"Why is murder wrong?"

Sonofason · Dec 4, 2015

A Greased Scotsman said:
He condones the Israelites committing genocide on the peoples of Canaan.

They deserved it.
"The Canaanites were a brutal, aggressive people who engaged in bestiality, incest, and even child sacrifice. Deviant sexual acts were the norm. The Canaanites’ sin was so repellent that God said, “The land vomited out its inhabitants” (Leviticus 18:25). Even so, the destruction was directed more at the Canaanite religion (Deuteronomy 7:3–5,12:2-3) than at the Canaanite people per se. The judgment was not ethnically motivated. Individual Canaanites, like Rahab in Jericho, could still find that mercy follows repentance (Joshua 2). God's desire is that the wicked turn from their sin rather than die (Ezekiel 18:31-32, 33:11)."
http://www.gotquestions.org/Old-Testament-violence.html

Sonofason · Dec 4, 2015

sojourner said:
I disagree.

You may disagree.

Skwim · Dec 4, 2015

Sonofason said:
Yes, I have beliefs. I believe the Bible is accurate and true. I believe God is completely natural. I believe He exists naturally. I believe he naturally exists. I believe God is eternal, and that it is natural for God to exist eternally. I believe I have a personal relationship with God. Yes I have beliefs. But you claimed that God condones murder. You did not suggest it is simply a belief you have, but stated it as if it were a matter of fact.

Heck, I thought my description and presumptions were quite reasonable.

". . . in many cases where god takes it upon himself to kill or have killed innocent parties in lands/cities/towns/whatever"

This is not in the least debatable. These are things the Bible says he did.

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"that no doubt had laws against murder,"

Do you actually think it's more reasonable that these communities had no law against murder---people were free to go around willy-nilly killing each other---than have at least one law against it?

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"god violated those laws---unlawful and premeditated killings."

Assuming these communities did have at least one law against murder, and god did commit unlawful and premeditated killings, then he would have been guilty of violating these laws: having committed murder .

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"Sodom and Gomorrah come to mind. I'm sure their laws didn't include the qualifier, "unless god is the killer."

Think they had no laws against murder---people were free to go around willy-nilly killing each other? Or, if they did have laws they included a clause that exempted god? "Thou shalt not murder for it is a crime, except you god, you can kill whomever you want and we won't consider it murder."

For me to believe such claims, I'm going to need to see some evidence. So where is it? If you fail to provide the evidence, then I will just assume that it is a belief that you hold which holds no weight whatsoever for me.

Go head and assume whatever you wish, just don't hold me or anyone else up to a standard you yourself aren't willing to meet. And, FYI, your "I believes" don't qualify as evidence..

Scott C. · Dec 4, 2015

Mandi said:
I saw this recently and it was just an amazing argument better articulated than I could of ever done it, although I've tried before.

Thoughts? Opinions?

A sad and amazingly ignorant interpretation of Christianity with no insight whatsoever.

prometheus11 · Dec 4, 2015

I can't imagine a more accurate representation of bible God, Scott.

Scott C. · Dec 4, 2015

prometheus11 said:
I can't imagine a more accurate representation of bible God, Scott.

I don't even know where to start. This interpretation is so messed up. I get how someone can come to these false conclusions, but it's an incredibly superficial and inaccurate interpretation. It's foolish.

Kelly of the Phoenix · Dec 4, 2015

kerndog said:
The incident with the ark you refer to at 2 Samuel Chpt. 6, is not as cut and dry as it may seem, at first glance yes, it sounds very harsh, but take a closer look at it, MAY change your view. The handling of the ark was very serious buisness, and HAD to be done according to Gods explicit instructions. At Numbers 4:15,19,20 we see that although Uzzah was a levite, he was not a Ko`hath levite, the ONLY group who had authority to touch or handle the Ark, anyone else who disobeyed this procedure or command, was to be put to death, also at Exodus 25:13,14 they were given explicit instructions by god on how the Ark was to be carried, with pole and on foot by these Ko`hath levites,this was disobeyed and carried on a very unstable cart drawn by oxen over rough terrain, asking for the cart to upset, this would have been highley unlikely, if they would just done as they were commanded. We learn much about how important OBEDIENCE is to god in the scriptures, our life is at stake, a good example can be found at 1 Samuel 15:20-23....Luke 8:21. What Uzzah did sounds noble, but was a deliberate violation of what he KNEW was wrong, the lesson is, good intentions is not an accepted excuse for deliberate disobedience. Sort of like the old saying in todays world....." the road to hell is paved with good intentions ".....peace to you !

I see a story where Levites want to maintain control over religious icons and the guy did nothing objectively wrong. You would have rather had the box broken? Personally, he probably died because a heavy-*** box fell on him. You can bust a gut like that. *sigh* Poor body mechanics ...

Sonofason said:
They deserved it.
"The Canaanites were a brutal, aggressive people who engaged in bestiality, incest, and even child sacrifice. Deviant sexual acts were the norm. The Canaanites’ sin was so repellent that God said, “The land vomited out its inhabitants” (Leviticus 18:25). Even so, the destruction was directed more at the Canaanite religion (Deuteronomy 7:3–5,12:2-3) than at the Canaanite people per se. The judgment was not ethnically motivated. Individual Canaanites, like Rahab in Jericho, could still find that mercy follows repentance (Joshua 2). God's desire is that the wicked turn from their sin rather than die (Ezekiel 18:31-32, 33:11)."
http://www.gotquestions.org/Old-Testament-violence.html

From this site

Women could and did serve as Priestesses, could own land, enter into contracts and initiate divorce.

Canaan had more rights than Hebrew women? I mean, I knew Egyptians did, but I took the bible at its word that other people were evil... wait ...

The Canaanites (Phoenicians) developed the first alphabetic writing system, mathematics, were reknowned in the ancient world for their skill in ship building and navigating the seas and have also been cited as the early source or inspiration for the mythology of the Greek gods. The Canaanites sailed across the sea as far away as Spain and as far north as modern-day Cornwall, England, and their cities grew, owing to their prosperous trade, into places of splendour and wealth.

So ... we owe them civilization? Even the Temple couldn't have been built without their input...

prometheus11 · Dec 4, 2015

Scott C. said:
I don't even know where to start. This interpretation is so messed up. I get how someone can come to these false conclusions, but it's an incredibly superficial and inaccurate interpretation. It's foolish.

Your reasoning?

Al Ibn Al Amra · May 25, 2018

They must now continoue or being deprived after being killed , I choose being deprived instead .

"Why is murder wrong?"

Sonofason

Well-Known Member

Sonofason

Well-Known Member

Skwim

Veteran Member

Scott C.

Just one guy

prometheus11

Well-Known Member

Scott C.

Just one guy

Kelly of the Phoenix

Well-Known Member

prometheus11

Well-Known Member

Al Ibn Al Amra

Member