I believe that the body of The Christ IS unified. Unification is what makes a body. In my opinion.
You say the above which implies that after the Reformation unity was lost. Am I reading you right?
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His Eminence, The Pope.
- Thread starter JayToka
- Start date
You say the above which implies that after the Reformation unity was lost. Am I reading you right?
metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
Except he died almost 2000 years ago. So, ...?
metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
I never said, nor do I believe, they can.
You have to believe that he was resurrected to believe that he can speak. I believe it.
True. But, how else can it be except for God's way, the truth, and life?
metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
But my question is exactly how does he supposedly speak today?
Through "free will".
Furchizedek
Member
Exactly right. Even Jesus says that Christianity is doomed.
"And if a house be divided against itself, that house cannot stand." (Mark 3:25)
He speaks by means of The Holy Spirit. John 14:26 John 16:13
Free will isn't wisdom and power.
Furchizedek
Member
I am not attempting to convert anyone to anything. I don't do that. Nor am I selling anything like your church does, intimidating people by telling them that outside of your church there is no salvation. And they state it "as a definitive matter of fact." And yes, your church does say that. And yes, everything I say is what I believe, feel, and think. And your "if you don't stop saying things I don't like I'm going to call the police" attitude is very childish, imo. "You stop that right now or I'll start reporting you." That's essentially what they did to Jesus, 'You stop that right now or we're going to call in the Roman authorities to crucify you and shut you up.' He hath a devil, and is mad; why hear ye him? (John 10:20) Call the authorities.
Furchizedek
Member
Is that for me? Yes, of course I honor that.
Maybe he thinks that talking is praying.
Do you condemn Christians in general praying in public as strongly as you condemn Catholics praying to Mary?
Furchizedek
Member
There was "unity" or the risk of being tortured and burned at the stake if you didn't agree.
Do you mean like this? (Flat out, unilateral, imperious statements from a Catholic, below. Take them to a priest and see if he says any of them are wrong):
If we reject Catholic authority, then we have to reject the Bible, because it is only by Catholic authority that we know that the Bible IS IN FACT the Bible.
"The Catholic Church, [is] the sole authentic interpreter of scripture."
Yes, the scripture can be quoted and understood out of context. It happens all the time. That is why Jesus gave us the Church, the Catholic Church, the Mystical Body of Christ, the Mystical Bride of Christ, the "Pillar and Ground of Truth"
The Catholic Church has the authority to put books in scripture. Nobody else has this authority.
unless we go by what the Catholic Church says, and what it said at the Council of Hippo in 393, how do we know that scripture really is scripture? How do we know Matthew is inspired but not Didache? How do we know 2 Corinthians is inspired and not Shepherd of Hermas? Only because the teaching authority of the Catholic Church says so! The only way you know that the scripture IS REALLY SCRIPTURE is by the very Church teaching authority you reject.
Let us keep in mind that it was the Catholic faith that was once delivered to the saints. Protestantism, with its false doctrines of scripture only, faith only, and once-saved-always-saved, was not invented until the sixteenth century. Outside the Catholic Church there is no salvation.
That's why we need the Church, the Catholic Church, to interpret the scripture. Without the Church, we have spiritual anarchy.
there is no point in believing in the Bible if one does not believe in the Catholic Church since the Church's authority is the only authority we have that establishes the Bible as scripture
If the teachings of scripture seem to be at odds with the teachings of the Church, it means we misunderstand the scripture.
Interpretation of scripture is reserved for the teaching authority of the Church.
Furchizedek
Member
Do you feel you have to ask slanted questions in order to beat me? Are you so desperate? Where did I condemn anyone? Jesus is the one who says that when you pray, you should pray to the Father. Jesus knows (IMO) and Satan knows (IMO) that when you pray to dead human beings, your prayers are wasted and unheard by God the Father. Satan probably loves the fact that NOT ONLY are you praying in vain to dead human beings, but you're also disobeying Jesus as well. It's a double win for Satan when you pray to dead human beings. It seems that Jesus is the one who "condemns" what you apparently want to do no matter what He says. If you don't like what Jesus says, your argument is with Him, not with me. Jesus condemns you (IMO), not me:
"If a man love me, he will keep my words."(John 14:23)
"He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings." (John 14:24)
"But thou, WHEN thou prayest, ...pray to thy Father." (Matthew 6:6)
When Catholics pray to Mary and other dead human beings, they deliberately and willfully do not keep Jesus' sayings, His words. (IMO) And Jesus says they "loveth me not." (IMO)
Not to beat you; to see whether you're acting hypocritically.
... in secret. Don't forget that part.
Edit: and I'm talking about this post: His Eminence, The Pope.
If you don't want to call what you say there "condemning," fine - the term we use doesn't matter. The point I'm trying to get at is whether you take the same attitude toward public prayer that you take toward praying to Mary.
So you don't think that God sees and hears all?
Let's quote the whole thing. I'll bold the part you keep leaving out:
'But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret;"
You think that the whole passage is a command from Jesus, correct?
How about when Protestants pray in legislative assemblies or classrooms? How about when they bow their heads for the invocation at a public event? Are these people deliberately and willfully not keeping Jesus's words? Do they "loveth Jesus not?"
I mean, you're arguing that Christians ought to obey Jesus's instructions in Matthew 6:6 every single time they pray, right?
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Matthew 6:6 Not Mark.
Do you know what to condemn means?
Without the supreme cuteness of error being made to look glorious where would we who disagree be? Bored to death, maybe.
Come again?
You said that he who is posting is condemning something or other. That's why I said that.