability on guards who permitted a prisoner to escape (27:42)
79. the local people and superstitions of the day (28:4-6)
80. the proper title protos tÓs nÓsou (28:7)
81. Rhegium as a refuge to await a southerly wind to carry them through the strait (28:13)
82. Appii Forum and Tres Tabernae as correctly placed stopping places on the Appian Way (28:15)
83. appropriate means of custody with Roman soldiers (28:16)
84. the conditions of imprisonment, living “at his own expense” (8:30-31)
Is there any doubt that Luke was an eyewitness to these events or at least had access to reliable eyewitness testimony? What more could he have done to prove his authenticity as a historian?
Source: https://www.amazon.com/Dont-Have-Enough-Faith-Atheist/dp/1581345615
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
Yes, the author of Luke was a careful geometer. He was not a careful historian as shown by his Nativity of Christ.
For the life of me I cannot understand how Christians conflate geometry and history.
Spartan
Well-Known Member
It's more complicated than that.
Skeptic: "At Matthew 16:28, Jesus tells his disciples: “There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.” The people who were standing there all died eventually, and they never saw Jesus return to establish a kingdom."
Response:
Mark 9:1 notes, "Until they have seen the kingdom of God come with power;"
First, what is the Kingdom of God? Romans 14:17 answers that: "For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, but of righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit."
It is also Jesus being seen in a Kingdom appearance (more on that later).
When did it come with power? In Acts 1:8: “But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth.”
So, the power would come by virtue of the Holy Spirit. When did that happen?
It (the power) happened in Acts chapter two, verses 1-4: "When the day of Pentecost came, they were all together in one place. Suddenly a sound like the blowing of a violent wind came from heaven and filled the whole house where they were sitting. They saw what seemed to be tongues of fire that separated and came to rest on each of them. All of them were filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit enabled them."
After that, Act 5:12 notes the miracles and power of the disciples: "And by the hands of the apostles were many signs and wonders wrought among the people."
But when did some of the disciples see Jesus coming in his kingdom?
"It is that Jesus’ Transfiguration occurs next in the synoptists’ accounts (Mt 17.1-8; Mk 9.2-8; Lk 9.28-36a). Jesus took Peter, James, and John “up a high mountain by themselves. And he was transfigured before them, and his face shone like the sun, and his clothes became dazzling white. Suddenly there appeared to them Moses and Elijah, talking with him” (Mt 17.1-3). From a literary perspective, it seems pretty obvious that all three synoptists intended for their readers to understand that Jesus referred to his upcoming Transfiguration when he said some disciples would see him coming in his kingdom before they die."
Did Jesus’ Disciples See “the Son of Man Coming in his Kingdom”? Top of Form
Cheers...
Spartan
Well-Known Member
Perhaps not perfect, but it's been reported that none of that changes the resurrection or any other important doctrine. Many of those doctrines, like righteousness, are covered elsewhere in the Bible. I've often said the preponderance of the evidence supports the traditional accounts of the Bible / New Testament.
Spartan
Well-Known Member
I think you're mistaken. Provide your best ONE example about Luke's nativity that's been proven wrong. Cite the scripture number and your claim.
nPeace
Veteran Member
Hey, I love that guy's videos. A real detective style analysis.
oldbadger
Skanky Old Mongrel!
How did Luke know that the testimony was 'eyewitness' truth?
And in Luke's reckoning, what year was Jesus born in?
Audie
Veteran Member
I noticed a bit of editorializing in your headline.
Audie
Veteran Member
What year did he die? Where? One of them good
historians we hear about would be sure to get those
details;