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In your belief why God created us
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Woberts
The Perfumed Seneschal
Hmm...... Most suspicious. Well, I just answered the question, so we'll have to see where this goes.
McBell
Resident Sourpuss
I call it "The Divine Bowel Movement Theory"
Woberts
The Perfumed Seneschal
Have you had it peer-reviewed yet?
BSM1
What? Me worry?
I believe that "God" is everything, including this conversation. So, IMHO, God wanted to experience Itself by comparing Herself to something that was "not God". Man was as close as God could get to creating this "not God" entity for comparison (even we have to have a minute spark of God within us to even exist).
It is, of course, unreasonable for humans to ask for a 'reason why' God created us, because God does not anthropomorphize human logic for reasons why this or that. For those that believe God Created all of existence including humans it is a brute fact that this happened.
Nonetheless . . .
The Baha'i view: The existence of our physical existence including humanity is the Creation that reflects the attributes of God, and have existed eternally with God as a shadow reflects the object. For humanity is an evolving physical and spiritual evolution reflecting the attributes of God. There may be many if not an infinite worlds and possible universes in Creation,
Britedream
Active Member
I admire your line of reasoning. The evolution is just a process, but who created the thing that started evolving.
Foxic
Member
Yes.
Fiohatari
New Member
Personally, I believe that is within most to believe there is a superior entity, something almighty that could look over us in moments of despair, the probability of a miracle when we are hopeless (which at some point brings up the question os "is human kind the product of god? Or is it the other way around?"). As a deist, the way I see god (because every deist has his/her own definition of a god) is as an entity that created the universe and then just waited for life to take its course (big bang, earth, evolution).
Phantasman
Well-Known Member
My answer would be that the false god, who is ignorant of the perfect Father, created what he thought was the an image of the Father as a light he could have control over. The Demiurge's imperfect universe is reflected in the imperfect human made by the imperfect (devil) who see's himself as god with no one above him.
The risen Jesus tells John:
"And he said to the authorities which attend him, 'Come, let us create a man according to the image of God and according to our likeness, that his image may become a light for us.' And they created by means of their respective powers in correspondence with the characteristics which were given. And each authority supplied a characteristic in the form of the image which he had seen in its natural (form). He created a being according to the likeness of the first, perfect Man. And they said, 'Let us call him Adam, that his name may become a power of light for us.'- Apocryphon of John
When man received his spirit (from transgression), it was a gift from the Father to see the error of the false god, and to seek the heavenly perfection of the Father (true God).
The false god is jealous, and wants man to follow him. The Father is love which isn't jealous of anything, since he is perfect. We were given the choice what to follow to continue to either keep our gift of awareness, or to lose it through ignorance of (spiritual) perfection.
Matthew:
48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.
The 3 books I have found for the best answers to how and why the beginning came about, is the Apocryphon of John, the Gospel of Truth and the Sophia of Jesus Christ. They get very in depth of spiritual knowledge of Christ (gnosis) answering questions the Bible doesn't.
I like the perspective image they produce.
The risen Jesus tells John:
"And he said to the authorities which attend him, 'Come, let us create a man according to the image of God and according to our likeness, that his image may become a light for us.' And they created by means of their respective powers in correspondence with the characteristics which were given. And each authority supplied a characteristic in the form of the image which he had seen in its natural (form). He created a being according to the likeness of the first, perfect Man. And they said, 'Let us call him Adam, that his name may become a power of light for us.'- Apocryphon of John
When man received his spirit (from transgression), it was a gift from the Father to see the error of the false god, and to seek the heavenly perfection of the Father (true God).
The false god is jealous, and wants man to follow him. The Father is love which isn't jealous of anything, since he is perfect. We were given the choice what to follow to continue to either keep our gift of awareness, or to lose it through ignorance of (spiritual) perfection.
Matthew:
48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.
The 3 books I have found for the best answers to how and why the beginning came about, is the Apocryphon of John, the Gospel of Truth and the Sophia of Jesus Christ. They get very in depth of spiritual knowledge of Christ (gnosis) answering questions the Bible doesn't.
I like the perspective image they produce.
McBell
Resident Sourpuss
Buddha Dharma
Dharma Practitioner
This is what Buddhism shares in common with most gnostic worldviews. The view of this world as an entrapping web of illusions and limitations, so only capable of imperfection.
There is a shared view that a being like the Buddha, or in your case Christ- came from something beyond this system to liberate beings. Buddhists say the unconstructed and leave it at that.
In the Buddhist understanding though, the deity beings that contributed to this system's existence and suffering might not be malevolent, so much as imperfect in their own abilities. In Buddhism, no being is intentionally malevolent- except that ignorance misleads it.
Buddhists don't typically see Brahma as malevolent. Just limited. Buddhists have tended to see deities as being overall benevolent- excepting a slim few. They generally feel pity for lesser lifeforms and WANT to help.
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Phantasman
Well-Known Member
That's interesting. I have had better communications with Buddhists than orthodox Christians. I can see why, from what you say. More in common, I guess. I think we came together a week or so about another belief that I quoted the Gospel of Philip, and it sounded a lot like Buddha's teachings as well.
Buddha Dharma
Dharma Practitioner
The Gospel of Phillip agrees with Buddhists that rebirth into the world of forms happens due to ignorance, and that the one from beyond the world of forms can appear as any being within it. Such as Phillip saying Christ has appeared as a child, a beautiful woman, an old man, etc.
In Buddhism, there are awakened Buddhas in most realms of existence. There have been animal Buddhas for example. There are deities that in right time awaken as Buddhas, like the goddess Tara. The Buddha can appear in any form and transcends them all.
The Buddha even has spontaneous generation as Dharma bodies like Amida and Vairocana, and the true body of every Buddha is a Dharma body. Shakyamuni has become a Cosmic Dharma body after transcending Samsara. He can employ Indra's Vajra as a divine weapon and has a Mantra.
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Scott C.
Just one guy
I have to quote scripture to express my belief. I believe God said:
"For this is my work and my glory to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man." (Pearl of Great Price)
"Adam fell that men might be and men are that they might have joy." (Book of Mormon)
I believe God gives us important gimpses into the purpose of our existence, but ultimately we probably can't fully understand until we go home to meet God. The first quote says that God's work and glory are to help us have eternal life. That's a deep thought. The other quote says that the purpose of the Fall and our life on earth is to "have joy". So it appears to be in God's nature, even the source of his glory and joy, to bring about our eternal life and to otherwise lead mankind to joy on earth and in the next life.
Cary Cook
Member
Assuming that you are asking why God created us, then IF we are created by a God, I think he is testing his ability to create increasingly complex and interesting things without having them self-destruct.
Also, you HAVE to trust your mind; you have no choice.
Anything that appears to be inspiration may not be inspiration.
Phantasman
Well-Known Member
It appears the Gospel of Thomas says something of the same about spirit not being of gender.
(114) Simon Peter said to him, "Let Mary leave us, for women are not worthy of life."
Jesus said, "I myself shall lead her in order to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every woman who will make herself male will enter the kingdom of heaven."
Though the orthodox catholic ideology maintained the patriarchy image of Christs teachings, the gnostics saw no difference in male female fleshly vessels.
I believe your mention of Christ as appearing (to John) as a multiple image came from the Apocryphon of John and not Philip.
"Straightway, while I was contemplating these things, behold, the heavens opened and the whole creation which is below heaven shone, and the world was shaken. I was afraid, and behold I saw in the light a youth who stood by me. While I looked at him, he became like an old man. And he changed his likeness (again), becoming like a servant. There was not a plurality before me, but there was a likeness with multiple forms in the light, and the likenesses appeared through each other, and the likeness had three forms.
He said to me, "John, John, why do you doubt, or why are you afraid? You are not unfamiliar with this image, are you? - that is, do not be timid! - I am the one who is with you (pl.) always. I am the Father, I am the Mother, I am the Son. I am the undefiled and incorruptible one. Now I have come to teach you what is and what was and what will come to pass, that you may know the things which are not revealed and those which are revealed, and to teach you concerning the unwavering race of the perfect Man. Now, therefore, lift up your face, that you may receive the things that I shall teach you today, and may tell them to your fellow spirits who are from the unwavering race of the perfect Man."- Apocryphon of John
This message was to reveal Father (God), Mother (Holy Spirit) and Christ (Son). It renounces the Trinity idea more as God, Goddess, perfect Man. The next verse has Jesus saying that the Monad is a monarchy, as the Father God is before all.
Don't know how Buddhists compare, but the commonality may exist in a depth we may not see spiritually.
dianaiad
Well-Known Member
uhm.....
While you are correct and Mormonism does encourage, even emphasize, genealogy and temple work, and we do hold to the 'Families can be forever" idea, your portrayal of this as the sole reason for our creation is a little....
What IS the fallacy being committed when someone focuses in on a very small part of something, and claims that this small bit is representative of the whole? Is that a 'strawman?"
I'm not sure.
At any rate, your statement is NOT why Mormons believe that we were created. It's a part of what we are supposed to DO while we are here, but it's not why we were created. To say so is like saying that the reason for water is to make ice for ice hockey rinks. While one requires water for this, and while ice hockey rinks are good things to have (well, some people think so, anyway) I don't think anybody can say that ice hockey rinks are the purpose of water.
...........and Temple work, while we think it important, is NOT the purpose behind our creation.
In fact, to see what Mormons REALLY believe about why God created us, see Scott's post, above.
In my belief, "created" isn't a verb.
Grasscutter
New Member
A god did not create anything!, man created god in an attempt to control and manipulate the masses, and they did a fairly good job of it for thousands of years!. However nowadays it takes a lot to fool the masses, hence the fall in believers, ALL religions are for the weak of mind and people that can't stand on their own two feet!!. Just my honest opinion!!.