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Servant or Slave of God

A

angellous_evangellous

Guest
beckysoup61 said:
I believe I work with God, not the classic Christian idea, but that's mine.

In 1 Thessalonians, Paul writes that Timothy is a co-worker with God.

There's more than a little debate among translators as to the Greek grammar - its a genitive construction - co-worker (of/for/with) God. It's the same construction that is in the beginning of other Pauline letters [prisoner (of/for/with) Christ] and [apostle (of/for/with) Christ].

Many translations have co-worker with God for Timothy in 1 Thess - however we choose to translate it will affect our interpretation of apostleship...

KJV 1 Thessalonians 3:2 And sent Timotheus, our brother, and minister of God, and our

ESV 1 Thessalonians 3:2 and we sent Timothy, our brother and (sunergo.n tou/ qeou)
God's coworker in the gospel of Christ, to establish and exhort you in your faith,


NAS 1 Thessalonians 3:2 and we sent Timothy, our brother and God's fellow worker in the gospel of Christ, to strengthen and encourage you as to your faith,

 

michel

Administrator Emeritus
Staff member
gnostic said:
For me, the whole "servant"-thingie in regarding to religion (i.e. Servant of God), has a whole slavery connotation to it. The "master and servants" is precisely the same as "master and slaves".

I simply find it unsettling to use the word servant to describe our relationship to any divine being, because it is only a little better than using the word slave. I am just as uncomfortable with the whole reward and punishment scenario, or the last judgement business that both Christianity and Islam like to use, mainly because reward and punishment underlies again the master rewarding and punishing a slave relationship.

I find it a far better to describe us as the "Children of God", but not us as "Servants of God". But, of course, we can only use word children if God actually exist.

I am not at all phazed by the term 'servant'; It never ceased to amaze me when people's hackles rise at the merest hint of them 'serving others'. When I was emplotyed, I was a servant to the customers; yet I found many colleagues who resented the idea..........silly people.

Servant of God is fine by me; I want to serve God, in what ever way I can.
 

may

Well-Known Member
Kcnorwood said:
Merciful? Says who? God says he will send people to hell for not follwoing him what kind of father is that? I believe I'll pass. We dont have kids yet but there is NOTHING they could do that I would sent them to a place like that. I'm so glad that your God will send those who he loves to such a place.

How is he so Merciful? The bible is full of rape killing Human Sacrafices & the NT isnt all that great either. You can justify that anyone way you want to. Everyone keeps saying that there is no such thing has hell & God would never send anyone to such a place but then again I dont think they are reading the bible.
i think it is more like those who teach hellfire are reading the bible wrongly with a lack of accurate understanding. hellfire is a manmade doctrine not based on accurate understanding of the bible ,and many have been led astray to believe that it is a bible teaching when it is nothing of the sort.
 

may

Well-Known Member
Who really is the faithful and discreet slave whom his master appointed over his domestics, to give them their food at the proper time? 46 Happy is that slave if his master on arriving finds him doing so. 47 Truly I say to YOU, He will appoint him over all his belongings. matthew 24;45-47 i think Jesus has a slave class that is working in line with Gods purpose ,and because this class of people have remained faithful to their master(Jesus christ) they are being blessed and then they are being given great responsibility and Jesus has given them all his belongings , yes faithfulness to Jesus leads to great blessings.
(Matthew 25:21) His master said to him, ‘Well done, good and faithful slave! You were faithful over a few things. I will appoint you over many things. Enter into the joy of your master.’​


(Luke 12:44) I tell YOU truthfully, He will appoint him over all his belongings.​

(Matthew 13:11) In reply he said: "To YOU it is granted to understand the sacred secrets of the kingdom of the heavens, but to those people it is not granted.........Gods slaves have been blessed to understand the many things in the bible regarding bible prophecies , that are being opened up to them in this the last days. and then in turn great responsibility goes with that understanding to feed the domestics.the domestics are those who listen to the slaves ,and then they can be fed in a spiritual way and it will be food at the proper time .
 

Kcnorwood

Well-Known Member
Slavery is a blessing????
I'll have to admit I think God was into slavery.

Slaves, obey your earthly masters with deep respect and fear. Serve them sincerely as you would serve Christ. (Ephesians 6:5 NLT)

Christians who are slaves should give their masters full respect so that the name of God and his teaching will not be shamed. If your master is a Christian, that is no excuse for being disrespectful. You should work all the harder because you are helping another believer by your efforts. Teach these truths, Timothy, and encourage everyone to obey them. (1 Timothy 6:1-2 NLT)


So is it ok to have slaves? Or did God never hear about equal right?
 

Djamila

Bosnjakinja
I don't like the terminology servant or slave, really. Faith makes these objectives your own, I don't pray because God said to pray - I pray because I want to pray, because it's a part of me, that comes from God. We have free will - and, I believe, it's impossible for a religious person to go through their entire lives living as a servant of God in that sense of the word. They wouldn't last. They are serving themselves as well. I'm sure Mother Theresa wanted the fruits of her labors as much as God did. If she was just some slave, she might have given up - but it was a part of her as well.
 
A

angellous_evangellous

Guest
Kcnorwood said:
Slavery is a blessing????
I'll have to admit I think God was into slavery.

Slaves, obey your earthly masters with deep respect and fear. Serve them sincerely as you would serve Christ. (Ephesians 6:5 NLT)

Christians who are slaves should give their masters full respect so that the name of God and his teaching will not be shamed. If your master is a Christian, that is no excuse for being disrespectful. You should work all the harder because you are helping another believer by your efforts. Teach these truths, Timothy, and encourage everyone to obey them. (1 Timothy 6:1-2 NLT)


So is it ok to have slaves? Or did God never hear about equal right?

If God had revealed equal rights, he may well have been speaking in Japanese. There was no concept of a world without slavery in the Greco-Roman world.

Normally the passages in the NT regarding slavery, marriage, and other household relationships are read as "make the best of what exists now" rather than an endorsement of the existing schema or the divine rule that the ancient household (heterosexual, patriarchal, with slaves) is the eternal way to have a family.

If God had revealed equal rights for everyone - no patriarchy / no slavery / all is peachy - then Christians would be subversive to the Roman culture and Christianity would not have survived.

The household codes (like Ephesians 5.22-6.10) were apologetic, telling everyone that Christians were not social reformers, but sought to live out their religion peacefully within well established social norms.
 

may

Well-Known Member
Kcnorwood said:
Slavery is a blessing????
I'll have to admit I think God was into slavery.

Slaves, obey your earthly masters with deep respect and fear. Serve them sincerely as you would serve Christ. (Ephesians 6:5 NLT)

Christians who are slaves should give their masters full respect so that the name of God and his teaching will not be shamed. If your master is a Christian, that is no excuse for being disrespectful. You should work all the harder because you are helping another believer by your efforts. Teach these truths, Timothy, and encourage everyone to obey them. (1 Timothy 6:1-2 NLT)


So is it ok to have slaves? Or did God never hear about equal right?
back in those days that was how it was, that was how they lived. in this day we would be doing our Jobs right and not being lazy and if we as christians were an employer we would still do the right thing and apply bible princibles .
 

eudaimonia

Fellowship of Reason
michel said:
I am not at all phazed by the term 'servant'; It never ceased to amaze me when people's hackles rise at the merest hint of them 'serving others'. When I was employed, I was a servant to the customers; yet I found many colleagues who resented the idea..........silly people.

Not so silly.

People in business do not "serve customers" in the moral sense of the word "serve" -- they trade with customers or not as they choose as independent equals, and they expect the same amount of respect as anybody else.

I personally think that self-respecting people should resent the idea of being a servant or slave to anyone.


eudaimonia,

Mark
 

ayani

member
eudaimonia said:
I personally think that self-respecting people should resent the idea of being a servant or slave to anyone.

this is tricky ground. there are of course very real political and social situations where people are exploited, forced into work, mistreated by those in power, and abused based upon a master-slave framework.

this should not be confused with an individual's inclination towards spiritual service- serving a community, serving others, serving a social superior- as a way to serving God in the world.
 

michel

Administrator Emeritus
Staff member
eudaimonia said:
Not so silly.

People in business do not "serve customers" in the moral sense of the word "serve" -- they trade with customers or not as they choose as independent equals, and they expect the same amount of respect as anybody else.

I personally think that self-respecting people should resent the idea of being a servant or slave to anyone.


eudaimonia,

Mark
Wow! I never expected to hear such a reaction.

But I think you ought to look at :-http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_service

A civil servant or public servant is a civilian career public sector employee working for a government department or agency. Many consider the study of civil service to be a part of the field of public administration. Further workers in non-departmental public bodies may also be classed as civil servants for the purpose of producing statistics. Examples in this category include some employees of so-called QUANGOs. Collectively they form a nation's Civil Service or Public Service.
 

Kcnorwood

Well-Known Member
may said:
back in those days that was how it was, that was how they lived. in this day we would be doing our Jobs right and not being lazy and if we as christians were an employer we would still do the right thing and apply bible princibles .



How is that supposed to justify slavery? those were the times?? Sounds like you still believe in it.
 

Gentoo

The Feisty Penguin
Kcnorwood said:
How is that supposed to justify slavery? those were the times?? Sounds like you still believe in it.

It doesn't justify anything, she was just saying that as a way to explain what it meant. Times change, slavery was apart of life then just as it is not apart of life now.
 

may

Well-Known Member
Kcnorwood said:
How is that supposed to justify slavery? those were the times?? Sounds like you still believe in it.
i never said i did believe it . but its true that was how it was at that time .
 

may

Well-Known Member
Gentoo said:
It doesn't justify anything, she was just saying that as a way to explain what it meant. Times change, slavery was apart of life then just as it is not apart of life now.
yes that is what i meant.:)
 
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