Do Members of Jehovah's Witness Celebrate the US Independence Day?

siti said:

To my knowledge beards were not "forbidden" at any time between the 1980s and late 1990s when I was an active JW. For the last twenty years I haven't been so up to date on internal matters.

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I was inactive in the early 80s, prior to actually leaving for good, surprisingly at the time when I and my husband determined to return to "the Truth." Having been out of constant contact with the JWs for a number of years, the issues that I knew were present prior to becoming inactive, but which I pushed aside and buried, became abundantly clear and eventually made me realize that I could no longer tolerate those things I knew to be wrong...so I left for good.

And probably using the word "forbidden" was a bit too harsh. I don't know of any judicial punishment that would have resulted from a JW's ignoring the "wise counsel" from the GB, but any JW male who did choose to have a beard (one elder's son, for instance, had very sensitive skin and shaving caused him a lot of pain) would have been considered to be "spiritually weak" and possibly "bad association" and shunted to the side. No "privileges" would be allowed to any JW male who, shall we say, bucked the system.

The beard issue was similar to the strong discouragement about higher education. When I was in High School, we were constantly told that higher education was not only a waste, but that the "philosophies of men" would almost assuredly destroy our relationship with Jehovah. We were told that, not only would we most likely not have the time in "this Old System" to complete a course of study, but that even if we did, we would never have the time to have a career in our chosen field.

I, of course, did not go to college, although my teachers constantly urged me to reconsider. I did win a scholarship to a well-known secretarial school, which met with the approval of the elders since it would help me to get a part-time job to support myself as a pioneer minister, and I became a pioneer minister for three years until my health failed me.

So, here I am, retired for several years, and I guess that I could have gone to college and had a career. Sadly, I was a good JW and I believed them at the time.

John53 said:

A quick search of the internet shows that it is in fact not a lie, they may not be officially banned but they are strongly discouraged.

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She said “forbidden”. Did you miss that?

John53 said:

This page has a lot of information https://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/beards-jehovahs-witnesses.php including a letter written to the watchtower by a JW asking why he couldn't have a beard and the WT response.

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Lol. Learning about JW’s from jwfacts?
That’s like asking Judas Iscariot about Jesus!

You should get it ‘from the horse’s mouth’. JW.org

Hockeycowboy said:

She said “forbidden”. Did you miss that?

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No, nor did I miss you calling her a liar for no reason. I would figure a self professed Christian might say something like "they are discouraged not forbidden" but it appears you have such a persecution complex your 1st reaction is to attack instead of correct.

Lol. Learning about JW’s from jwfacts?
That’s like asking Judas Iscariot about Jesus!

You should get it ‘from the horse’s mouth’. JW.org

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It quotes from WT what more of a horses mouth do you want?

John53 said:

No, nor did I miss you calling her a liar for no reason. I would figure a self professed Christian might say something like "they are discouraged not forbidden" but it appears you have such a persecution complex your 1st reaction is to attack instead of correct.



It quotes from WT what more of a horses mouth do you want?

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You’ve established a pattern from your first post I read.
You stated something as a fact. Then, when I asked you about it, you stated you may have misunderstood. Ever since, you’ve been in attack mode.

She said forbidden, but another poster even, told her that was wrong.

Sorry you don’t like us...it’s sorta obvious.



Quotes from jwfacts are usually out of context.

Hope you have a good day.

Hockeycowboy said:

You’ve established a pattern from your first post I read.
You stated something as a fact. Then, when I asked you about it, you stated you may have misunderstood. Ever since, you’ve been in attack mode.

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No idea what you're talking about, I've gone back through the thread and can't see anything like that, you'll have to point me to the post.

She said forbidden, but another poster even, told her that was wrong.

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Didn't say otherwise. Did you read my post?

Sorry you don’t like us...it’s sorta obvious.

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Persecution complex. No need to worry I don't like any organised religion.

Quotes from jwfacts are usually out of context.

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Seems straight forward enough to me. They quote a letter to WT where someone asks why he can't have a beard and quote the WT response. How is that out of context?

Hope you have a good day.

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I always try to.

Hockeycowboy said:

She said “forbidden”. Did you miss that?



Lol. Learning about JW’s from jwfacts?
That’s like asking Judas Iscariot about Jesus!

You should get it ‘from the horse’s mouth’. JW.org

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I later rescinded the "forbidden" label. Did you miss that?

Typical JW response...get information only from the official site. That's like telling someone who is considering buying a Ford automobile to get information about Fords only from the manufacturer's site and not to listen to reviews given by actual Ford owners. LOL

Cults (aka high-control religions) tend to warn anyone about getting any information from former members. They prefer that people go to the "official" site where they will get only the information that the leadership wants them to see.

Hockeycowboy said:

You’ve established a pattern from your first post I read.
You stated something as a fact. Then, when I asked you about it, you stated you may have misunderstood. Ever since, you’ve been in attack mode.

She said forbidden, but another poster even, told her that was wrong.

Sorry you don’t like us...it’s sorta obvious.



Quotes from jwfacts are usually out of context.

Hope you have a good day.

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I notice that you didn't respond to my question about whether or not those JWs you claim have beards are in any sort of positions of responsibility like elders, ministerial servants, pioneers, or even handling the microphone. Why is that?

You are focused on my initial post where I said beards were forbidden. I've acknowledged that I was mistaken in the use of that word and rescinded it. Why do you focus on something that has been withdrawn? And you know for a fact that although there are no judicial proceedings taken against a JW male with a beard, there are repercussions. I don't know of any JW male who was considered to be spiritually strong who bucked the system by growing a beard. Are you claiming that that is no longer true? Are you claiming that an elder can grow a beard and remain an elder?

Speaking of ridiculous rules in the JW religion, perhaps we should hark back to the fairly recent JW broadcast wherein "Tight Pants Tony" as he is fondly known to "apostates" blathered on about how JW males should not wear tight pants and JW females should not wear Spandex (he called it Spanx) when jogging or exercising. Such attire was considered to be inappropriate for "Christians."

FYI, this will be my last personal response to you.

RedhorseWoman said:

I notice that you didn't respond to my question about whether or not those JWs you claim have beards are in any sort of positions of responsibility like elders, ministerial servants, pioneers, or even handling the microphone. Why is that?

Speaking of ridiculous rules in the JW religion, perhaps we should hark back to the fairly recent JW broadcast wherein "Tight Pants Tony" as he is fondly known to "apostates" blathered on about how JW males should not wear tight pants and JW females should not wear Spandex (he called it Spanx) when jogging or exercising. Such attire was considered to be inappropriate for "Christians."

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I gave you an answer...I said I have two friends who are elders, with beards.

From JW.org (This will also discuss modesty):

"Is it appropriate for brothers to wear a beard? The Mosaic Law required men to wear a beard. However, Christians are not under the Mosaic Law or required to follow it. (Leviticus 19:27; 21:5; Galatians 3:24, 25) In some cultures, a neatly trimmed beard may be acceptable and respectable, and it may not at all prevent people from listening to our message. In fact, some appointed brothers have beards. Even so, some brothers might decide not to wear a beard. (1 Corinthians 8:9, 13; 10:32) In other cultures or locations, beards are not the custom and are not considered acceptable for Christian ministers. In fact, having one may prevent a brother from bringing glory to God and from being “irreprehensible.”—1 Timothy 3:2, 7;Romans 15:1-3.

18, 19. How does Micah 6:8 help us?

18 How grateful we are that Jehovah does not give us long lists of what is acceptable dress and grooming and what is not. Instead, he has given us the freedom to make reasonable personal decisions based on Bible principles. So even when we make decisions about our dress and grooming, we can show that we want to be modest as we serve our God.—Micah 6:8.

19 We modestly recognize that Jehovah is pure and holy and that his standards are the best guide for us. If we want to be modest and humble, we will follow his standards in our life. Modesty will also help us to respect the feelings and opinions of others."

-- https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/402016684?q=beards&p=par#h=27

Hockeycowboy said:

FYI, this will be my last personal response to you.



I gave you an answer...I said I have two friends who are elders, with beards.

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Sorry, I missed that altogether. I must say, though, that this is certainly a turnaround from what I was used to. Beards were something that would automatically "mark" a person as being spiritually weak and not allowed to serve in any capacity whatsoever.

Then again, there have always been areas where JWs adhere more closely to the "suggestions" and "counsel" from the GB and areas where they are, shall we say, a bit lax. When I visited a sister in CA I was surprised at what JWs there were allowed to do...things that the GB had warned/cautioned against and that would have resulted in repercussions back home.

I guess you live in a more permissive area, where the GB counsel is taken with a grain of salt? Congratulations! Most JWs consider instructions and suggestions from the GB to be definitely something that God wants "his people" to do or to avoid.

Hockeycowboy said:

FYI, this will be my last personal response to you.



I gave you an answer...I said I have two friends who are elders, with beards.

From JW.org (This will also discuss modesty):

"Is it appropriate for brothers to wear a beard? The Mosaic Law required men to wear a beard. However, Christians are not under the Mosaic Law or required to follow it. (Leviticus 19:27; 21:5; Galatians 3:24, 25) In some cultures, a neatly trimmed beard may be acceptable and respectable, and it may not at all prevent people from listening to our message. In fact, some appointed brothers have beards. Even so, some brothers might decide not to wear a beard. (1 Corinthians 8:9, 13; 10:32) In other cultures or locations, beards are not the custom and are not considered acceptable for Christian ministers. In fact, having one may prevent a brother from bringing glory to God and from being “irreprehensible.”—1 Timothy 3:2, 7;Romans 15:1-3.

18, 19. How does Micah 6:8 help us?

18 How grateful we are that Jehovah does not give us long lists of what is acceptable dress and grooming and what is not. Instead, he has given us the freedom to make reasonable personal decisions based on Bible principles. So even when we make decisions about our dress and grooming, we can show that we want to be modest as we serve our God.—Micah 6:8.

19 We modestly recognize that Jehovah is pure and holy and that his standards are the best guide for us. If we want to be modest and humble, we will follow his standards in our life. Modesty will also help us to respect the feelings and opinions of others."

-- https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/402016684?q=beards&p=par#h=27

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BTW, how do you feel about "Tight Pants Tony" (Anthony Morris III) with his rant about those "tight pants" (metrosexual look) that he stated were designed by homosexuals? And do you agree with him that sisters should not wear Spandex when jogging or exercising?