Updating the Genesis Creation Story

sealchan said:

I thought I would share a draft of an updated Genesis Creation story I have created...it needs more work...indeed it could be an endless work.

I share it here to further illuminate my own views of understanding the optimal way to understand Biblical scripture and the responsibility we now have as scientists, believers and artists to grow the Christian faith into what it should be today and not leave it dying of the floor of yesterday.

Any sincere thoughts or comments are welcome...

Before the Beginning

Before the beginning there was the Nothing-Yet of Infinite Potential. It was "nothing yet" because
nothing-yet had been created. It was potential because it could become something. And It was infinite
because there was nothing yet to stop it.

The first thing that the Nothing-Yet felt like doing was to prove to itself that it was there. The Nothing-
Yet thought, "If I create something then I will know that I am what I think I am."

So the Nothing-Yet created something; it does not matter what it was. It was happy at first. But after
contemplating its creation it thought, "What if this is a hallucination?" There was nothing other than the
Nothing-Yet and its creation that could tell the Nothing-Yet whether its creation was real or not. For a
long, long time the Nothing-Yet thought about how it could prove to itself that it existed.

One day the Nothing-Yet of Infinite Potential had given up trying to solve its dilemna and decided to play
around with creating some more things. First, It created a basketball. Then it created a mouse. The
Nothing-Yet soon discovered that some of the things it created would destroy what it had already created,
but some would exist along with what was created. It decided It would try and see how many different
things It could create and coexist. The Universe began to take shape.

The Nothing-Yet of Infinite Potential then realized, "I am. I do exist. I can't prove it to myself but I
know now that what I am creating is not an illusion. Since I am all there is, I can decide what is real and
what is an illusion." Having said this, no one told the Nothing-Yet that it was wrong.

The Beginning

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness
was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

And God said, "Let there be light," and there was light. God saw that the light was good, and he
separated the light from the darkness. God called the light "day", and the darkness he called "night." And
there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.

And God said, "Let there be a space that separates heaven and earth, water from water." So God made the
stars to shed light and the planets to receive the light from the stars, and a great space in which to place
the stars and the planets. The stars formed great lakes of their own while the planets were formed in
families around many of the stars. And some planets had families called moons formed around them.
And the planets and the moons were hot with a great fire and they were bombarded with mountains of ice
so that steam and fire covered the face of the planets.

And God said, "Let the water on the planets be gathered to one place, and let the dry ground appear."
And it was so. God called the dry ground "land," and the gathered waters he called "seas." And God saw
that it was good.

Then God said, "Let there be life. Let it cover the planets and be fruitful and multiply." And it was so.
On some planets God looked with favor and on these new life forms were born. These forms multiplied
and diversified and filled the seas and the air and the land. There were plants to receive the light of the
sun and there were animals to eat the plants and receive their share of the light. And God saw that it was
good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the third day.

Then God said, "Let there be great creatures to rule over the earth." And it was so. God made creatures,
great beasts that ruled the ocean and the air and the land. There were leviathans in the ocean, dragons in
the air and behemoths on the earth. And God saw that it was good. And there was evening, and there
was morning—the fourth day.

Then God said, "Let us make way for a new creature" And it was so. God sent one more great mountain
of ice and it struck the earth causing all the great beasts of old to die and be buried. And God saw that it
was good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the fifth day.

Then God said, "Let us make humankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish
in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals, and over all the creatures
that move along the ground now that the great destroyers and eaters are gone."

So God created humankind in His own image,
in the image of God He created them;
male and female he created them.

God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule
over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground."
Then God said, "I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has
fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food. And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds in the
sky and all the creatures that move along the ground—everything that has the breath of life in it—I give
every green plant for food." And it was so.

God saw all that He had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning—
the sixth day.

Thus the heavens and the earth were completed in all their vast array.

By the seventh day God had finished the work He had been doing; so on the seventh day he rested from
all his work. Then God blessed the seventh day and made it holy, becase on it He rested from all the
work of creating that He had done.

When God was resting He heard a voice that came not from anything that He had created. "I am, I am
here."

Yahweh spoke and said, "Who are you?"

Elat spoke and said,

I am your chaos
and your depths
When you divided the waters
you divided me
But when you made time to allow all things,
you gave me back my strength

My body grows from the stock
of which all things are made
Like a tree I am reaching out to you
from across the way

Come find me my love
forget me no more
And then may we stop our two sons
from fighting their war

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Milton Platt said:

That's the great thing about dogma that has no evidence underlying it. Everyone can make up their own versions to please themselves.

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'mud said:

Ahhh...another forum of mythology !

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sealchan said:

Adam and Eve ate the forbidden fruit God dangled in the middle of the garden, the first child was murdered by the second, the first tablets given to Moses were smashed, not to mention all the great natural and human causes cataclysms of history...how convenient that we can be assured the Bible with its incongruent lives of Jesus is without error cause, you know, that would never happen.

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The Anointed said:

You wrote; "The first child was murdered by the second." which assures us that your words are not without Error, because.Cain was the first born of Eve and he killed his younger brother, Abel.

As it would appear that you are not a serious student of the scriptures, here are the verses that prove your words to be erroneous: Genesis 4:1-2; Adam made love to his wife Eve, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Cain. She said, "With the help of the LORD I have brought forth a man." Later she gave birth to his brother Abel. etc.

Verse 8 of the same chapter, reveals that Cain killed his younger brother Abel. Perhaps you might care to rectify your gross error.

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sealchan said:

When I first came up with the core of this story, it was part of an experience which led me out of a depression.

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Subduction Zone said:

Grasping at straws again. A minor error was made. Of course the claim is moot anyway since the Genesis stories are all myths.

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The Anointed said:

You wrote; "The first child was murdered by the second." which assures us that your words are not without Error, because.Cain was the first born of Eve and he killed his younger brother, Abel.

As it would appear that you are not a serious student of the scriptures, here are the verses that prove your words to be erroneous: Genesis 4:1-2; Adam made love to his wife Eve, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Cain. She said, "With the help of the LORD I have brought forth a man." Later she gave birth to his brother Abel. etc.

Verse 8 of the same chapter, reveals that Cain killed his younger brother Abel. Perhaps you might care to rectify your gross error.

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The Anointed said:

Here we go again. You are like a grade one primary school child, listening to the residential physics professor, speaking on Einstein's theory of relativity, not having a clue as to what he is talking about, but accusing him of talking rubbish.

When debating that which is recorded in the Scriptures, whether you believe the scriptures or not, you make so many minor and Major errors, it is obvious to all that you are a scriptural ignoramus, not having a clue as to the truths revealed therein.

The Genesis stories which reveal that the earth and planets of our Solar system were created before the sun, and that life had begun to evolve on earth before the condensing Solar nebula, which had been divided from the greater galactic nebula finally reached about 10 million Kelvin and after the planets of the solar system had been created, the hydrogen nuclei started fusing together to produce helium nuclei and a lot of energy.

It was then that the proto-Sun "TURNED ON" and became our Sun, which produced the strong winds called T-Tauri winds named after the prototype star in the constellation Taurus, which winds then swept out the rest of the nebula that was not already incorporated into the planets.

The genesis stories are not myths my friend, and when people make such errors, as saying "The first child was murdered by the second." those errors must be shown to be the untruths that they are.

BTW, do you believe that Jesus was born before or after the death of Herod the Great in 4 B.C? Whoops! Sorry about that mate, I forgot that you believe that Jesus is just a myth, a myth, a myth, a myth You need to go onto a mythological forum, you're wasting your time and mine on a religious forum.

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The Anointed said:

Here we go again. You are like a grade one primary school child, listening to the residential physics professor, speaking on Einstein's theory of relativity, not having a clue as to what he is talking about, but accusing him of talking rubbish.

When debating that which is recorded in the Scriptures, whether you believe the scriptures or not, you make so many minor and Major errors, it is obvious to all that you are a scriptural ignoramus, not having a clue as to the truths revealed therein.

The Genesis stories which reveal that the earth and planets of our Solar system were created before the sun, and that life had begun to evolve on earth before the condensing Solar nebula, which had been divided from the greater galactic nebula finally reached about 10 million Kelvin and after the planets of the solar system had been created, the hydrogen nuclei started fusing together to produce helium nuclei and a lot of energy.

It was then that the proto-Sun "TURNED ON" and became our Sun, which produced the strong winds called T-Tauri winds named after the prototype star in the constellation Taurus, which winds then swept out the rest of the nebula that was not already incorporated into the planets.

The genesis stories are not myths my friend, and when people make such errors, as saying "The first child was murdered by the second." those errors must be shown to be the untruths that they are.

BTW, do you believe that Jesus was born before or after the death of Herod the Great in 4 B.C? Whoops! Sorry about that mate, I forgot that you believe that Jesus is just a myth, a myth, a myth, a myth You need to go onto a mythological forum, you're wasting your time and mine on a religious forum.

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sealchan said:

How do you account for the lack of archeological evidence, similarities to myths from other older cultures and literary analysis which places the stories into the range of 600 BC?

A religion that cannot recognize it's own myth has already lost the value it originally had.

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Subduction Zone said:

You keep making me think that you are not a real Christian. I would think that a real Christian would not spew so many falsehoods about another person.

You are now trying to reinterpret the Bible since it is obviously wrong even to you. Here is what is wrong with Genesis in a nutshell. There never were only two people, there never was a worldwide flood. Languages did not arise from the tower of Babel.

I am not sure when Jesus was born since there is no reliable record of that date but it was Luke that screwed the pooch when it came to the nativity myth. He has him born both roughly in the year 4 BCE and 6 CE a ten year time span.

How about we concentrate on one issue at a time. Would you like to learn how the author of Luke screwed up?

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The Anointed said:

You are entitled to your erroneous belief that the scriptures of my religion are no more than myths, but the archeological evidence such as the fall of Jericho some 40 years after the departure of the Israelites from Egypt, prove the scriptures to be correct.

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sealchan said:

Don't be too quick to judge...

Dr. Wood, an authority on Canaanite pottery, said in a telephone interview that he was ''very certain'' of his analysis, but conceded that the association with Joshua was largely circumstantial and thus debatable.

from Believers Score in Battle Over the Battle of Jericho

It would be interesting if back in the day, a fortified city, built hastily, stood tall until one day a significant portion of its walls simply fell down due to some domino effect set off by an earthquake.

The biggest thing against this being Joshua is the lack of all other archeological evidence plus evidence both in the Bible and outside suggesting a long process of cultural differentiation and coming into superiority of the Israelites living in Canaan. Interestingly and example of this sort of process may be seen in Genesis 36 in the case of Esau as his progeny gradually became the rulers of Edom.

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The Anointed said:

From ‘The World Book Dictionary,’ (Hyksos) “A succession of six foreign rulers of Egypt—from about 1730 B.C. to about 1570 B.C; Shepherd Kings.” --- And from the Encyclopedia Britannica, ‘Hyksos’, invaders who were also called the Shepherd Kings, who in the time of “King Tutimaios” entered Egypt and took possession of it without striking a blow and it is said here that Josephus the historian, identifies them with the Israelites and that their reign ended in 1567 B.C.

Genesis 41: After Joseph had revealed to the king that his dreams were a prophecy telling of a seven year period of plenty, which would be followed by a seven year period of severe drought, Joseph is made Governor of all Egypt, and all Egyptians were commanded by the King to obey him. The King removed his royal ring with its engraved seal and put it on the finger of Joseph. He was given the second royal chariot and a guard of honour who went ahead of him crying out, “Make way, make way.” And the King said: I am King, but no one in all of Egypt shall so much as lift a hand or a foot without Joseph’s permission. He gave Joseph an Egyptian wife, Asenath, the daughter of the High priest of Heliopolis, who prophesied that if ever the bones of Joseph left Egypt, the LIGHT of Egypt would go with him. For that reason, a permanent guard was set up to keep watch over the tomb of Joseph, in order that no one could remove the mummified body of Joseph.

During the seven years of plenty, Joseph gathered a percentage of the Egyptian grain crop as a tax, which was stored in silos throughout Egypt. In the early stages of the great seven-year drought, the Egyptians had to buy their grain from Joseph, when their money had all gone they traded their possessions and livestock, after which, they were forced to sign their land over for grain in order to survive.

Genesis 47: 20-21. Joseph bought all the land of Egypt for the king. Every Egyptian was forced to sell their land, because the famine was so severe; Joseph made slaves of all the people from one end of Egypt to the other, without striking a blow.

If Josephus the historian is correct and the exodus of the Shepherd Kings did occur in 1567 BC, and Jericho was destroyed after they had wandered in the desert for 40 years, then according to the biblical account, the destruction of Jericho would have occurred around 1527 BC. 1567-40=1527.

The Hyksos were described as bowmen and cavalrymen wearing the cloaks of many colors, much like the cloak of many colours that was worn by Joseph the son of Israel and the first of the Hykos kings, of who it is said in Genesis 50: 23; that he lived to receive the children of Machir the son of Manasseh into the family. And in Judges 5: 14, it is written that the commanders of the army came down from Machir, of who it is said in Joshua 17: 1; that Machir was the first born son of Manasseh, the first born of Joseph, and that he was a military hero, and the father of young Gilead.

After living in Egypt for 215 years, the Exodus of the shepherd kings, and the removal of the mummified remains of Joseph, which were to be taken to Shechem and buried there in the land of Israel as per Joseph’s last wish, the Israelites wandered the wilderness for 40 years before destroying the city of Jericho as they moved in to claim the Land of their rightful inheritance.

Kathleen Kenyon, a most respected archaeologist dug at Jericho over the seasons between 1952 to 1958, her results were confirmed in 1995 by radiocarbon tests, which dated the destruction of Jericho to 1562 BC (Plus/minus 38 years) with a certainty of 95%.

The radiocarbon tests which dated the destruction of Jericho to 1562 BC (plus/minus 38 years) with a certainty of 95%, confirm that the biblical date of 1527 BC for the destruction, agrees with Kathleen Kenyon’s findings.

1562 (minus 38 years) [1562-38=1524 BC.] this would mean that Jericho fell somewhere between 1562 and 1524 BC, close enough to the 40 years after Josephus’ date for the Exodus in 1567. [1567-40=1527 BC]

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sealchan said:

I Googled...

were the hyksos the israelites

...and read the top five results. It seems very debatable although several points seem to line up. Josephus apparently reinterpreted an earlier Egyptian historian named Manetho who did not make the connection.

Although Jericho might have been destroyed at the time thought of as the conquering of the Israelites, few or no other cities have been found to correlate with this. I believe the current consensus is that the Israelites gradually rose to dominance as a sub-culture within the Canaanite region.

To the later point I am going to read...

Historical Problems with the Hebrew Bible: The Conquest of Canaan

...as I suspect it will summarize more recent findings.

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The Anointed said:

Well you should learn a lot about the truths as recorded in scripture from Bart Erhman who abandoned the God he once believed in, to become a renowned atheist.

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The Anointed said:

Well you should learn a lot about the truths as recorded in scripture from Bart Erhman who abandoned the God he once believed in, to become a renowned atheist.

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Subduction Zone said:

You have to be kidding me. You need to find something better than a joke site, probably written by some dishonest Christian. You also demonstrated that you are ignorant of the Bible as well. Luke himself tells us that it was the census of Quirinius since it occurred when Quirinius was the governor in Syria:

" 2 (This was the first census that took place while Quirinius was governor of Syria.)"

That is from Luke 2 2.

Census of Quirinius - Wikipedia

If you read the article you will find the Quirinius became governor in the year 6 CE.

Try to find a real website that supports your claims. I know that you can't.


EDIT: Like I said that site is almost certainly fake that you linked. They took the name of a real historian and a real book that he wrote. But the passage there does not appear to be in his book. Here is a link to a PDF of it:

https://ia802706.us.archive.org/3/items/readingsinancien011109mbp/readingsinancien011109mbp.pdf

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