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Trauma and the Gods

The Hammer

The Hammer

[REDACTED]
Premium Member
I am curious as to everyone's opinions, but in what ways do the Æsir and Vanir offer support)guidance for those who have experienced trauma? From what I know and have read, (albeit limited) of the Gods, they expect us to stand on our own, without assistance.
What guidance and support can one look for in the Æsir and Vanir, while still also following the 9 Noble Virtues?
 
The Kilted Heathen

The Kilted Heathen

Crow FreyjasmaðR
Myself, I don't follow the NNV. I think you answered the question for my part; it's better to pick oneself up, rather than look for a divine shoulder to support on.
 
G

GoodbyeDave

Well-Known Member
It's surely a question of balance. You wouldn't expect your friends and family to do things for you that you could easily do yourself, so you can't expect the gods to be your servants. But what sort of god would ignore a worshiper in a situation where they can't "pick themselves up"?
 
The Hammer

The Hammer

[REDACTED]
Premium Member
DavidMcCann said:
It's surely a question of balance. You wouldn't expect your friends and family to do things for you that you could easily do yourself, so you can't expect the gods to be your servants. But what sort of god would ignore a worshiper in a situation where they can't "pick themselves up"?
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This makes sense, but then where is that line? Between expecting the gods help / Just asking for spiritual support?
 
The Kilted Heathen

The Kilted Heathen

Crow FreyjasmaðR
Verdant Nebulosity said:
NNV?

So one should not ask for support from the Gods at all? Interesting.
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Nine Noble Virtues.

And that's not what I said. I said it's better to pick oneself up, rather than look for a divine hand up. There are obviously situations in which the gods will be of help, or when we must seek their aid. This is, however, the Kingdom of Man; it is our house to manage, not the gods.
 
DanishCrow

DanishCrow

Seeking Feeds
The Nine Noble virtues are far from a universal heathen concept, and was invented by a rather bad heathen in the states in the seventies IIRC.

That said, of course the Gods aid people, also those who suffer mental trauma. Odin is the god of madness among other things, and his draught can cure us as well as drive us mad. Freja is applicable as well, especially in the aspect of Eir, goddess of healing.
 
Hildeburh

Hildeburh

Active Member
Likely to get more than you bargained for if you ask certain Æsir for help, thinking of Odin in particular, the gods have more pressing issues than aiding individuals in their day to day lives. Personally I'd rather sort my own issues out and/or talk to my ancesters and kin for support and guidence.

Thought the NNV had died a natural death.
 
The Hammer

The Hammer

[REDACTED]
Premium Member
Verdant Nebulosity said:
I am curious as to everyone's opinions, but in what ways do the Æsir and Vanir offer support)guidance for those who have experienced trauma? From what I know and have read, (albeit limited) of the Gods, they expect us to stand on our own, without assistance.
What guidance and support can one look for in the Æsir and Vanir, while still also following the 9 Noble Virtues?
Click to expand...

Always remember that the one thing the gods teach us, is they are our friends(kin), and will always stand beside you.

Give them a gift, state your intention, and may the gods gift you in return.
 
The Kilted Heathen

The Kilted Heathen

Crow FreyjasmaðR
Things that can be backed up by either lore or common practice. Either way Crow's right; not all Heathens recognize or utilize the "Nine Noble Virtues", and doing so doesn't make one less of a Heathen.
 
Hildeburh

Hildeburh

Active Member
Cassandra said:
What would you consider universal heathen concepts?
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Votive offerings to wights, feasting on ritual celebrations, ancestor veneration, divination, use of amulets and verbal charms. These things are supported by literature and archeology.
 
Saint Frankenstein

Saint Frankenstein

Wanderer From Afar
Premium Member
Verdant Nebulosity said:
I am curious as to everyone's opinions, but in what ways do the Æsir and Vanir offer support)guidance for those who have experienced trauma? From what I know and have read, (albeit limited) of the Gods, they expect us to stand on our own, without assistance.
What guidance and support can one look for in the Æsir and Vanir, while still also following the 9 Noble Virtues?
Click to expand...
We do not exist in a vacuum. The concept of orlog points to the interconnectedness of all things and beings. I think this macho focus on standing on your own without any help is a modern creation. Humanity would've died out if we all did that. Community was paramount to the ancient peoples of almost the entire world, including the Germanic peoples. There was room for individuality but people had to work together to survive, especially in such harsh environments as far Northern Europe. Sometimes the brave thing to do is to ask for help. As for the gods, I'm not aware of anywhere it is taught in the lore that the gods don't pay attention to humans and completely leave us to our own devices. Otherwise what's the point of all the rites they had beseeching them for assistance? We don't only have the gods to help, but also our ancestors who watch over us and any other friendly spirits. So we are blessed to have many spiritual beings to turn to to help. Who you chose to ask is up to you. But I do believe they care and will respond in their own way if approached respectfully and given gifts of their own.
 
Hildeburh

Hildeburh

Active Member
Saint Frankenstein said:
We do not exist in a vacuum. The concept of orlog points to the interconnectedness of all things and beings. I think this macho focus on standing on your own without any help is a modern creation. Humanity would've died out if we all did that. Community was paramount to the ancient peoples of almost the entire world, including the Germanic peoples. There was room for individuality but people had to work together to survive, especially in such harsh environments as far Northern Europe. Sometimes the brave thing to do is to ask for help. As for the gods, I'm not aware of anywhere it is taught in the lore that the gods don't pay attention to humans and completely leave us to our own devices. Otherwise what's the point of all the rites they had beseeching them for assistance? We don't only have the gods to help, but also our ancestors who watch over us and any other friendly spirits. So we are blessed to have many spiritual beings to turn to to help. Who you chose to ask is up to you. But I do believe they care and will respond in their own way if approached respectfully and given gifts of their own.
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The gods/esses and ancestors were propitiated as well as petitioned. Adverse outcomes from partitioning the gods are attested; as is the cost in terms of sacrifices for gaining favourable outcomes or pledging to the gods.

Pagan deities can be capricious, sometimes you do not get that which you petition for. So my advice is be careful what you ask and who you ask because there may be a steep price to pay.
 
The Kilted Heathen

The Kilted Heathen

Crow FreyjasmaðR
Either you moved this discussion, or... Something. Either way a reply will have to wait until after I get off work.

I would suggest you start a new thread for all this mess, as nothing you're going on about is now applicable to either Pagan music or trauma and the gods.
 
The Hammer

The Hammer

[REDACTED]
Premium Member
Hildeburh said:
The gods/esses and ancestors were propitiated as well as petitioned. Adverse outcomes from partitioning the gods are attested; as is the cost in terms of sacrifices for gaining favourable outcomes or pledging to the gods.

Pagan deities can be capricious, sometimes you do not get that which you petition for. So my advice is be careful what you ask and who you ask because there may be a steep price to pay.
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For having worshipped the Æsir and Vanír for years, I have no idea what steep price you are implying. You speak as if you understand the intentions of the Gods (from stories which are mostly innaccurate). But the gods are Utangard to us (outside the fence of reality).
 
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