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How do we know Krishna, Buddha or Moses existed?

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
That can be seen in the opposite way, as a Baha'i has faith that another Avatar has arisen. Baha'u'llah, an Avatar, as promised, has said we would find if we looked.

We can also consider millions of Jews still do not see Christ nor Muhammad in their scriptures, likewise Christians do not see Muhammad in the Bible and the Muslims do not see Baha'u'llah in the Quran.

Yet the Faiths are practiced.

Thus we will or we will not look, the choice is ours.

Regards Tony
I have no problem with someone being 1 in a million that believes in something. It's a free world, after all. I totally accept the right to believe whatever you want to. That's the core to why many people don't proselytize. Proselytizers, OTOH, believe it is right, even duty, to 'correct' everyone else.

Very different paradigms.
 

ManSinha

Well-Known Member
I remember in a 10000 + thread offering to explore other meanings of popular held beliefs and passages from all scriptures, using the keys given by Baha'u'llah, @InvestigateTruth has also posted threads to initiate this.

@Tony Bristow-Stagg - the reasons that a secular humanist is what she is - common themes of kindness to the fellow man and worship of the divine and charity - will be common since these are aspirational virtues. I had posted earlier an example of the exact same quotations from Matthew 6:26 and lines from the SGGS - so what - are you now going to plead that Christianity and Sikhism are similar? Those sorts of coincidences are common - there was an entire discussion of "daswandh" ; "tithe" and "zakat" and @sooda pointed out that the concept of charity was encouraged and even enforced by Babylonian kings at the dawn of recorded history in the middle east.

Whereas Bahai'ism has 7.5 million adherents is fine - but please - do not try to make it out to be "the latest and greatest" - it simply is not - there are way too many flaws and IMHO too close a relationship to Islam for there to be anything "new" about it. The sooner you accept that Baha'ism is one more in a buffet on offer for the informed citizen to choose from - rather than the hard sell which I see you and @InvestigateTruth driving towards - I suppose the easier it will be for individuals like myself to partner with rather debate against you

Or can you not let go the proselytizing as part of an Abrahamic faith?

Proselytizers, OTOH, believe it is right, even duty, to 'correct' everyone else

There you go - similar thoughts posted almost simultaneously - there was a video posted in the Atheist DIR but @SomeRandom that showed a loud American missionary being told politely and not so politely to "shut up" in Australia - precisely because he thought he was trying to save them.

:facepalm:
 

siti

Well-Known Member
Could a billion followers be wrong?
Er...yes I suppose they could...

article-2212318-1553B78E000005DC-797_634x376.jpg
 

Jim

Nets of Wonder
@CG Didymus I'm having second thoughts now. I've written a lot in these forums about other Baha'i Faiths besides the ones you're complaining about. I'm wondering now why you've ignored all that, and you would rather spend all your time complaining about the ones you hate. Don't play with my heart.
 

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
Also, in some places Abdu'l-Baha seems to be saying that Confucius was a prophet, but a letter written on behalf of Shoghi Effendi says that he was not a prophet. (Buddha, Krishna, Zoroaster and Related Subjects)
Quite confusing. Baha'u'llah did not mention any of them, and Abdu'l-Baha and Shoghi Effendi have differing views. A dilemma for Bahai's. Why God or his prophets/sons/messengers/manifestations/mahdis are not clear about anything?
Baha'u'llah, an Avatar, as promised, has said we would find if we looked.
Hinduism is clear about the next avatara. It will come 425,000 years from now. If Bahaullah is an avatara, it is for you and not for us. :)
 
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TransmutingSoul

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Hinduism is clear about the next avatara. It will come 425,000 years from now. If Bahaullah is an avatara, it is for you and not for us. :)

That is the choice before us.

In each Revelation of God, these words are indeed the truth;

"...Behold, how, as soon as I revealed Myself, ye have rejected My truth and turned away from Me, and been of them that have regarded the signs of God as a play and pastime!..."

Regards Tony
 

TransmutingSoul

Veteran Member
Premium Member
What signs, brother? That is what I have been looking for in my 76 years. :D

The Bible tells you how;

"Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: 8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened."

At 76, one may have to speed up the search..... :D;)

The heart holds the keys.

Regards Tony
 

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
I have been searching vigorously all the time, what I find only negates it. Whether it is creation of the universe or evolution of humans. :D
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
Whereas Bahai'ism has 7.5 million adherents is fine - but please -

:facepalm:

That figure (or around 6 million) is the official Baha'i figure and many think it's quite exaggerated. In India, for example, the claim is 2 million, but the official government census is about 14 000. It includes anyone who ever signed a card, so somebody who just stops practicing and didn't send in a resignation letter is also included, and there are lots of those.

Not something unique to Baha'i by any means. Lots of groups tend to exaggerate their numbers just to make newcomers thing they hold more influence in the world than they really do. Personally, in discussions with ex-Baha'i and looking at government census figures, I put it around a million. I went through all this before you joined the forum. They also exaggerate how widespread they are.Two people who live in some small country will accurately be said as that country having Baha'i in it. Influence? Hardly.
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
@CG Didymus I'm having second thoughts now. I've written a lot in these forums about other Baha'i Faiths besides the ones you're complaining about. I'm wondering now why you've ignored all that, and you would rather spend all your time complaining about the ones you hate. Don't play with my heart.

Hate? Really? Putting out counter arguments is hate? If Didymus hates, then so do I.
 

TransmutingSoul

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I have been searching vigorously all the time, what I find only negates it. Whether it is creation of the universe or evolution of humans. :D

That is life I guess, as in all that I see naught but God.

It may be that it is the heart we must put all our search into, this from Baha'u'llah, I find to be a most powerful meditation;

"...O SON OF SPIRIT! My first counsel is this: Possess a pure, kindly and radiant heart, that thine may be a sovereignty ancient, imperishable and everlasting..."

Stay well, stay happy, enjoy all that is :):handok:

Regards Tony
 

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
Hate? Really? Putting out counter arguments is hate? If Didymus hates, then so do I.
I hate to admit it, but I like almost all the Baha'is here on the forum. Jim is way different and much more thoughtful than the rest. But I don't read every single thread and every single post within a thread... and sometimes I don't get to every post for a couple of days or sometimes not at all. But, the best thing I've gotten out of these Baha'i threads is hearing and learning from people like you.

I didn't participate much in your thread about "Infallibility", but I think that is a very important issue. Some Baha'is follow their leaders and their teachings in a way that makes them come off as being the only religion in the world that is right. But then, part of their teachings says to respect and find the things in common with people of all religions. Hey Jim, if you're listening, that's the main thing. If Baha'is want to bring peace and harmony to the world, start by being the unifiers between the arguing and fighting that goes on between people in the different religions.

One of their teachings is something about if religion is the cause of disunity, then we're better off without it. So can Baha'is truly respect and understand you and how you believe? I think they can.
 
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Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
I hate to admit it, but I like almost all the Baha'is here on the forum.

Myself as well. But if you think the beliefs and the person are one and the same, I can see why either of us, and more could be considered as hateful. I used to think mockery was something I couldn't do, but somewhere along the way I read that some beliefs are just so out there they (the beliefs) deserve to be mocked. I reflected on that for awhile. On a so called 'debate' forum, if you put that sort of belief out there, it's your call. Expect mockery. Most certainly expect alternate views, in other words, expect the debate, and what that entails.

But then I'm quite certain I'm on 'ignore' too for a couple of people. It's the anti-Baha'i agenda.
 

Jim

Nets of Wonder
@Vinayaka @CG Didymus I didn't say, or mean, that CG hates Baha'is. What I said was that he would rather spend his time complaining about some Baha'i Faiths that he hates. I agree that "hate" was a poor choice of words. What I meant was, some Baha'i Faiths that he disapproves of.
 

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
".. O SON OF SPIRIT! My first counsel is this: Possess a pure, kindly and radiant heart, .."
Heard it from many (Bahaullah is not the first to say it). I have tried to do that all my life, but still no God, what to talk of prophets/sons/messengers/manifestations/mahdis!

I remember a verse from Saint Tulsi Das in Awadhi language, "Par upadesh kushal bahutere, je acharahin te nar na ghanere."
(Many are adept in advising others, but those who actually act that way are not many).
 
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