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Atheists Pressure MI School District to Stop Treating the Birth of Jesus as Fact

Skwim

Skwim

Veteran Member
Ya just have to shake your head in disbelief at the widespread ignorance, or maybe its their chutzpah in thinking they should be able to get away with it.


"A holiday concert at the Fairview Area Schools in Michigan, scheduled for Tuesday night, won’t treat the birth of Jesus as a historical fact now that atheists have gotten involved.

According to the Freedom From Religion Foundation, the program included songs and spoken narrations that were better suited for a Christmas service at a local church. Here’s just a glimpse at parts of the program:

FairviewConcert1.png

FairviewConcert2.png



Mitch Kahle of the Michigan Association of Civil Rights Activists also noted in an email to the District that this program wasn’t merely some oversight. It was part of a deliberate attempt to inject religion into the concert by music teacher Amy Cobb:

Ms. Cobb has reportedly told students in class that “Jesus is the reason we have Christmas.”… Ms. Cobb also reportedly told students in class that “Jesus is real.”

Since September, MACRA had sent multiple emails to the District noting their concerns (e.g. The Christmas story is a “religious fable, not a historical fact”), but the group didn’t get a response until this past Friday — after FFRF got involved. FFRF sent a more formal letter explaining the constitutional concerns of a holiday concert that is clearly promoting Christianity without mentioning the music teacher’s supposed remarks.

The district finally responded on Friday, saying that the program would be revised. There will no longer be any narration and the explicitly Christian songs will be part of a broader program that includes mostly secular carols. It’s the right move, but it shouldn’t have taken months of letters to make it happen.

There’s also no word yet on whether the teacher will be investigated or reprimanded.
source

.​
 
G

Glaurung

Denizen of Niflheim
If you actually want to be consistent, just abolish all public celebration of Christmas entirely.
 
Last edited:
danieldemol

danieldemol

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Skwim said:
Ya just have to shake your head in disbelief at the widespread ignorance, or maybe its their chutzpah in thinking they should be able to get away with it.


"A holiday concert at the Fairview Area Schools in Michigan, scheduled for Tuesday night, won’t treat the birth of Jesus as a historical fact now that atheists have gotten involved.

According to the Freedom From Religion Foundation, the program included songs and spoken narrations that were better suited for a Christmas service at a local church. Here’s just a glimpse at parts of the program:

FairviewConcert1.png

FairviewConcert2.png



Mitch Kahle of the Michigan Association of Civil Rights Activists also noted in an email to the District that this program wasn’t merely some oversight. It was part of a deliberate attempt to inject religion into the concert by music teacher Amy Cobb:

Ms. Cobb has reportedly told students in class that “Jesus is the reason we have Christmas.”… Ms. Cobb also reportedly told students in class that “Jesus is real.”

Since September, MACRA had sent multiple emails to the District noting their concerns (e.g. The Christmas story is a “religious fable, not a historical fact”), but the group didn’t get a response until this past Friday — after FFRF got involved. FFRF sent a more formal letter explaining the constitutional concerns of a holiday concert that is clearly promoting Christianity without mentioning the music teacher’s supposed remarks.

The district finally responded on Friday, saying that the program would be revised. There will no longer be any narration and the explicitly Christian songs will be part of a broader program that includes mostly secular carols. It’s the right move, but it shouldn’t have taken months of letters to make it happen.

There’s also no word yet on whether the teacher will be investigated or reprimanded.
source

.​
Click to expand...
That’s how messed up the world is, you can be sacked for telling kids Santa is a fake, or censured for telling them Jesus is real. Where is the consistency?
 
Earthling

Earthling

David Henson
The public educational system is not much more than government sponsored propaganda. It's a joke. Some materialistic pagan holiday which existed long before Jesus is the least of their worries.
 
Kenny

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
Skwim said:
Ya just have to shake your head in disbelief at the widespread ignorance, or maybe its their chutzpah in thinking they should be able to get away with it.


"A holiday concert at the Fairview Area Schools in Michigan, scheduled for Tuesday night, won’t treat the birth of Jesus as a historical fact now that atheists have gotten involved.

According to the Freedom From Religion Foundation, the program included songs and spoken narrations that were better suited for a Christmas service at a local church. Here’s just a glimpse at parts of the program:

FairviewConcert1.png

FairviewConcert2.png



Mitch Kahle of the Michigan Association of Civil Rights Activists also noted in an email to the District that this program wasn’t merely some oversight. It was part of a deliberate attempt to inject religion into the concert by music teacher Amy Cobb:

Ms. Cobb has reportedly told students in class that “Jesus is the reason we have Christmas.”… Ms. Cobb also reportedly told students in class that “Jesus is real.”

Since September, MACRA had sent multiple emails to the District noting their concerns (e.g. The Christmas story is a “religious fable, not a historical fact”), but the group didn’t get a response until this past Friday — after FFRF got involved. FFRF sent a more formal letter explaining the constitutional concerns of a holiday concert that is clearly promoting Christianity without mentioning the music teacher’s supposed remarks.

The district finally responded on Friday, saying that the program would be revised. There will no longer be any narration and the explicitly Christian songs will be part of a broader program that includes mostly secular carols. It’s the right move, but it shouldn’t have taken months of letters to make it happen.

There’s also no word yet on whether the teacher will be investigated or reprimanded.
source

.​
Click to expand...
Once again the State religion of Atheistic Secularism is being forced on people.
 
Shiranui117

Shiranui117

Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
Premium Member
Not even the majority of atheists think that Jesus is a myth. Only conspiracy theorists think He never existed. Everyone else just differs on whether or not He is God incarnate.

Also, while Christmas in its origins is a Christian holiday, it looks like America as a whole wants to secularize it. Which, TBH, just change the name of it at this point. Call it something else. Call it Festivus. Because nowadays in its secular celebration it has nothing to do either with Christ or with a Mass--the etymology of "Christmas" in the first place.
 
HonestJoe

HonestJoe

Well-Known Member
Skwim said:
Ya just have to shake your head in disbelief at the widespread ignorance, or maybe its their chutzpah in thinking they should be able to get away with it.
Click to expand...
The response seems like overkill in relation to the concert if the quoted section is an example of the worst offence. The wider context of it all being part of the nativity story should be sufficient to establish the status of the definitive narrative. If any of the kids are stupid enough to think something must be unquestionable true because it’s on stage, they’re lost to rationality anyway. ;)

Some of the alleged comments from the teacher would be more questionable but I find it suspicious that they only come out after the complaint was raised and apparently don’t form any part of it.
 
Windwalker

Windwalker

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Earthling said:
The public educational system is not much more than government sponsored propaganda. It's a joke. Some materialistic pagan holiday which existed long before Jesus is the least of their worries.
Click to expand...
Which is why good Christians seek control of the propaganda in order to spread their version of alternate reality to the minds of Children. It's all good and fine if it's your myth, but not so much so when the message is someone else's. Are you in favor of a Ramadan special for the kids where they tell of the glorious birth of the prophet Mohamed? How about a holiday special celebration of the Baghdad Gita complete with Hare Krishna dancers? No? The word for that then is hypocrisy. Jesus was anti-hypocrisy, not pro-Christian religion.
 
Earthling

Earthling

David Henson
Windwalker said:
Which is why good Christians seek control of the propaganda in order to spread their version of alternate reality to the minds of Children. It's all good and fine if it's your myth, but not so much so when the message is someone else's. Are you in favor of a Ramadan special for the kids where they tell of the glorious birth of the prophet Mohamed? How about a holiday special celebration of the Baghdad Gita complete with Hare Krishna dancers? No? The word for that then is hypocrisy. Jesus was anti-hypocrisy, not pro-Christian religion.
Click to expand...

That's making a pretty big assumption, buddy. I'm totally for separation of church and state, not just for the sake of the state but more for the sake of the "church." I'm against prayer in school, and I don't trust the educational system in this country, the U.S.A., at least, to instruct anyone in any religion.
 
Windwalker

Windwalker

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Earthling said:
That's making a pretty big assumption, buddy. I'm totally for separation of church and state, not just for the sake of the state but more for the sake of the "church." I'm against prayer in school, and I don't trust the educational system in this country, the U.S.A., at least, to instruct anyone in any religion.
Click to expand...
If they are striving to eliminate those like this music teacher's personal religious agenda to promote the Christian myth as history, which you are here saying you oppose as well, then why do you malign them by saying such things as, to quote, "The public educational system is not much more than government sponsored propaganda. It's a joke."?

Aren't they actually doing exactly what you say here you are in favor of, which is not to engage in religious instruction, "buddy"? Are you saying they aren't kicking religion out strongly enough? Is that your complaint?
 
Earthling

Earthling

David Henson
Windwalker said:
If they are striving to eliminate those like this music teacher's personal religious agenda to promote the Christian myth as history, which you are here saying you oppose as well, then why do you malign them by saying such things as, to quote, "The public educational system is not much more than government sponsored propaganda. It's a joke."? Aren't they actually doing exactly what you say here you are in favor of, "buddy"?
Click to expand...

Because both are true. Here is what I think.

1. The teachings of the Bible are true.

2. Christmas is a pagan holiday that existed long before Christ and was adopted by the apostate church long after Christ. In fact it was rejected throughout the Western world by Christians until about 1842 when Charles Dickens wrote A Christmas Carol.

3. The total separation of church and state are vital, especially to the church. I am no part of the world any more than I have to be. Don't vote, fight in wars, try to influence legislation, etc. Prayer in school, of any religion or secular nature, for example in the case of the later, the pledge of allegiance, should be prohibited beyond the individual's private concern.

4. Public schools in the U.S.A. are a joke to much of the world outside the U.S.A., not much more than what I said, government sponsored propaganda. An intentional dumbing down of the American Citizen. They are only, in this one isolated case, at the present, apparently trying to appease some crybaby atheists, which happens, in this specific case and others, such as creation in the science class where it doesn't belong, oddly enough, to be the right thing to do.
 
David T

David T

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Windwalker said:
Which is why good Christians seek control of the propaganda in order to spread their version of alternate reality to the minds of Children. It's all good and fine if it's your myth, but not so much so when the message is someone else's. Are you in favor of a Ramadan special for the kids where they tell of the glorious birth of the prophet Mohamed? How about a holiday special celebration of the Baghdad Gita complete with Hare Krishna dancers? No? The word for that then is hypocrisy. Jesus was anti-hypocrisy, not pro-Christian religion.
Click to expand...
"Jesus was anti-hypocrisy, not pro-Christian religion."

That's a topic far too deep for RF. I am certain its some rules violation!!!!
 
David T

David T

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Earthling said:
That's making a pretty big assumption, buddy. I'm totally for separation of church and state, not just for the sake of the state but more for the sake of the "church." I'm against prayer in school, and I don't trust the educational system in this country, the U.S.A., at least, to instruct anyone in any religion.
Click to expand...
"I'm totally for separation of church and state, not just for the sake of the state but more for the sake of the "church"

Well put. Although where was the outrage in church when a private corp. The federal reserve, as its advertising slogan amonst many printed in god we trust on its product? Its not atheism that should be outraged its religion that should be outraged and its not.
 
David T

David T

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Skwim said:
Ya just have to shake your head in disbelief at the widespread ignorance, or maybe its their chutzpah in thinking they should be able to get away with it.


"A holiday concert at the Fairview Area Schools in Michigan, scheduled for Tuesday night, won’t treat the birth of Jesus as a historical fact now that atheists have gotten involved.

According to the Freedom From Religion Foundation, the program included songs and spoken narrations that were better suited for a Christmas service at a local church. Here’s just a glimpse at parts of the program:

FairviewConcert1.png

FairviewConcert2.png



Mitch Kahle of the Michigan Association of Civil Rights Activists also noted in an email to the District that this program wasn’t merely some oversight. It was part of a deliberate attempt to inject religion into the concert by music teacher Amy Cobb:

Ms. Cobb has reportedly told students in class that “Jesus is the reason we have Christmas.”… Ms. Cobb also reportedly told students in class that “Jesus is real.”

Since September, MACRA had sent multiple emails to the District noting their concerns (e.g. The Christmas story is a “religious fable, not a historical fact”), but the group didn’t get a response until this past Friday — after FFRF got involved. FFRF sent a more formal letter explaining the constitutional concerns of a holiday concert that is clearly promoting Christianity without mentioning the music teacher’s supposed remarks.

The district finally responded on Friday, saying that the program would be revised. There will no longer be any narration and the explicitly Christian songs will be part of a broader program that includes mostly secular carols. It’s the right move, but it shouldn’t have taken months of letters to make it happen.

There’s also no word yet on whether the teacher will be investigated or reprimanded.
source

.​
Click to expand...
Hasnt christianity at least partually been hijacked by a cult? A bit like heresy became reality and thus what actually is heresy is no longer recognized?
 
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