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The start of the 'Jewish Sabbat', is Saturday evening, by our Calendar

Desert Snake

Veteran Member
The Jewish day begininng at sundown, roughly, [Jews, are observing Sabbat, on what on our Calendar, is the 6th day.

A 7th day Sabbat, by our Calendar, would start on Saturday Evening.
 
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Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
The Jewish day begininng at sundown, roughly, [Jews, are observing Sabbat, on what on our Calendar, is the 6th day.

A 7th day Sabbat, by our Calendar, would start on Saturday Evening.
I usually would go by this if it were my day:

14 by canceling the record of debt that stood against us with its legal demands. This he set aside, nailing it to the cross. He disarmed the rulers and authorities and put them to open shame, by triumphing over them in him.
pass judgment on you in questions of food and drink, or with regard to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath. These are a shadow of the things to come, but the substance belongs to Christ. disqualify you, insisting on asceticism and worship of angels, going on in detail about visions, puffed up without reason by his sensuous mind, not holding fast to the Head, from whom the whole body, nourished and knit together through its joints and ligaments, grows with a growth that is from God.

Therefore, if you died to the elemental spirits of the world, why, as if you were still alive in the world, do you submit to regulations. Col 2:14-20

Why the debate over the days?

I understand for jews they arent bound by laws outside the Torah. But christians?
 

Shaul

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
No. The Jewish Sabbath is from sunset on Friday evening until sunset on Saturday evening which is the seventh day of the Jewish calendar week. Christians (mostly) observe a day of rest or a Christian Sabbath on Sunday, which is the first day of the week of both the Jewish and Christian calendars.
 
No. The Jewish Sabbath is from sunset on Friday evening until sunset on Saturday evening which is the seventh day of the Jewish calendar week. Christians (mostly) observe a day of rest or a Christian Sabbath on Sunday, which is the first day of the week of both the Jewish and Christian calendars.
No, Jews(Christians) will probably celebrate it on the day Hebrews do....to be close to God.
 

Shiranui117

Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
Premium Member
No, Jews(Christians) will probably celebrate it on the day Hebrews do....to be close to God.
Christians are not Jews, though some Jews have become Christians over the millennia. Acts 15 settled this 2,000 years ago. Also, liturgically speaking, Christian days begin at sunset.

Jews still follow the same Sabbath as laid down in Exodus. Christians (outside of a few tiny denominations) don't.
 

Shiranui117

Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
Premium Member
In a non vague manner, could you describe, what time this verse refers to,

Matthew 28:1
Matthew 28:1, as in this verse?
"After the sabbath, as the first day of the week was dawning, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary went to see the tomb."
Sure, it was referring to Sunday morning after Jesus' crucifixion on Friday. Mary Magdalene and the other myrrh-bearing women were Jewish women, so it's no surprise that they were following Jewish law concerning the Sabbath. I, as a Gentile, am not bound to the same laws, as the Apostles stated in Acts 15.
 

Cooky

Veteran Member
My understanding is that the first Christians were also Jews. So they respected the Sabbath as good Jews do. And then went to Church on Sunday.
 

Desert Snake

Veteran Member
No. The Jewish Sabbath is from sunset on Friday evening until sunset on Saturday evening which is the seventh day of the Jewish calendar week. Christians (mostly) observe a day of rest or a Christian Sabbath on Sunday, which is the first day of the week of both the Jewish and Christian calendars.


That[start of Jewish Sabbath, is 'Friday', to the western calendar, not Saturday.

Note that the first day would begin on 'saturday', on the western Calendar.
 
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Desert Snake

Veteran Member
Matthew 28:1, as in this verse?
"After the sabbath, as the first day of the week was dawning, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary went to see the tomb."
Sure, it was referring to Sunday morning after Jesus' crucifixion on Friday. Mary Magdalene and the other myrrh-bearing women were Jewish women, so it's no surprise that they were following Jewish law concerning the Sabbath. I, as a Gentile, am not bound to the same laws, as the Apostles stated in Acts 15.
That isn't three days, of course.
John 2:19
 
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Shiranui117

Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
Premium Member
That[start of Jewish Sabbath, is 'Friday', to the western calendar, not Saturday.
Yes, as I just said.

Note that the first day would begin on 'saturday', on the western Calendar.
That depends heavily on what country you live in. In the US, for example, Sunday is the first day of the week, as it was on the Julian calendar (which the Gospels refer to). In point of fact, the Latin word for Monday is "feria secunda", AKA "the second day". It's the same story in Greek: "Δευτέρα ἡμέρα", or "second day". Ergo, Sunday (and not Monday) is the first day of the week.

That isn't three days, of course.
John 2:19
With inclusive reckoning, it is. Friday, Saturday, and Sunday. Three days. It doesn't matter how much or how little time Jesus was actually dead on those three days.
 

Desert Snake

Veteran Member
With inclusive reckoning, it is. Friday, Saturday, and Sunday. Three days. It doesn't matter how much or how little time Jesus was actually dead on those three days.
Your reckoning has a saturday evening , presumably resurrection, and, a nighttime, or evening, occurence, for Matthew 28:1

'New day', by your sabbath reckoning, new day approaching, by your reckoning, is saturday late afternoon, [approaching], and saturday night , after sunset[new day]
So, no Sunday, by your reckoning, to the western Calendar.
 
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GoodbyeDave

Well-Known Member
The Jewish calendar uses lunar months. Nowadays it's all done by a formula, but originally it was a matter of observation. On the 29th of the month some-one looked for the new moon after sunset. If he saw it, it was a new month; if he didn't, that month had 30 days. And that's why the day starts at sunset. We Hellenes do exactly the same.

The Ancient Egyptians started their lunar months when they couldn't see the old moon before sunrise, so they began the day at sunrise. In Roman times, Egyptian astrologers dated noctural births in the style 5/6 Athyr: 5th if you're a Egyptian, 6th if you're a Greek!
 

Shiranui117

Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
Premium Member
Your reckoning has a saturday evening , presumably resurrection, and, a nighttime occurence, for Matthew 28:1

'New day', by your sabbath reckoning, new day approaching, by your reckoning, is saturday late afternoon, [approaching], and saturday night , after sunset[new day]
So, no Sunday, by your reckoning, to the western Calendar.
No, it says that the women came to the tomb at the dawn of the first day of the week. The Sabbath is the seventh day. Sunday is the first day. Dawn is when the sun comes up. The women came to the tomb on Sunday morning. We know that Christ had risen before sunrise on Sunday. There is nothing to suggest that Christ rose on Saturday evening.

"After the sabbath, as the first day of the week was dawning, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary went to see the tomb."

It would behoove you to actually read the verse you're attempting to argue.
 

Shiranui117

Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
Premium Member
That[start of Jewish Sabbath, is 'Friday', to the western calendar, not Saturday.

Note that the first day would begin on 'saturday', on the western Calendar.
That's not how the Western calendar works, my guy. Maybe you're from a different part of the world, so let me explain this to you. The Jewish calendar is not the Western calendar. The day starts at sunset on the Jewish calendar, and on the Christian liturgical calendar. The day starts at midnight on the Western calendar. What might be confusing you is the simultaneous usage of two different calendar systems in the New Testament--one religious, one civil.
 

Desert Snake

Veteran Member
No, it says that the women came to the tomb at the dawn of the first day of the week. The Sabbath is the seventh day. Sunday is the first day. Dawn is when the sun comes up. The women came to the tomb on Sunday morning. We know that Christ had risen before sunrise on Sunday. There is nothing to suggest that Christ rose on Saturday evening.
No, you are using the jewish sabbath, here, to determine the verse, and, jewish sabbath, ends on saturday evening. So, by the western Calendar, you arent even close to three days, and by the jewish calendar or reckoning that you are using, you aren't even into sunday, 'as it began to approach a new day'. A new day, to your calculation, is saturday evening.
Something is clearly wrong, with your calculation.
 
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sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
The Jewish day begininng at sundown, roughly, [Jews, are observing Sabbat, on what on our Calendar, is the 6th day.

A 7th day Sabbat, by our Calendar, would start on Saturday Evening.
Incorrect. The Jewish day begins at sundown, not sunup. So edinning Friday at sundown is appropriate for the 7th day.
 
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