Forgiveness

Cacotopia said:

What is the supposed equal and opposite reaction to these events?

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Eternal death for adulterer and adulteress. It's why you shouldn't aspire to be a politician if you're a pagan, because if these are the consequences of the laws you make, you know what's coming to you.

So did the Jews. Circa 1 million of them died to avenge Christ's execution, 97,000 were enslaved.

Forgiveness is only available to those who repent. When Christ prayed for the Jews' forgiveness, he prayed for their repentence. I am not sure of the extent to which it happened. Perhaps a few Jews repented, those who belonged to the early Jewish church. Foregiveness is something that only the few who repent will ever truly experience.

yeah yeah yeah yeah. blah blah blah blah.

Don't call your god loving and merciful when your god is a *******.

Cacotopia said:

plenty of crime occurs with zero repercussions.

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That's not necessarily true. Just because we can't or don't see repercussions doesn't mean they don't occur. Moreover, for those who believe in karma its effects can span throughout time and space over many lifetimes. 'Instant Karma' was just a John Lennon song.

Fool said:

the third law of thermodynamics

or if you prefer

There is always an action and reaction; an advance and a retreat; a rising and a sinking; manifested in all of the airs and phenomena of the Universe. Suns, worlds, men, animals, plants, minerals, forces, energy, mind and matter, yes, even Spirit, manifests this Principle. The Principle manifests in the creation and destruction of worlds; in the rise and fall of nations; in the life history of all things; and finally in the mental states of Man.

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Sorry, that isn't the third law of thermodynamics: The entropy of a perfect crystal is 0 at a temperature of 0K.

Cacotopia said:

Don't call your god loving and merciful when your god is a *******.

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As if your god wasn't an a *?

Said Mary:

Luk 1:50-53
His mercy extends to those who fear him, from generation to generation.

He has performed mighty deeds with his arm; he has scattered those who are proud in their inmost thoughts.

He has brought down rulers from their thrones but has lifted up the humble.

He has filled the hungry with good things but has sent the rich away empty.

Then your god is a mafia boss, a thug, saying if you don't follow me, I'll break your legs. Fear forces respect. But hat respect isn't honest, the respect is selfish, a means of self preservation. and your god didn't earn it if the only way he can get it is by way of force. That's not benevolent, that is not a force of good, we should replace all the saints with past mob bosses and thugs in society. Because they follow the path of god in the manner in which they operate. violence, torture, death and fear.

"back in the good ole days" the mob never targeted the poor, it was frowned upon, they were charitable to the meek and low class. They took care of those people.

Jainarayan said:

That's not necessarily true. Just because we can't or don't see repercussions doesn't mean they don't occur. Moreover, for those who believe in karma its effects can span throughout time and space over many lifetimes. 'Instant Karma' was just a John Lennon song.

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So say a kid has difficulty reading, explanation, you have dyslexia because in a previous life you were a book burning fascist. And don't try to overcome your punishment, because it would upset the karmic balance.

Then in a later life a person is depressed and unmotivated will the crime be for not attempting to overcome the precious obstacle?

That makes no sense to me, that sounds like encouraging people to remain in poor condition and removes any kind of hope. A loose system of predestined events that you should never do anything about.

It can be easily abused and likely is put there to make sure people don't try to leave their social class.

Cacotopia said:

Then your god is a mafia boss, a thug, saying if you don't follow me, I'll break your legs. Fear forces respect. But hat respect isn't honest, the respect is selfish, a means of self preservation. and your god didn't earn it if the only way he can get it is by way of force. That's not benevolent, that is not a force of good, we should replace all the saints with past mob bosses and thugs in society. Because they follow the path of god in the manner in which they operate. violence, torture, death and fear.

"back in the good ole days" the mob never targeted the poor, it was frowned upon, they were charitable to the meek and low class. They took care of those people.

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there are two choices;

1. service to self - this is your mob boss, or familialism/tribalism thinking. it's also a slippery slope because when two people with entirely selfish motives meet, then at least one of them has to lose, in order for one to realize their goal.

and

2. service to all as self, or service to other as self. basically the golden rule stated in another way. - this is your universalism, or son of man, thinking


people generally mix them up with percentages of 1 and 2.

the ideal is #2. why? simple, everyone is considered to be no less, and no more, than like self.


those who follow option #1 the majority of the time are headed down a road that is short and filled with adverse reaction. there are no detours for dangerous points along the road , because self created that road with pitfalls, traps, hair pin turns, and drove at their own self-appointed speed.

the road to hell is paved with good intentions and the drivers of that road use others to pave the way.



we hold these truths to be self-evident that all men are created equal and are endowed with certain inalienable rights, maslow called them needs, life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.

enjoy the rat race. love of all is the better way

Cacotopia said:

So say a kid has difficulty reading, explanation, you have dyslexia because in a previous life you were a book burning fascist. And don't try to overcome your punishment, because it would upset the karmic balance.

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it isn't a punishment anymore than it is holding a person back from moving on to the next level in their education. it gives the student the ability to see the situation from another perspective in space/time. if at first you don't succeed, try, try again. you don't get the prize just because you showed up and took up space and didn't contribute anything of value. love can't help those who won't help themselves. sometimes a curse can turn out to be a blessing. it is our job to be stewards of those who follow, just like someone who was a mentor to us. if you want to eat, you're going to have to cultivate something.

Cacotopia said:

Then in a later life a person is depressed and unmotivated will the crime be for not attempting to overcome the precious obstacle?

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there is no later life. life is continuous. there is an incarnation vs non-third density state of energy, or no chemical earthly body.

Cacotopia said:

That makes no sense to me, that sounds like encouraging people to remain in poor condition and removes any kind of hope. A loose system of predestined events that you should never do anything about.

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ignorance doesn't encourage anything. it leaves the ignorant extremely dependent upon others. like an animal vs what we consider to be acceptable human behavior that acts on a creative level and not just a reactive level.

Cacotopia said:

It can be easily abused and likely is put there to make sure people don't try to leave their social class.

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anything can be used to manipulate and control others. we're either empowering or enslaving others with respect to actions towards our fellow man and nature.

it works the same on all levels; except the last one. the All is allowed to be of service to self because there is nothing besides the Absolute.

Cacotopia said:

Then your god is a mafia boss, a thug, saying if you don't follow me, I'll break your legs. Fear forces respect. But hat respect isn't honest, the respect is selfish, a means of self preservation. and your god didn't earn it if the only way he can get it is by way of force. That's not benevolent, that is not a force of good, we should replace all the saints with past mob bosses and thugs in society. Because they follow the path of god in the manner in which they operate. violence, torture, death and fear.

"back in the good ole days" the mob never targeted the poor, it was frowned upon, they were charitable to the meek and low class. They took care of those people.

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Rev 22:15
For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.

Your god, are the god of the mob, are one and the same, because the only god that you each acknowledge is that based on lies. The concern of the Christian God for the poor is a common theme. Indeed it is said that God has chosen the poor to be rich in faith. Whereas you slander God by comparing him to the Mafia? Truly, you are disturbed.

As for the mob never targeting the poor? They create poverty, crime and immorality, prostitution, wherever they operate. They use the poor for their own ends. Really what you say is an outrage.

The poor, the downtrodden, and the meek are rich in faith because they have nothing to lose and everything to gain. As for the mob, not targeting the poor, as in the good ole days, they didn't, if you knew any history you would acknowledge it.

You see few wealthy people truly are deep in faith, except those that profit from it, or profit from being a part of it.

Cacotopia said:

The poor, the downtrodden, and the meek are rich in faith because they have nothing to lose and everything to gain. As for the mob, not targeting the poor, as in the good ole days, they didn't, if you knew any history you would acknowledge it.

You see few wealthy people truly are deep in faith, except those that profit from it, or profit from being a part of it.

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you can't profit from what you can't control. if you can't control self, someone else will and profit from it. like beyonce is a brand. if someone attempts to use the brand then the personality loses profits. jesus was a brand, a fire brand. i believe revelation shows the propensity for commercialization of that brand through idolatry.

good insight

Cacotopia said:

the good ole days

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There were no "good old days." It's just a myth. Like Pablo Escobar, who some will say, he built schools, paved roads, got access to clean water, provided health care, supported churches, and invested in affordable housing.....with money obtained from rich people in the USA buying his cocaine. So what? He murdered hundreds of people, even blowing up a plane full of innocent people. Even murderers do some good deeds with their riches, trying to soothe a guilty conscience. Counts for nothing in the end. Even Christ said, pagans love themselves, and their own families.

So I don't buy your attempt to excuse yourself from libelling God as "a mafia boss, a thug." If it weren't for God, you would not even be alive.

Cacotopia said:

I don't think Karma works. It's a justice system with the probability of chance. And encourages lazy justice.


Person A wrongs person B. Person B waits for Karma to affect person A, which could possibly ever happen.

Misfortune affects person C, explanation of misfortune was that person C was person A, and Karma is finally taking affect. If person C was a good person why is person C being punished for the actions of person A. Person C accepts Karma, and accepts misfortune like they deserved it somehow, when they had no personal hand in it as person C. Person C also might not seek to improve their own situation because person C now feels like they deserved punishment for another life.

How does that make sense to anyone.

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When we start with the premise of transmigration(the soul coming to perfection through the living of many lives) then it all makes perfect sense. Without that piece it is all nothing but confusion.

allfoak said:

When we start with the premise of transmutation, (the soul coming to perfection through the living of many lives) then it all makes perfect sense. Without that piece it is all nothing but confusion.

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You have already assumed there is a soul in the first place. Gotta prove that first.

outlawState said:

There were no "good old days." It's just a myth. Like Pablo Escobar, who some will say, he built schools, paved roads, got access to clean water, provided health care, supported churches, and invested in affordable housing.....with money obtained from rich people in the USA buying his cocaine. So what? He murdered hundreds of people, even blowing up a plane full of innocent people. Even murderers do some good deeds with their riches, trying to soothe a guilty conscience. Counts for nothing in the end. Even Christ said, pagans love themselves, and their own families.

So I don't buy your attempt to excuse yourself from libelling God as "a mafia boss, a thug." If it weren't for God, you would not even be alive.

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Holocaust out of the blue, as usual you go for left field. Where no one is.

Cacotopia said:

You have already assumed there is a soul in the first place. Gotta prove that first.

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Energy cannot be created/destroyed. it can only be transformed. this third density chemical body is a form of that energy. know thyself


transformed = transmutation

Saddam Hussein did build schools, colleges and it was ALL FREE, so was health care. And women could go to college too, in fact before America wrecked the place Iraq was the most forward thinking country in the Arab states. The most stable, yeah he was a dictator, but the taliban couldn't exist in Iraq under Hussein's regime. Now we can't have stability over there let's bomb the hell out of it and turn it into a power vacuum, and leave it inn civil disorder for the next 50 years.

I bet you Iraqis talk about the good ole days when Saddam was alive and in power, it sure was a lot better then than it is now, in fact when I worked at a plate shop I had this very conversation about the good ole days in Iraq, with an Iraqi, It WAS BETTER when Hussein was in charge, it wasn't the best but at least there was some kind of order.

Fool said:

Energy cannot be created/destroyed. it can only be transformed. this third density chemical body is a form of that energy. know thyself

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Then you are assuming the soul is energy, again you need to prove it.

Tacking a definition on to it doesn't make it true. Nor does trying to sound snobby either give you any more credentials than the next guy.