"Chicago Billboard Urges Catholics to 'Value Children Over Dogma' and Quit Church"

wandering peacefully said:

Iow, fire the top brass who are the bad actors. A local priest within a local church won't last long if they molest their flock.

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A priest at my ex's church was being sued by one of his victims; he continued regular duties right up until the day he died.

We Never Know said:

I'm just adding highlights of the article instead of posting the whole thing. Those interested can go read it.

"National Sexual HealthSurvey (NSHS), a large, comprehensive study of American sexuality based on in-depth interviews in 1996 with a representative sample of 8,400 Americans, age 18 to 88.

Under "other," the NSHS asked: Who? Surprisingly, not one victim mentioned a priest. Most of the abusers in this category were teachers, neighbors, doctors, grandparents, a parent's friend or coworker, or an adult around the house: a gardener, or repairman.

Not a single priest. I emphasize this not to exculpate pedophile priests, but rather to elucidate the reality of this crime. While celibacy and sexual repression may contribute to Catholic priests' risk for pedophilia, child sexual exploitation is most often triggered by proximity to children and the opportunity to exercise authority over them. It's more likely to happen in the child's home than outside it. The perpetrator is most likely to be someone the child and parents know, for younger children, a caregiver, for teens, a social contact.

https://www-psychologytoday-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/all-about-sex/201003/beyond-bad-apple-priests-who-the-pedophiles-really-are?amp_js_v=a2&amp_gsa=1&amp&usqp=mq331AQCCAE=#referrer=https://www.google.com&amp_tf=From %1$s&ampshare=https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/all-about-sex/201003/beyond-bad-apple-priests-who-the-pedophiles-really-are

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Catholic priests are a very very small percentage of the overall population so when asking victims as a group the number of priests that were molesters would also be a very small percentage. The author seems to realize this. Yes, others do molest. But it does appear that priests have a higher rater of offense than the general population does.

Subduction Zone said:

Catholic priests are a very very small percentage of the overall population so when asking victims as a group the number of priests that were molesters would also be a very small percentage. The author seems to realize this. Yes, others do molest. But it does appear that priests have a higher rater of offense than the general population does.

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Is that really an important issue?
Most significant to me is that the Church both allowed &
intended this abuse, & that government was often complicit.

Revoltingest said:

Is that really an important issue?
Most significant to me is that the Church both allowed &
intended this abuse, & that government was often complicit.

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I was responding to a poster that did not understand how stats are done. I agree with your post. The fact that priests are a small part of the population and therefore will have a small percentage of the victims does not excuse what has happened to victims of priests.

Subduction Zone said:

I was responding to a poster that did not understand how stats are done. I agree with your post. The fact that priests are a small part of the population and therefore will have a small percentage of the victims does not excuse what has happened to victims of priests.

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Seems like I wasn't paying adequate attention.
I should never multi-task!

Revoltingest said:

Is that really an important issue?
Most significant to me is that the Church both allowed &
intended this abuse, & that government was often complicit.

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Yep. That's the core of it all.

I used to debate with a Christian that always used, 10,000 out of 1 million Christians doing something is still a lower % than 10 out of a 100 atheist doing it.
I had no choice but to agree because he was right. Then I would add I would rather something bad only happen 10 times than 10,000. He would get mad and go into a rant

We Never Know said:

I used to debate with a Christian that always used, 10,000 out of 1 million Christians doing something is still a lower % than 10 out of a 100 atheist doing it.
I had no choice but to agree because he was right. Then I would add I would rather something bad only happen 10 times than 10,000. He would get mad and go into a rant

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Arithmetic is such a wicked tool.

Augustus said:

So there's no rational reason to believe this, it's just your personal guesswork that Catholic dogma tells priests children are sex toys and to do with them as they please?

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I would think it's obvious that my conclusion was a personal one, and I never said priests felt they could do with them as they wanted. That they likely treated them as sex toys is no different than how non-priests might regard the children.

Any evidence that priests are even more likely to abuse children than other clerics? teachers? care workers? men in general?

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Not that I know of. Of course I never said they did, so I don't know why you're bringing it up (Actually, I do know why you're bringing it up )

It's a disgrace that the church covered up these issues and they should be held to full account for this and prosecuted to the full extent of the law, but any sufficiently random population of men will commit some sex crimes over time. Why should we believe Priests are specifically driven to abuse kids because of Catholic dogma?

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Not "driven" by it, but excused through it.

.

Salvador said:

I'm not talking about sexual abuse of minors who are past puberty, I'm talking about sexual abuse of prepubescent children.

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Why pick out only prepubescent children? Why not pick out those below the age of eight? You'd certainly get an even lower percentage.

So why pick out only prepubescent children? The answer is obvious: picking out only prepubescent children you can present a much lower child abuse figure than the commonly recognized 4%. Talk about disingenuous and deceptive practices.


Go stand in the corner Salvador.

Fine then, let's look at all sex crime offenses as well as the number of legally convicted sex crime offenders and see how well Priests fare compared to the overall general population. There are 747,408 registered sex crime offenders in the U.S. If there are 747,408 registered sex crime offenders, then there are at least 747,408 convicted sex crime offenders in the overall general population of the U.S.

Out of 747,408 Registered Sex Offenders, How Many Are Actually Dangerous?

Out of 423 Christian Priests, who have been convicted of sexual abuse, 150 of them were Catholic Priests.

There are approximately 150 former American Catholic priests, who've been convicted of sex abuse.

Here Are The Details Of 423 Christian Priests Who Have Been Convicted Of Sexual Abuse

There are now approximately 60,000 American Catholic priests. 150 convicted sex abusers out of 60,000 means that approximately only one out of 400 American Catholic Priests (0.25 percent ) are convicted sex crime offenders. According to widely available U.S. Census data, there are approximately 240 million American adults ( age 18 or over ) 747,408 convicted sex abusers out of 240 million means that at least one out of 320 ( 0.31 percent ) of the American adult population are convicted sex crime offenders.

Only approximately 0.25 percent of American Priests are convicted sex crime offenders compared to at least 0.31 percent of the overall American adult population who are convicted sex crime offenders.

So then, when considering all legally defined sex crimes, Priests are still at least 25 percent less likely to be legally found guilty of a sex crime than the likelihood somebody who is a non-Priest is legally found guilty of a sex crime.

9-10ths_Penguin said:

A priest at my ex's church was being sued by one of his victims; he continued regular duties right up until the day he died.

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That is the problem.

9-10ths_Penguin said:

A priest at my ex's church was being sued by one of his victims; he continued regular duties right up until the day he died.

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Yes that's the way it has worked

9-10ths_Penguin said:

A priest at my ex's church was being sued by one of his victims; he continued regular duties right up until the day he died.

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It's disgusting.

My idea was for a revolution. Kick the assigned priests out, dump the whole holy Roman gig and elect their own leaders from within their local churches? Including women priests. I'm sure mass goers could pray together and collect their own plates of money without the help of Rome.


Edit. Omg I am about to give up on being able to post properly!

Father Heathen said:

The people in the middle are enablers by showing up for service and filling the coffers. Oh, and supplying the children.

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Amen brotha

I doubt the billboard will deconvert but i hope these scandals coming to light, 1 right after another does. Just had some tool ask me who am I to condemn someone else’s my morals??? F*cking sickening, the time for these people to stop preying on children has to be now.

Subduction Zone said:

Catholic priests are a very very small percentage of the overall population so when asking victims as a group the number of priests that were molesters would also be a very small percentage. The author seems to realize this. Yes, others do molest. But it does appear that priests have a higher rater of offense than the general population does.

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"But it does appear that priests have a higher rater of offense than the general population does". Support that. You asked for evidence, I gave it. The link I posted agrees priest are the minority in the molesting category. Your opinion is worthless to me.

We Never Know said:

"But it does appear that priests have a higher rater of offense than the general population does". Support that. You asked for evidence, I gave it. The link I posted agrees priest are the minority in the molesting category. Your opinion is worthless to me.

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You didn't. You gave an article that relied upon poor logic. I explained the poor reasoning to you. I on the other hand did give an article that indicated that in Australia at least that it is higher than the average population.

Subduction Zone said:

You didn't. You gave an article that relied upon poor logic. I explained the poor reasoning to you. I on the other hand did give an article that indicated that in Australia at least that it is higher than the average population.

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Ahh. Your normal of "I don't accept it so it's wrong" and I won't support what I claim. What a croc of ****! Go play in the kids play ground. That's where you belong.

Subduction Zone said:

You didn't. You gave an article that relied upon poor logic. I explained the poor reasoning to you. I on the other hand did give an article that indicated that in Australia at least that it is higher than the average population.

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What is the estimated prevalence of sexual abusers of <18s in the general population?

We Never Know said:

Ahh. Your normal of "I don't accept it so it's wrong" and I won't support what I claim. What a croc of ****! Go play in the kids play ground. That's where you belong.

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No, I explained your error. You used a general study. All studies have margins of error. If a subpopulation is very small, as is the population of priests, their stats can be lost in the margin of error. One needs a separate study of that population only. When that was done, again in Australia at least, the stats indicated a rate higher than average for them as a group.

Augustus said:

What is the estimated prevalence of sexual abusers of <18s in the general population?

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Hard to say right now. In bed on a tablet with Bing as a search engine. I will try later today to find what I found earlier.