Question about Noah's ark

Enoch07 · Jan 31, 2018

People that take advantage of this logical fallacy often forget one simple thing.

During the time of Noah's flood the known world at the time was much smaller than it is today.

It is your own logical fallacy that you think a roughly bronze age(?) man had knowledge of the entire planet as we know it today. When at the time the Earth was still thought of as flat and they had no knowledge of Antarctica, Australia, or the Americas and more.

Also dinosaurs went extinct long before this time. So asking if dinosaurs was on the ark is nonsensical and asinine. Along with kangaroos, and polar bears which were not even known at the time by middle eastern people, because these continents, and the animals in them, had not been discovered yet.

Grandliseur · Jan 31, 2018

Aldrnari said:
Did you know vampires are also a myth consistent all over the globe, spanning almost all cultures from ancient to modern times? Should we assume they are representative of reality, too?

I have read my Bible since I could read. Please let me know where in the Bible it mentions vampires.
At least I have enough evidence archaeological and otherwise to be satisfied that God exists, that He can do anything He wants. If you want to entertain the idea that God exists for a moment, created this entire universe, under that scenario, are you going to tell me that he could not move animals from extreme earthly distances to where he might desire them?

Thus, we are at the divide again between the atheist and the theist, specifically the Bible believer. I like reading fiction, SciFi and Fantasy in my old age, yet, I can still keep our reality and stories apart. The question then is what our reality is. Atheist think a 'chaos god' created all things, just nothing exploded, singularity = black hole exploded (they don't have a habit of exploding), and that the resulting chaotic explosion created order from chaos, life from non life. I am an unbeliever in this no matter how many billion of years you give it. To me this story is the worst SciFi I have ever heard.

I believe in ID.

You might perhaps believe in vampires, evolution permits their 'creation'. My Creator would not create that kind of humanoids, though some insects are worse than vamps.

Grandliseur · Jan 31, 2018

England my lionheart said:
Australia is obviously an island, kangaroos can swim but i doubt that far, koala bears are one of the slowest animals in the worldw

That is exactly why God had to move animals from A. to B.
The other problem is that none knows how the pre-deluge world looked. No mountain higher than about 2 miles existed, so, was the earth a kind of Pangea. Did you know that subtropical plants have been found in the arctic and antarctic, even animals of such places in the North where today they could not exist? The earth used to be very different from now.

England my lionheart · Jan 31, 2018

Enoch07 said:
People that take advantage of this logical fallacy often forget one simple thing.

During the time of Noah's flood the known world at the time was much smaller than it is today.

It is your own logical fallacy that you think a roughly bronze age(?) man had knowledge of the entire planet as we know it today. When at the time the Earth was still thought of as flat and they had no knowledge of Antarctica, Australia, or the Americas and more.

Also dinosaurs went extinct long before this time. So asking if dinosaurs was on the ark is nonsensical and asinine. Along with kangaroos, and polar bears which were not even known at the time by middle eastern people, because these continents, and the animals in them, had not been discovered yet.

Then how did they survive the flood if they weren't on the ark?.

Enoch07 · Jan 31, 2018

England my lionheart said:
Then how did they survive the flood if they weren't on the ark?.

How did who or what survive?

JoshuaTree · Jan 31, 2018

Grandliseur said:
I have read my Bible since I could read. Please let me know where in the Bible it mentions vampires.
At least I have enough evidence archaeological and otherwise to be satisfied that God exists, that He can do anything He wants. If you want to entertain the idea that God exists for a moment, created this entire universe, under that scenario, are you going to tell me that he could not move animals from extreme earthly distances to where he might desire them?

Thus, we are at the divide again between the atheist and the theist, specifically the Bible believer. I like reading fiction, SciFi and Fantasy in my old age, yet, I can still keep our reality and stories apart. The question then is what our reality is. Atheist think a 'chaos god' created all things, just nothing exploded, singularity = black hole exploded (they don't have a habit of exploding), and that the resulting chaotic explosion created order from chaos, life from non life. I am an unbeliever in this no matter how many billion of years you give it. To me this story is the worst SciFi I have ever heard.

I believe in ID.

You might perhaps believe in vampires, evolution permits their 'creation'. My Creator would not create that kind of humanoids, though some insects are worse than vamps.

Wasn't Lillith considerd a vampire?

Grandliseur · Jan 31, 2018

JoshuaTree said:
Wasn't Lillith considerd a vampire?

I wonder who cooked her up. She is not in the Bible.
I have read about her before, but forget what was said. If it isn't in the Bible, I don't pay much attention to the stories, and I don't even like Bible literature as a rule, though, some Bible references are good.

Skwim · Jan 31, 2018

Grandliseur said:
I wonder who cooked her up. She is not in the Bible.

Isaiah 34:14 (NRSV)
"Wildcats shall meet with hyenas, goat-demons shall call to each other; there too Lilith shall repose, and find a place to rest."

.

Grandliseur · Jan 31, 2018

Skwim said:
Isaiah 34:14 (NRSV)
"Wildcats shall meet with hyenas, goat-demons shall call to each other; there too Lilith shall repose, and find a place to rest."

.

That's just funny:

14 And wild animals shall meet with hyenas;
the wild goat shall cry to his fellow;
indeed, there the night bird settles
and finds for herself a resting place.
ESV
14 The wild beasts of the desert shall also meet with the wild beasts of the island, and the satyr shall cry to his fellow; the screech owl <03917> also shall rest there, and find for herself a place of rest. KJV

Strong's: 03917:
3917 liyliyth lee-leeth' from 3915; a night spectre:--screech owl. see HEBREW for 03915

14 And met have Ziim with Aiim, And the goat for its companion calleth, Only there rested hath the night-owl, And hath found for herself a place of rest. YLT

Hebrew translation: source: Isaiah 34 - Hebrew English Translation Massoretic Text MT Interlinear Holy Name King James Version KJV Strong's Concordance

Online Parallel Bible Study
34:14 The wild beasts of the desert 6728 shall also meet 6298 z8804 with x854 the wild beasts of the island, 338 and the satyr 8163 shall cry 7121 z8799 to x5921 his fellow; 7453 the screech owl 3917 also x389 shall rest 7280 z8689 there, x8033 and find 4672 z8804 for herself a place of rest. 4494

Thanks for the laugh. I guess Adam's first wife was a bird with wings. Go figure ! And, still alive in Isaiah's time.

Women, you can live without them and can't live with them.

(I am going to get pummeled) Get a bird, perhaps a parrot.

England my lionheart · Jan 31, 2018

Enoch07 said:
How did who or what survive?

The animals that nobody apparently knew about

Skwim · Jan 31, 2018

Lexicon :: Strong's H3917 - liyliyth

לִילִית

Transliteration: liyliyth
Pronunciation: lē·lēth'
Part of Speech: feminine noun
Root Word (Etymology): From לַיִל

Outline of Biblical Usage
"Lilith", name of a female goddess known as a night demon who haunts the desolate places of Edom

.

Enoch07 · Jan 31, 2018

England my lionheart said:
The animals that nobody apparently knew about

Kangaroos and Polar bears? They survived because the entire globe did not flood.

To Noah and the people in the surrounding area it seemed to them the whole world was flooded. Thats because the known world at the time was smaller than as we know it to be today. Which is why they said that the world flooded. Because the world they knew was actually not very large to begin with.

An example:

If you lived on an island your whole life. Knew nothing of the rest of the world. And the volcano erupted or a tsunami hit. You would think the entire world was ending as well. Because as far as you know everything and everyone is gone. This is what Noah experienced and as far as him and his family was concerned the whole world had been flooded.

I think the the flood could have took place in an area about the size of Texas, maybe a bit bigger. Noah only had local wildlife from the area which was to be flooded. Which is an obtainable goal realistically.

There was no need to pack a ton of food as humans and animals can go long periods of time without food (up to 30ish days), the only problem would have been water. Which most creatures can't go more than a few days without water. Since fresh water rained down for 40 days and nights, it's just a matter of collecting it to ration out to the animals, also a realistic goal to achieve.

England my lionheart · Jan 31, 2018

Enoch07 said:
Kangaroos and Polar bears? They survived because the entire globe did not flood.

To Noah and the people in the surrounding area it seemed to them the whole world was flooded. Thats because the known world at the time was smaller than as we know it to be today. Which is why they said that the world flooded. Because the world they knew was actually not very large to begin with.

An example:

If you lived on an island your whole life. Knew nothing of the rest of the world. And the volcano erupted or a tsunami hit. You would think the entire world was ending as well. Because as far as you know everything and everyone is gone. This is what Noah experienced and as far as him and his family was concerned the whole world had been flooded.

I think the the flood could have took place in an area about the size of Texas, maybe a bit bigger. Noah only had local wildlife from the area which was to be flooded. Which is an obtainable goal realistically.

There was no need to pack a ton of food as humans and animals can go long periods of time without food (up to 30ish days), the only problem would have been water. Which most creatures can't go more than a few days without water. Since fresh water rained down for 40 days and nights, it's just a matter of collecting it to ration out to the animals, also a realistic goal to achieve.

Is that whatwthe bible says?

ADigitalArtist · Jan 31, 2018

Enoch07 said:
People that take advantage of this logical fallacy often forget one simple thing.

During the time of Noah's flood the known world at the time was much smaller than it is today.

It is your own logical fallacy that you think a roughly bronze age(?) man had knowledge of the entire planet as we know it today. When at the time the Earth was still thought of as flat and they had no knowledge of Antarctica, Australia, or the Americas and more.

Also dinosaurs went extinct long before this time. So asking if dinosaurs was on the ark is nonsensical and asinine. Along with kangaroos, and polar bears which were not even known at the time by middle eastern people, because these continents, and the animals in them, had not been discovered yet.

If it were just a local flood Mt Ararat would have been clearly visible and the released birds would have beelined for it. A local flood isn't unbelievable, but the story as written is.

Enoch07 · Jan 31, 2018

England my lionheart said:
Is that whatwthe bible says?

You gonna have to be more specific. Vague questions are about useless.

Enoch07 · Jan 31, 2018

ADigitalArtist said:
If it were just a local flood Mt Ararat would have been clearly visible and the released birds would have beelined for it. A local flood isn't unbelievable, but the story as written is.

Your overlooking a simple fact though. It is possible it was visible, but just not seen. With heavy rain fall like described in the flood of Noah. You would not have more than a couple of hundred yards of visibility. I feel like that even is optimistic, they probably had less visibility. Even if the Mountain was very close to them they would not been able to see it, for the rain fall/fog that usually accompanies heavy rains.

England my lionheart · Feb 1, 2018

Enoch07 said:
You gonna have to be more specific. Vague questions are about useless.

Ok what evidence is there for a flood at the time of noah and when did this happen, how many years ago.

England my lionheart · Feb 1, 2018

Grandliseur said:
That is exactly why God had to move animals from A. to B.
The other problem is that none knows how the pre-deluge world looked. No mountain higher than about 2 miles existed, so, was the earth a kind of Pangea. Die you know that subtropical plants have been found in the arctic and antarctic, even animals of such places in the North where today they could not exist? The earth used to be very different from now.

But when did this happen and what evidence supports this

Skwim · Feb 1, 2018

Enoch07 said:
There was no need to pack a ton of food as humans and animals can go long periods of time without food (up to 30ish days), the only problem would have been water. Which most creatures can't go more than a few days without water. Since fresh water rained down for 40 days and nights, it's just a matter of collecting it to ration out to the animals, also a realistic goal to achieve.

The length the flood is calculated to have lasted from 365 -371 days. That's one heck of a lot of food.

"In days, how long was the Flood? Genesis 7:11 and Genesis 8:14 give the exact dates of the beginning and end of the Flood, revealing an elapsed time of 12 months and 10 or 11 days, depending upon how one might count the first and last days."
source

And consider

"Louisiana State University and the Humane Society of the United States agree that a horse needs to eat 1 to 2 percent of his body weight in roughage every day. If your horse has free access to plenty of grass, then grass can serve as his forage. If your horse has limited grass then you must make sure his diet is supplemented with hay. The average 1000 pound horse must eat approximately 10 to 20 pounds of hay every day according to LSU.
source

Which mean a pair of horse will need between 7,000 and 14,000 lbs for the trip. At 50lbs per bale, that's 140 to 280 bales of hay, which averages out to 210 bales for the two horses.

Here's what 200 bales of hay looks like. Takes up quite a bit of room. And this is food just for the horses.

.

Enoch07 · Feb 1, 2018

England my lionheart said:
Ok what evidence is there for a flood at the time of noah and when did this happen, how many years ago.

I am not here to prove it happened.

I am just arguing that it could have happened as I stated.

Question about Noah's ark

It's all a sick freaking joke.

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Rockerjahili Rebel

It's all a sick freaking joke.

Flowers are red?

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Veteran Member

Well-Known Member

Rockerjahili Rebel

Veteran Member

It's all a sick freaking joke.

Rockerjahili Rebel

Veteran Member

It's all a sick freaking joke.

It's all a sick freaking joke.

Rockerjahili Rebel

Rockerjahili Rebel

Veteran Member

It's all a sick freaking joke.