The Spirit man has always existed with God.
Since Adam was Not a spirit man but formed from the dust of the ground, then Adam did Not always exist with God.
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
The Spirit man has always existed with God.
Since Adam was Not a spirit man but formed from the dust of the ground, then Adam did Not always exist with God.
@Faithofchristian There is no creating after the 7th day. All the creating had ceased.
Where do you find God creating anything after the 7th day in scripture, when there is no indication of the 7th day even ending?
If humans already existed before Adam and Eve, why is Eve called “the mother of everyone living”? Your suggestion that there were humans before Adam has no support in scripture.
Each “day” ended with a declaration from God that he was satisfied with what he had accomplished. There is no declaration for the 7th day because it has not yet concluded. The destruction of the wicked, the cleansing of this earth of all wickedness, and the abyssing of Satan and his demons for the full 1,000 year reign of God’s Kingdom.....and then one final test will bring the 7th day to its end. Only after Satan and all who followed him are destroyed forever, and God is re-established as man’s rightful Sovereign will we go back to the conditions that Adam and his wife originally enjoyed in Eden......paradise will be restored earthwide and God’s will done “on earth as it is in heaven”.
Unless you have the full picture of what God has done, what he is doing now, and what he has planned for the future, nothing makes sense. Your scenario does not fit the Bible’s narrative at all.
So you say, The body of flesh was formed from the dust of the earth.
But the spirit which is in the body of Adam, God put the spirit in the body of Adam
That means, Adam has always been with God.
In the English language the word ' spirit ' has many meanings.
We hear of 'football spirit' such as a pep rally is designed to create a lively atmosphere, make people more lively.
A high-spirited horse means he is very lively. Not meaning that the horse was once a spirit animal.
I find it of interest that Deuteronomy 4:32 teaches us where Adam was created.
God ' created ' man upon the Earth. Adam was Not first created in Heaven, but right here on Earth.
God's spirit as per Psalms 104:30 was involved in the process.
Even God's spirit is neuter according to Numbers 11:17; Numbers 11:25 neuter as the word 'it'.
God and Jesus are always in the masculine gender, but God's spirit is a neuter.
Just as in English we speak of a car or a ship as a 'she ' although they are always neuter as 'it'.
The Greek/English Interlinear at Romans 8:16; Romans 8:26 has God's spirit as neuter ' itself '.
Older KJV Bibles use the neuter, but newer versions took the liberty to change itself to himself.
When we read of one's spirit returning to God that is in the sense of a foreclosed house returning to the owner.
The house does Not literally move or go anywhere, but the possession of the house goes back to the owner.
So, one's life spirit returns to God in that any future life prospect now lies in God's safe hands.
The 'spirit of life' will reside, so to speak, with resurrected ones after they are resurrected.
Please notice where God's spirit was located at Job 27:3____________________
In the Strong's Concordance of the Hebrew Language page 7307, you'll find the Hebrew word ( Ruwach ) which being Translated into English language meaning Air, Soul, Spirit. The bible was written in Hebrew and Greek language.
Therefore the Hebrew word ( Ruwach ) being Translated into English language simply means = Air, Soul, Spirit.
.
No, no. Ruach is wind or spirit, nephesh is soul. Two totally different words.
Are you freaking kidding me,
As to how your explanation of the Spirit, A spirited horse, a spirited football team. Now that's amazing.You really got to be kidding right.
Upon reading the Bible you have to use the correct translation's of Hebrew and Greek language into English.
You just can not go pick out of the English language and apply it to the bible, When the bible was written in the Hebrew and Greek language,
God breathed into Adam's nostrils the breath of life. Genesis 2:7
Well you said it, So Ruwach also means Spirit.
Maybe you should go to the Strong's Concordance of the bible, for the Hebrew Translation page 7307, which gives the Translation for the Hebrew word Ruwach as being Air, Soul and Spirit.
You left out the part where they continued..."what will be the sign of your "presence" (parousia does not mean "coming") and the conclusion of the age?"
This prophesy had a much wider application than just the destruction of Jerusalem and its temple. This takes us to the future return of Christ.
I find the first or ' minor ' fufillment of Matthew 24 and Luke 21 happened in the year 70 when the Roman armies destroyed un-faithful Jerusalem.
The second or 'MAJOR' fulfillment is for our day or time frame - Revelation 24:21-22; Revelation 19:14-16.
I believe the poster did not speak of those signs. Mat 24 follows a very neat logical pattern. Three questions are asked and they are answered in order.
The time of his "presence" and the time of his "manifestation" are two separate events.
That is extremely confusing.
Since these are "...two separate events", perhaps you could explain to FOC and the rest of us how Jesus had one without the other..."presence" without manifestation and "manifestation" without a presence.
That is extremely confusing.
Since these are "...two separate events", perhaps you could explain to FOC and the rest of us how Jesus had one without the other..."presence" without manifestation and "manifestation" without a presence.
Its quite easy. Jesus "presence" precedes his "coming".
When Jesus was enthroned in heaven, only then did he become King of God's kingdom. (Daniel 7:13-14)
The features of the sign that he gave his disciples to identify the fact that he was ruling, were not something that appeared all at once, but those things identified a time period when all of these features would indicate that he was "present" and ruling "in the midst of his enemies" as King David foretold. (Psalm 110:1-2) It did not mean peace for the earth but "woe".
Throughout the "last days" people would see all of the things Jesus mentioned. ( 1 Timothy 3:1-5) But only after the "great tribulation" would people "see" the manifestation of Jesus "coming on the clouds with power and great glory". (Matthew 24:29-31) By the time people see Jesus, it means that it is too late to jump on the bandwagon. Judgment will be swift.
So his "presence" (parousia) precedes his coming so that all the features of the sign can be discerned by those who accept the message that all Christians were told to preach "in all the inhabited earth for a witness to all the nations" before God brings this system of things crashing down. (Matthew 24:14; Daniel 2:44)
That is extremely confusing.
Since these are "...two separate events", perhaps you could explain to FOC and the rest of us how Jesus had one without the other..."presence" without manifestation and "manifestation" without a presence.
I'm sure you are Not alone in finding some things confusing.
See if this might help: At Ephesians 5:23 it says Christ is the head of the church ( aka congregation ).
We don't see Christ, yet as head of the congregation the 'invisible Christ' keeps it in its proper place.
Jesus sees to it that Matthew 24:14; Matthew 28:18-20; Acts 1:8 is being carried out today as written.
So, although Jesus is in heaven ( Hebrews 9:24) his 'presence', so to speak, is felt.
Now, on the other hand, we are all invited to pray the invitation of Revelation 22:20 for Jesus to come.
Come and do what? Come and usher in Peace on Earth among persons of goodwill.
So, as Jesus is now head of the Christian congregation ( 1 Corinthians 2:16; 1 Corinthians 11:3) Jesus will also show himself to be King of God's kingdom government of Daniel 2:44. The powerful ' words ' from Jesus' mouth will bring an end to wickedness on Earth as per Isaiah 11:3-4; Revelation 19:14-16.
Okay, I can see that....
That’s the part that’s still confusing.
If his presence is, as you say, “is felt” than we have a manifestation of his presence. Yet Deeje (and I am assuming your Organization since you haven’t disagreed with her) claims Chirst's "presence" and "manifestation" are two separate events, and that this manifestation doesn’t happen until decades after Jesus's presence in 1914.
I just don’t see how that’s possible… Jesus having “presence” without any “manifestation” of this “presence” whatsoever. Without manifestation, there are absolutely no signs of his presence to look for. If there are signs to look for, then obviously there has been a manifestation of his presence.
Your organization states there were signs of Jesus’s presence, or Parousia, which they believe occurred in 1914. So if there were signs of his presence in 1914 his presence was manifest. Yet your Organization states his manifestation hasn’t happened yet and won’t happen until some unknown time into the future, which makes it all the more confusing.
If the manifestation hasn’t occurred then the presence could not have occurred in 1914. But if the presence has occurred then his presence must have been made manifest in some way, yet you claim the manifestation of his presence hasn’t occurred yet.
Once Jesus showed himself we definitely have a manifestation whose presence is felt as wickedness is brought to an end. So we have a manifestation and presence… they are one with the other as opposed to one without the other.
I still don’t see how anyone can reasonably view them as two different events separated by decades of time, nor do I see how you can claim that:
1. Jesus's "presence" occurred in 1914In any event I do thank you for your response.
2. His "presence" was manifest through signs in 1914 but
3. There was no "manifestation" with his "presence" because they are two separate events and
4. Any "manifestation" of his "presence"... which was made manifest through signs in 1914... won't occur until some time in the future.
.... and thank you for your reply.
So, Jesus although an invisible spirit person guides or directs the Christian congregation today though unseen.
We know as John 14:19 says the world will behold Jesus No more. Not literally see Jesus any more.
These last days of badness (as described at 2 Timothy 3) I find linked in connection to the events or features of the composite sign Jesus gave us in Matthew chapter 24 and Luke chapter 21's MAJOR fulfillment part.
So, first we have Jesus as head of the Christian congregation in the 1st century, and is Now.
hen, (and I think Jesus referred to Daniel) at Daniel 7:13 where we read about a future coming time of Jesus as ' Son of man ' (Revelation 1:7; Psalms 72:4-8 ). I think Jesus' reference to Daniel is found at Matthew 26:63-64.
Side note: I notice at Matthew 26:24 Jesus is also there now referred to as ' Son of man '.
Now, going past the starting time of Matthew 24:8 (start time of global trouble around WWI ) to the future 'Son of man ' time of Matthew 24:37-39 ties in with Jesus as being ' Son of man ' at the time of Matthew 25:31 (as also noted time frame at Matthew 16:27). A coming 'time of separation' to take place on Earth.
So, the coming ' time of Matthew 25:31-33,37,40 ' to take place on Earth is still future after the political turns on the religious world. That time frame has Not yet manifested itself. Jesus' followers still look for Matthew 25:31-33 to manifest itself, and then the great tribulation time of Revelation 7:14 to manifest itself, before Jesus takes the action as worded at Isaiah 11:3-4; Revelation 19:14-16 when the executional words from Jesus' mouth will rid the Earth of wickedness before the manifestation of Jesus' 1,000-year governmental rule begins or starts to govern over Earth.